So about the clipping on Longcoats/Robes

http://puu.sh/cYjg8/b9e0b25888.png

Finally got my fabulous coat made, half for glamour purposes and half to fill the accuracy void. You'd think something that's gated by both a master II book, indirectly gated by sealants (to meet stat requirements), allagan materials and soldiery materials, you'd have a nice piece of product to show for it.

Welp...
http://puu.sh/cYjlJ/e230f572af.png
http://puu.sh/cYjni/b6fdbd1fb1.png

Also not shown is that the neck clips with certain hairstyles (I had to change it a bit so it doesn't bother me) and that the tail was clipping through my normal standing pose during strong winds...

It's nothing gamebreaking, but I recall this being present for the longest time, and I'm a bit surprised that it's still the case especially for something that's so far out of reach (at least imo with all the gates mentioned above) through crafting. Also worth noting that my friend who plays a miqo'te doesn't experience any problems with clipping on their robes and long jackets...

And THAT is why I only wear speedos (well, pants too sometimes.... if they compliment my rear).

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Originally Posted by Nuinn

And THAT is why I only wear speedos (well, pants too sometimes.... if they compliment my rear).

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But...this is a top! It's a jacket! I mean granted some of the bottoms that clip include the spring skirt, but Robes and Jackets?!

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Originally Posted by RiceisNice

But...this is a top! It's a jacket! I mean granted some of the bottoms that clip include the spring skirt, but Robes and Jackets?!

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Oh, right.... I forgot to mention I wear just as little on the top as well :p

Anyways, I feel for you. Joke aside, it's why I'm very wary of any gear that looks bulky/long/too elaborate. Clipping makes me twitch so bad I snap my neck each time :/
Not sure what could be done in the case of this coat. I've considered getting it cause I like the design but once I realized that horrible clipping would occur, you couldn't even gift it to me for 0 Gil.

Most robes (which are chest pieces as well) don't have clipping, or have it in minimal amounts. Presumably cause the robes have been designed (rigged) differently than this coat, which seems to be just a "jacket type" chest piece on which they slapped a sheet of polygons at the bottom, without rigging it to have the physics the lower portions of robes have.

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Originally Posted by Nuinn

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I mean, the physics are still there, but it's just not enough leeway. The coat moves along as I move; you can see it fluttering around, but not enough that it just collides with the leg. Same when I'm standing still and there's strong wind, it blows into my legs from my right. This isn't the case for female miqo'tes and possibly some other class combinations, as far as the spring skirt was concerned.

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Originally Posted by RiceisNice

I mean, the physics are still there, but it's just not enough leeway. The coat moves along as I move; you can see it fluttering around, but not enough that it just collides with the leg. Same when I'm standing still and there's strong wind, it blows into my legs from my right. This isn't the case for female miqo'tes and possibly some other class combinations, as far as the spring skirt was concerned.

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Yeah, that's what I meant (but didn't know how to explain better ^ ^). They'd need to adjust the physics better. Suppose would involve fine tuning for each race (?) but kinda doubt they'd be taking the time from other tasks to work on something that isn't a burning issue ;(

SE also kept designing gear with HUGE collars through which most hairstyles clip, making it look absolutely horrible.

Although they seem to have taken notice and kinda fixed this with the Ironworks gear? At least on my Ninja there is no collar clipping going on. Can't say about the other things.

In general though, they should take care to minimize the really obvious clipping issues, like the leg going through the coat in your screens.

I got my Ironworks coat and it clips with my hair because of the huge collar on it, which irks me greatly, I don't really like many of the other hairstyles and I like the coat itself, so I hope they do something about the clipping in a future patch.

The thing with this is, some people want variety (quantity) and don't care about clipping, some people want quality and do care about clipping.

They can't please both groups, making sure gear doesn't clip means they will reuse looks and it will take a long time to design new looks, meeting the demand of players for more and more glamour / more fresh gear look means they can't spend as much time making sure gear looks perfect.

In the end both groups will never get along and they will never get to please both, so this is a Deal With It™ case.

Sorry. Aggravation with this has come up many times before here. I don't like it either, but have adjusted because I understand why it's present.

The more-recent response:

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Originally Posted by Grekumah

Greetings,

This is similar to what we said in the past, but I would like to reiterate it for those who may have missed it.

Fundamentally, we are prioritizing the introduction of equipment in a large variety of designs, regardless of whether or not they may have clipping issues or overlap with certain equipment or characters. Due to this, we will not be making any adjustments to the dresses. However, in extreme cases there may be instances where we will make changes.

Btw, I am rocking the Crescent Moon Nightgown as my tank body, and nothing compares to how dapper it makes me look. :)

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What was "said in the past":

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Originally Posted by Camate

Greetings,

When it comes to introducing new hairstyles and gear, we’ve been placing a lot of focus on creating diversity and our highest priority is to continue to introduce new varieties going forward.

