Advice on 4 star recipes for weaver

Hi all, I've been catching up on my weaver and am almost ready to attempt the 4 star recipes, my gear is fully melded with supra weapon and I'm just missing the artisan offhand tool which I hope to have in a few days once I've collected the sealants. Then it's on to blowing up many fieldcraft IIIs for the recipe book and I'll be there.

My questions are, has anyone attempted the 4 star recipes? Can they be HQd fairly reliably, how many steps is required for progress completion (assuming pbp followed by careful synth IIs under ingen II) and how many IQ stacks will I need to have a decent shot at HQ after byregot's? Any info would be appreciated, I'm new to master crafting and don't want to go in blind!

There are plenty of threads around about 4* Crafting. It's not class specific, since all endgame crafting really requires having almost all DoH @ Level 50 for Cross Class. If you were crafting 3* Recipes, After you get your offhand and meld it, I would recommend sticking to the same rotation you used for 3* crafting. Also, depending on your stats/melds, you want to get that 452 craftsmanship or w/e, the 207 Control, and then eat HQ Bouillabase for CP. If you don't meet the requirements and have to eat alternate food you will need to rely on more Tricks of the Trade. I'm sure everyone on here would agree with me you want to get as much distance between you and RNG as possible.


Biggest Difference is you might need an extra PbP or CS2.

Thanks for your reply. The only reason I mentioned weaver specifically was because it's the only one I've geared fully - my others don't have the body melded or the supra/artisan tools. I really want to make the 'rogue' gear which is why I did this! Huge fan of thfs :)

I've had a look around for 4 star crafting threads but haven't been able to find the answer to my question, I'm probably just being thick and missing something but most discussions seem to be based around 3 star. I guess I'm just worried I'll use the same rotation and either blow up at the end due to lack of progress or hit byregot's and only have a slim chance of HQ...

I guess that Feedback is buried in other posts. I wasn't able to quickly find where people have said it. It's probably in the middle of MOT 3* Cafting threads that are still somewhat active. A lot of crafters jus saying "4*, use the same rotation now that you have the new stats"

If you are worried about short changing yourself on Proress, Make sure you save enough CP for Ingenuity II.

Actually, your biggest concern should be geting your WVR MAstery Book II. That is more difficult than the 4* Synths in my opinion. I think I needed 3 PbP and 4 CS II's? Anyway, here's some quotes I did find.

Source: This Forum *****Note****** I haven't qualified this. I use Ingenuity II, and haven't stopped using it. Test before aking this for granted. StouterTaru might have been using Ingenuity I, which may not be useful, but I'm prety sure Ingenuity II is, See Jade's rotation below. (I trust her to the point where I had her craft my Aritsan gear, and she HQ'd 3/3 for me.)

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Originally Posted by StouterTaru

453 craftsmanship, CSII gives 63 progress. INGII + CSII gives 69 progress.

586 > 392 > 262 > 175 left using PbP (it's broke since 2.4 came out, 33% instead of 1/3)

So I've decided to dump Ingenuity for 4 stars. The rotation seems a lot more flexible now.

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Souce: Jade's lodestone Blog

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For the past 3 days I've been busy Assembling my full Artisan Set ( minus body ) and Forager Set. These pieces of Armor require the Master II Books and are 4* Crafts. First order of business is to craft the Artisan Off-hand Tools from Blacksmith / Carpenter and then Penta-meld them ( Control +4 / Craftsmanship + 15 / CP + 3 ) This will help in obtaining the 3x HQ Monstrosities for the Trade-ins. They are 801 Difficulty / 8964 Quality and the best you can start with is 1494/8964 if using an HQ Ingredient. These are the necessary Cross-Class Skills:

Hasty Touch
Steady Hand II
Tricks of the Trade
Comfort Zone
Piece by Piece
Manipulation
Ingenuity II
Byregots Blessing
Careful Synthesis II
Reclaim

