Turn 12 and 13 bug?

So remember how in Turn 7 the adds would spawn and no matter how fast you grab them they would run halfway across the map? Well the same thing is happening in 12 and 13, the Bennus in 12 and the Scourges in 13 ( we have only been to the third one so far) even when hit the instant they are targetable run off and sometimes even hit a healer.

Please fix this as you did with Turn 7 please! It is really annoying and I'm not sure how you missed that these adds act the same as 7 did before it was fixed. Thank you.

That doesn't happen in T12 for myself unless I am just slow to pick up the adds.

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Originally Posted by Barboron

That doesn't happen in T12 for myself unless I am just slow to pick up the adds.

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This is true for me as well. My whm even has Med2 and regen up when they spawn.

it happen sometime with my group.
our usual suspect is EOS.
sometime WHM might pull it if he/she just finish casting big AOE heal right when add spawn.

The point I'm making is that even after I get aggro on them because they first had aggro on a healer they continue to them even though I have hate. That's fine if your healers just happen to not have healed or whatever, but it is the same concept as what was going on in Turn 7 which they acknowledged and patched.

It's basically an issue where the first person to get hate on a freshly spawned enemy will have that enemy run over to them, smack them once, then run back to the tank. If you hit it while it's still buffering (aka before it becomes ~active~) then it won't run over to the healers. Haven't actually tested it, but much like the dragons in T5, if you pop a CD it generates a small amount of hate - so potentially a solution is to pop a CD as it spawns and then use your combo'd Savage/Skull Sunder/etc. Of course this won't take hate over Med 2 ticks, but it will give you initial aggro if nothing happened before the CD is popped which should keep it in place. If not, I suppose it's just about not healing until after the add spawns... not the best solution but could be the only option.

How are you pulling hate on adds though?

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Originally Posted by Makado

The point I'm making is that even after I get aggro on them because they first had aggro on a healer they continue to them even though I have hate. That's fine if your healers just happen to not have healed or whatever, but it is the same concept as what was going on in Turn 7 which they acknowledged and patched.

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I don't remember them patching anything about it - this is something in the fundamental mechanics of the game as a whole, not just a certain fight. You have to hit them fast before they fully register a healer as having aggro - Rage of Halone or Butcher's Block is too slow to do this, and you need Provoke for the tank swap, so use a combo'd Savage Blade or Skull Sunder for that quick hit.

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Originally Posted by gamesmart

I don't remember them patching anything about it - this is something in the fundamental mechanics of the game as a whole, not just a certain fight. You have to hit them fast before they fully register a healer as having aggro - Rage of Halone or Butcher's Block is too slow to do this, and you need Provoke for the tank swap, so use Savage Blade and Skull Sunder for that quick hit.

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And I might add, in case of Paladin, using OFF-GCD skills like Circle of Scorn or Spirits Within to fill that time/delay between Savage Blade and Rage of Halone. This way I build a solid emnity on the adds.

Sounds like you're just not picking them up fast enough. They're targetable by aoe attacks like Flash and Overpower (and show up in the enmity list) for at least a second before they complete their "spawn" animation which is when you should be doing something to pick them up before they go munch on a healer.

The game checks things in certain intervals. Aggro on monsters can be a bit funky because of it.

Just try to be quicker on the adds, I guess.

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Originally Posted by gamesmart

I don't remember them patching anything about it - this is something in the fundamental mechanics of the game as a whole, not just a certain fight. You have to hit them fast before they fully register a healer as having aggro - Rage of Halone or Butcher's Block is too slow to do this, and you need Provoke for the tank swap, so use a combo'd Savage Blade or Skull Sunder for that quick hit.

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I guess you never played Turn 7 before they patched it then. But yes they did, and its the same concept. The bird or add does not move, BB goes off, then it goes halfway across the map and comes back. Don't worry, I understand how this all works. But once hate is established the monster should be on you and not going anywhere. In T7 now you can do the same thing with a preloaded halone or BB and the add never moves. They just somehow overlooked it for 12 and 13.

Don't preload Halone or BB. Preload Savage Blade or Skull Sunder.

And I have already beaten 12 and we are 50% on 13, I've spent enough time in there it is not a "forgot" or "to slow" issue.

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Originally Posted by Makado

The point I'm making is that even after I get aggro on them because they first had aggro on a healer they continue to them even though I have hate. That's fine if your healers just happen to not have healed or whatever, but it is the same concept as what was going on in Turn 7 which they acknowledged and patched.

