ninja BiS stats

which stats would be better?

542 acc(lava toad legs)
517 crit
386 det
356 skillspeed

or

535 acc(black truffle)
498 crit
366 det
411 skillspeed

The first one. Pretty obvious and by a big margin.

I agree but only ask because I asked a friend what his BiS list is and his has the second set of stats

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Originally Posted by Gh0st_Pr0digy

I agree but only ask because I asked a friend what his BiS list is and his has the second set of stats

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Hm... would like to hear his reasons then. Did he tell you why he thinks his BiS is better than yours?

Balance to where skill speed makes your gcd 1.98 to 1.99 seconds. Max det > crit and try to get just the amount of acc you need for end game. If sub out account pieces when it's not needed with det and crit.

I didn't tell him mine. I just asked him to see his So I could see what poetic pieces I needed to get still then I just changed like 2 pieces of gear around. Wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something about the skill speed

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Originally Posted by MrCookTM

The first one. Pretty obvious and by a big margin.

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By a big margin? Actually, it's rather negligible. Contrary to what those numbers look like, Build 2 contributes a whopping 0.092 more effective DEX than Build 1. This is assuming the weights currently being used by Ariyala's calculators of Det=0.332 and Crit/Speed=0.187. Remember that the first 341 points of Crit/Speed don't count, and neither do the first 202 points of Det.

So... why would that be? Det's the best, right? It's because Build 2 lacks 20 Det but has almost 40 of the other two added. Stats have a funny way of not really mattering that much as long as you don't overspend on Accuracy.

To the OP, just make sure you have your Accuracy and that you don't have so much Skill Speed that your TP no longer exists. Do that, and the other stats will be a-okay.

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Originally Posted by Donjo

By a big margin? Actually, it's rather negligible. Contrary to what those numbers look like, Build 2 contributes a whopping 0.092 more effective DEX than Build 1. This is assuming the weights currently being used by Ariyala's calculators of Det=0.332 and Crit/Speed=0.187. Remember that the first 341 points of Crit/Speed don't count, and neither do the first 202 points of Det.

So... why would that be? Det's the best, right? It's because Build 2 lacks 20 Det but has almost 40 of the other two added. Stats have a funny way of not really mattering that much as long as you don't overspend on Accuracy.

To the OP, just make sure you have your Accuracy and that you don't have so much Skill Speed that your TP no longer exists. Do that, and the other stats will be a-okay.

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The stat weights used by Ariyala still are the monk ones and aren't copy/paste'able to nin. Crit in general is weighted higher than skillspeed because of how the stat scales, monk is an exception for this because of bootshine autocrit and traited inner release, so crit is rated lower. Nin doesn't have bootshine and traited inner release, thus crit has to be more weighted in the way it is for other jobs, which is way closer to the actual stat weight of det, while skillspeed is still as low as for every other melee class.

Big margin was an overstatement, but still set one is better and it's pretty clear by just taking one quick look at it.

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Originally Posted by MrCookTM

The stat weights used by Ariyala still are the monk ones and aren't copy/paste'able to nin. Crit in general is weighted higher than skillspeed because of how the stat scales, monk is an exception for this because of bootshine autocrit and traited inner release, so crit is rated lower. Nin doesn't have bootshine and traited inner release, thus crit has to be more weighted in the way it is for other jobs, which is way closer to the actual stat weight of det, while skillspeed is still as low as for every other melee class.

Big margin was an overstatement, but still set one is better and it's pretty clear by just taking one quick look at it.

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Okay, let's play with the numbers then. Other classes have between 0.2 and 0.250 for their crit rate, excluding Bard and BLM who have crit cased procs. Let's adjust our fake weights. Det is probably still the best. We'll leave Skill Speed alone and then highball Crit.

Crit = 0.250
Det = 0.332
Speed = 0.187

Build 1 is...
+176 Crit
+184 Det
+15 Speed

This equals approximately 107.893 effective DEX

Build 2 is...
+157 Crit
+164 Det
+70 Speed

This equals approximately 106.788 effective DEX

Now Build 1 has 1.105 DEX over Build 2. That's still less than a 1% advantage. That's still negligible.

Let's have a little more fun. What if I were to stack Skill Speed to its maximum while avoiding Determination? The theoretical least optimum build? These numbers are using Sauteed Coeurl

535 Acc
+188 Crit
+37 Det
+222 Speed

Ah, yes. These truly are the kinds of numbers that min maxers faint over. Let's see what it adds up to!

We get a total of 100.798 effective DEX. That's right. A mere 7.095 DEX less than the lauded BiS. Of course, this build would really have to worry about TP, but they aren't wanting for damage while there is TP in that bar.

So... I hope this makes it more clear just how little Secondary Stats truly matter. As long as you don't have wasted Accuracy, you'll have a set of stats that will be capable of doing any content no matter what gear you choose!

not sure if you realize it op, but the first build probably is missing 2 dex from using ironworks ring vs dreadywrm. putting in those numbers in ariyala gives me the exact same stats, and the build uses 2x ironworks ring (regular and aug)

honestly think nin feels most comfortable around 387-440 skill speed depending on your average mudra speed. if it's too low and your mudra speed is less than stellar, having dots fall off for a tick is likely

oh yea i did forget about that as i had just woke up when posted. i decided i was gonna go for the one with more skill speed, i appreciate the feedback/comments