Why is Innovation missing? You have to try to set up a "Good" condition Byregot's Blessing in the end to be able to get it > 80% If you get enough "Good" Conditions you need to use a Manipulation for 3 extra Hasty Touches. If I miss more than 1 Hasty Touch I hit Reclaim, a 9-stack of Inner Quiet will rarely get you > 15% Quality unless you get the "Good" You need 3x Piece by Piece which I use at the start and your Ingenuity II infused - Careful Synthesis II has to Yield 81 for the final 3 at the end. Once in awhile I can use a 2nd Master's Mend II if the "Good" conditions are flowing, here is a sample:

Comfort Zone
Inner Quiet
Steady Hand II
Piece by Piece 3x
Hasty Touch 2x
Steady Hand II
Hasty Touch 2x
Comfort Zone
Master's Mend II
Hasty Touch 1x
Steady Hand II
Hasty Touch 2x
Great Strides
Ingenuity II
Byregot's Blessing
Careful Synthesis II 3x

Always have Steady Hand II active when you use Hasty Touch, use Tricks of the Trade on EVERY "Good" Status and if you get 4 that's an extra Manipulation and 8 will get you a 2nd Master's Mend II. Don't be shy in using Reclaim, you only need 3x of each and Fieldcraft III are easy to get from the Bridesmaid / Best Man gear to Desynth.

The 4* Rotation is very similar, but you'll have more Quality especially if you manage to secure HQ Materials... you can get HQ Allagan Silk / Leather / Nuggets to help make the HQ 4* materials like Wootz Ingot. Starting from 0 Quality and trying to get to 5783 is a bit daunting, especially with 586 Difficulty. Though for 4* Crafts you only need 2x Piece by Piece + 4x Careful Synthesis II... you save 15 CP.

Comfort Zone
Inner Quiet
Steady Hand II
Piece by Piece 2x
Hasty Touch 3x
Steady Hand II
Hasty Touch 2x
Comfort Zone
Master's Mend II
Hasty Touch 1x
Steady Hand II
Hasty Touch 1x
Great Strides
Ingenuity II
Byregot's Blessing
Careful Synthesis 4x

Again always have Steady Hand II active when you use Hasty Touch, convert ALL "Good" conditions with Tricks of the Trade and use Manipulation / Master's Mend II with luck. You could add Innovation back in the final Byregot's Sequence and not rely on Reclaim, that's if you have enough HQ Materials. You can theoretically start with 2891 Quality and that's actually easier than making Terminus Putty. I have HQ'ed 14/15 4* Crafts thus far...

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First of all two things.

1) Innovation is criminally underrated. If Rapid Synthesis and Reclaim were the underrated skills of 2.3, Innovation is most underrated skill of 2.4. If anyone complains they can't get 100% on 4* crafts without hitting a good, I can immediately tell they dropped innovation. I cannot stress how important this skill is as a cross class.

2) Ingenuity II is utterly horrible on four star crafts. You get a tiny bit more progress and it is a horribly inefficient use of CP.

Your masterbook 2 will be your introduction to four star crafting. The difference between the masterbook rotation and the 4* rotation is that the 4* rotation you skip ingenuity 2.

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Originally Posted by Lebenoshl

First of all two things.

1) Innovation is criminally underrated. If Rapid Synthesis and Reclaim were the underrated skills of 2.3, Innovation is most underrated skill of 2.4. If anyone complains they can't get 100% on 4* crafts without hitting a good, I can immediately tell they dropped innovation. I cannot stress how important this skill is as a cross class.

2) Ingenuity II is utterly horrible on four star crafts. You get a tiny bit more progress and it is a horribly inefficient use of CP.

Your masterbook 2 will be your introduction to four star crafting. The difference between the masterbook rotation and the 4* rotation is that the 4* rotation you skip ingenuity 2.