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I know the point you're making but my point is, you're too slow. This used to happen to me until I started giving it much more focus and getting onto it quicker, then it stopped.

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Originally Posted by Barboron

I know the point you're making but my point is, you're too slow. This used to happen to me until I started giving it much more focus and getting onto it quicker, then it stopped.

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It can't be any faster then I do it, as my BB is completed on the mob before it has even moved in the first place and was started before it has even hit the arena.

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Originally Posted by Makado

I guess you never played Turn 7 before they patched it then. But yes they did, and its the same concept. The bird or add does not move, BB goes off, then it goes halfway across the map and comes back. Don't worry, I understand how this all works. But once hate is established the monster should be on you and not going anywhere. In T7 now you can do the same thing with a preloaded halone or BB and the add never moves. They just somehow overlooked it for 12 and 13.

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I'm aware of that problem in t7 but I don't remember reading that they patched it (I do still see tanks having trouble on the pick-up, but that's tank problem not a bug)

It's the same thing on say, death sentence from t5, twin starts casting DS on the MT, if you provoke off while it's casting it still hits the MT. The add spawns, readies an auto-attack or whatever on it's initial target, and performs it before the next action is q'd on you. Pretty sure there's no bug in that.

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Originally Posted by Makado

It can't be any faster then I do it, as my BB is completed on the mob before it has even moved in the first place and was started before it has even hit the arena.

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Then you're lagging. When I use Butchers Block properly (sometimes I am a tiny bit slow, but I know When I am) I don't have the add running after my whm, it sticks to me.

And it never got patched in t7, I swear I saw it happen two days ago there...

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Originally Posted by whiskeybravo

I'm aware of that problem in t7 but I don't remember reading that they patched it (I do still see tanks having trouble on the pick-up, but that's tank problem not a bug)

It's the same thing on say, death sentence from t5, twin starts casting DS on the MT, if you provoke off while it's casting it still hits the MT. The add spawns, readies an auto-attack or whatever on it's initial target, and performs it before the next action is q'd on you. Pretty sure there's no bug in that.

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If that was the case your healers would be getting wrecked because they would be first on hate list every time. I'm trying to get an answer on this compared to turn 7 because it used to be the same way. Our PLD said the same thing, it is exactly how 7 used to be until it was patched. Once you have hate established on you a mob may travel a very small distance if you were late. These take it to extremes.

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Originally Posted by PArcher

Then you're lagging. When I use Butchers Block properly (sometimes I am a tiny bit slow, but I know When I am) I don't have the add running after my whm, it sticks to me.

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Your healers must not be healing at that time or something then. Im not lagging and others have said this as well to me. Like I said it was a problem in 7 and was fixed so im trying to find out from a dev if this could be the same issue.

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Originally Posted by Makado

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Unless it was patched early on in 2.2, I've seen no mention of anything regarding enemy behaviors specifically in that turn. The same issue is apparent (not to the same degree as T7 or T12, but it's still there) in more or less every turn past 5 - snakes, slugs, dreadnaught, add in Heavensfall phase, sons and daughters, nodes - that fixing it in only one turn is not only illogical, but doesn't really do anything about the problem unless they completely change how the core mechanic works.

Everyone else here has said what I've said, and I've personally had no issues picking up adds in most instances when I decide that me tanking is a good idea. Know when it spawns, where it spawns, and be ready to pick it up as soon as you can target it.

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Originally Posted by Makado

If that was the case your healers would be getting wrecked because they would be first on hate list every time. I'm trying to get an answer on this compared to turn 7 because it used to be the same way. Our PLD said the same thing, it is exactly how 7 used to be until it was patched. Once you have hate established on you a mob may travel a very small distance if you were late. These take it to extremes.

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I read through the hotfixes twice, no mention of adjusting t7 in this regard. Don't really feel like combing through all the patch notes at this time though. Would be nice to know if there was or wasn't an adjustment at least.

It's probably just lag, been seeing a lot of that lately especially the last few days. I never really had problems picking up adds in t7, though I've seen plenty of other tanks have the problem. It was really an issue all the way back in t4, had to flash the adds before they even spawned or else heals were dead. I don't think it's a bug.

If it's your WHM tending to get wacked he could try using med 1 after white fire hits then about 1 or 2 seconds after med 1 start to SS the MT followed by regen on MT. The add will have spawned with no HoTs ticking and the MT will be buffed for Revelation. Also after Regen hits MT it should be time to regen OT followed by a cure on MT to recover from Revelation.