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Are you using any rotations listed on he Forums? You have peaked my interest if nothing else. IE, are you using Innovation on BB, or all touch actions? I'm going to search for your posts on the forums after lunch and see if I can find what you are doing. I haven't done much 4* crafting mind you, as I don't have a Supra yet. I know it's not necessary, but I'd like the extra CP I'd get from no eating craft food.

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Originally Posted by Mishini_Dracoto

Are you using any rotations listed on he Forums? You have peaked my interest if nothing else. IE, are you using Innovation on BB, or all touch actions? I'm going to search for your posts on the forums after lunch and see if I can find what you are doing. I haven't done much 4* crafting mind you, as I don't have a Supra yet. I know it's not necessary, but I'd like the extra CP I'd get from no eating craft food.

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Keep in mind two things: there is a rapid synthesis method that is mathematically higher % HQ chance, however I don't have the cross class space for it. I take 11 skills and use them for all crafts of any difficulty so I don't have to worry about switching or finding out halfway through a craft I forgot something.

This is my guide for 4* Turn ins http://i.imgur.com/H1FkdFL.png

4* Crafts are the exact same thing. However don't use ingenuity II. (This means in the BB Fish section you need 32 less CP for each rotation)

Thanks so much for your replies. Lebenoshl I've seen your guide already and have it bookmarked, I haven't done the 4* turn ins yet as I need 3 days worth of oaknots still for my artisan offhand but I have been practicing it on lesser crafts. It's good to know it can be so easily adapted for 4 star :) I will have a look at Jade's rotation too.

So it seems 3x pbp + 3 careful synth II for progress on 4* turn ins and 2xpbp + 4 careful synth II on 4* itself? The main difference between Jade's and Lebenoshl's rotations seems to be manipulation vs. waste not, from reading both guides it seems I could hit tricks of the trade more under manipulation potentially giving me more CP back, although it's not likely I'd get more that one tricks proc in the 4 steps of a waste not, at least not very often. Is there any difference between the two or is it just personal preference? (I know what they both do, just wondered how it would affect the craft overall).

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Originally Posted by Lebenoshl

2) Ingenuity II is utterly horrible on four star crafts. You get a tiny bit more progress and it is a horribly inefficient use of CP.

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if you do PxP twice, a rapid synth and a crafeul synth prior to your mastermend 2 then based on ToTT, ING2 is not only an extra step that will get you a excellent or good proc but also will increase your BB and is the determining factor on whether or not you can finish @ 5/80 or 10/80 with a careful 2. i try to stay above 128 cp so i can begin my SH1 > GS > Inno > ING2 > BB @ 20/80 or 15/80 as opposed to 30 like you are obviously doing by dropping ING 2. Since I've come across Xash10X's rotation(YouTube this person if you haven't already) I'm about 80% successful if not higher on mats and I have yet to NQ a piece of gear. Soo idk what else you would have? lol reclaim? anyway just my opinion. And for anyone struggling check into Xash10X on YouTube. Great crafter..
Cheers~

Again. Keep in mind there are rapid synthesis rotations, but I won't cover them because it will just complicate things

It is 3x PbP -> Ing II -> 3x CSII on turn ins

and

3x PbP -> 3x CSII on four star crafts. The big difference is you save 32 CP by not using Ingenuity two.

Manipulation vs Waste Not.

Personally I don't think Manipulation is worth a cross class spot. It saves you four CP (compared to Master's Mend). Your cross class spot can be much better spent somewhere else. I label it as overrated, sure it's good for low level crafts, but honestly you can just macro those.

But back to the topic. Manipulation vs Waste Not

The difference is 32 CP and 10 Durability. What this means is this. With waste not you have a chance of using a second waste not. With manipulation, you will never have the chance of getting a second manipulation, in addition you will have the chance of not being able to complete your craft in the first place.

So I'm just going to break it down into three cases

1. Low CP - You can use Waste Not, but you don't have enough CP for manipulation and completing your craft- Waste Not wins
2. Medium CP - You can use both skills- Manipulation wins (gratz you saved 4 cp)
3. Hi CP - You can use Waste Not twice, but only use Manipulation once - Waste Not Wins

To me the upsides of Waste Not is much better than the 4 CP I save from Manipulation.

On a four star craft, since you don't use ingenuity II, the low CP case isn't as important as you will have enough cp to finish your craft in most cases. There are definite disadvantages, however having an extra 10 durability helps a lot in specific crafts. On the other hand having extra CP allows you to guarantee 100% on crafts by converting your hasty touches to basic touches. It is up to you what kind of risk you want to take.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LauMihli

if you do PxP twice, a rapid synth and a crafeul synth prior to your mastermend 2 then based on ToTT, ING2 is not only an extra step that will get you a excellent or good proc but also will increase your BB and is the determining factor on whether or not you can finish @ 5/80 or 10/80 with a careful 2. i try to stay above 128 cp so i can begin my SH1 > GS > Inno > ING2 > BB @ 20/80 or 15/80 as opposed to 30 like you are obviously doing by dropping ING 2. Since I've come across Xash10X's rotation(YouTube this person if you haven't already) I'm about 80% successful if not higher on mats and I have yet to NQ a piece of gear. Soo idk what else you would have? lol reclaim? anyway just my opinion. And for anyone struggling check into Xash10X on YouTube. Great crafter..
Cheers~

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You can BB fish with plain CS2s too. Or you can just do PbPx3 + RS and later finish with a CS2 and save 17 CP. That's why the rotation sucks

Rapid Synth has a huge advantage if you can reach the right plateau with your craftsmanship, which should be around 455.

At 461 craftsmanship rapid synth is 135 progress, CSII is 65. That lets you PbP, 2x RS, 2x CSII.

edit - 457 craftsmanship is enough, 134 and 64, gets you to the end with 3 progress to spare.

I still prefer 2xPbP 4xCSII, those 4 free CSII are great filler to get in another step and refresh CZ or get to a MMII before putting SHII back up, or as filler at the end fishing for good/excellent.

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Originally Posted by LauMihli

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A Standard Synthesis gives more than a CSII + Ingeunity II. Ingeunity still doesn't buff enough to justify a whooping 32 CP cost; it'd only give an extra turn to fish (something that could be done instead with observe or a CSII if you're gonna need 2 to finish a craft).

And also, Xashi10x's video doesn't do anything different from anyone else in this topic...heck he only got up to 38% HQ rate because RNG wasn't good on his end (And still HQ'd it, meanwhile I'm constantly getting NQ's on 82% >_>)

I stopped using manipulation and instead opt for MMII, mainly because I can't fit it into my cross skills anymore and MMII is more efficient CP/durability-wise.
WN on the other hand, I find myself using only if I have the CP to spare from TotT.

Looking at the video, I found the Xash10X rotation to be very sloppy, but it did lead me to changing my 4 star rotation a little bit. I always used PbP under SH(II), but after some hard thought I am doing it without.

2 steps with CZ down and SH not up without refreshing CZ just made me cringe, as did using Ingenuity II early in the rotation.

Hi Stouter,

Thanks. May I ask what your updated rotation is for 4 Star Turn-Ins?

Thanks!

CZ > IQ > SHII > 5xHasty > 2 successful PbP > up to 2 CSII (if needed to get down to 20 durability, otherwise hold off) > MMII

Use ToT any time you can, refresh CZ as soon as it wears

Middle Stuff, only use CZ a 3rd time if you are getting a lot of ToT procs

96/99 CP end run - SH/SHII > Up to 2 hasty > GS > Inno > possible fish with CSII if 0-1 Hasty used > BB > end with CSIIs

I dumped ING2 once I got my Master II books. Some 4-star rotations rely on ING2 + RS. I personally don't like that. I take nearly every ToT in the first "phase" of the synth. I prefer to not be bound by ING2. It is exceedingly rare that RS fails to the point where the synth is unrecoverable.