We understand the concerns about gear and hairstyle clipping; however, if we were to stick to designs that ensure that there is no clipping then it would limit the types of equipment we were able to create. Due to this the development team has decided to continue putting the designs ahead of the concerns about clipping.

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I even made fun of it in the Draw your Character! thread:

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Originally Posted by Sadana

omg, you guys are right! Everyone CAN draw!

http://img2.finalfantasyxiv.com/acci...8e3521d626.jpg

Complete with collar clipping through hair! :D Tru2Lyf!! XD

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Originally Posted by Sadana

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The problem I see in those replies is that things like the ironworks represent the opposite of "variety of designs" when they reuse models between classes/roles. And what bothers me the most is that while they're detailed enough to follow physics, it's not consistent with the race/gender combinations (back to the example that this doesn't happen with female miqo'tes).

Don't get me wrong; I'd rather have the game functioning above all else, but that sort of thing just makes me inadequate playing a female hyur (only other reasonable option being a male roegadyn)...as if there's favoritism with aesthetics... *tinfoil mask*

Edit : On that note though, would height or proportions have any influence to reduce clipping? I still have a fantasia that I've been considering to use...which brings me ot my next question; when I use the fantasia to enter the character edit, can I back pedal and not use it, or do I have to go through with it?

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Originally Posted by RiceisNice

things like the ironworks represent the opposite of "variety of designs" when they reuse models between classes/roles. And what bothers me the most is that while they're detailed enough to follow physics, it's not consistent with the race/gender combinations (back to the example that this doesn't happen with female miqo'tes).

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:/
They're still new... even if you don't like them or think it's "enough". I think the point is that we could have ANY new gear or we could have a couple sets that are perfect. The first quote I copied, Grekumah's, was from a thread about very specific clipping issues that only happened with one race. He pointed out in his comment that this could be seen as a bug. If this is the case with new gear and is not ye olde complaint of hair/weapon/leg clipping that is seen on everyone, then this can be reported as a legitimate problem.

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Originally Posted by Sadana

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It's just how I view it. I don't like how people will say "We want to focus on making new designs..." and in the end pump out designs for some gear that's shared between 2 classes at the minimum while at the same time have an issue with clipping (with certain race/genders or not). And at the last part, as I've mentioned I've seen my leg clip through some robes and long skirts, while that's not the case for a female miqo'te. Can't comment on the kirimu coat because I don't know of anyone that has a female miqo'te at level 50 bard who I can also trust to let them try on the coat, but I can attest to this as far as robes (that reach down to your feet) and the spring/plain skirt is concerned. There's also a matter if that problem you mentioned earlier was ever addressed or just really really low on the priority list (which is understandable, but doesn't justify following this trend 2 major content patches later)

And another thing is while they admit that they don't want this to limit the amount of creativity or design just to avoid clipping, it doesn't mean they should slam into it face first either (making it overly long or bulky for example.)

I just got the Ironworks tank body and my hands clip through the "skirt" all the way up to the wrists. -_- I am so disappointed in it. I thought Phlegethon's was bad enough. IIRC it clipped my fingertips, and during weapon-drawn-idle stance, the left shoulder spike clipped through my face. It probably wouldn't have been as bad if the female stance didn't force us to hold the axe with both hands in a prissy manner (c'mon, SE, female warriors are just as strong as male warriors! change this damn pose already!), but I digress. The clipping on Ironworks is even more of a crime, especially since it doesn't seem like it's difficult to fix. Just make the skirt part less poofy so that it falls under the hands.

Quick, post a picture of your character in that gear riding a Chocobo for the luls

I agree with them to keep adding gear without spending ages to fix clipping issues.
It most likely comes down to ps3 limitations anyway

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Originally Posted by Ghastly

I agree with them to keep adding gear without spending ages to fix clipping issues.
It most likely comes down to ps3 limitations anyway

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Except PS3 already runs on "low physics" for gear, to the point that my skirt clips onto itself and you can see part of my underwear...while standing still.

There's really no reason for anything on higher settings to clip just because. Like I mentioned, they don't want those sort of limitations to restrict their design, but it doesn't mean they should just slam head first into clipping issues despite it (and especially when you pump out remodels over different classes, like ironworks for example)

I actually stopped caring about clipping, I just want unique gear and if it clips it doesn't really bother me anymore!

If they made this hair I wouldn't care if it clipped at all. I just want it so much.

http://static.zerochan.net/Hatsune.Miku.full.530981.jpg

(yes this is totally a bait so that the ppl creating hairstyles will see it and be like "oh wow nice hair, lets make it" and I will be happy forever

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Originally Posted by Ghastly

I agree with them to keep adding gear without spending ages to fix clipping issues.
It most likely comes down to ps3 limitations anyway

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Nothing to do with PS3 limitations, but they don't have a big crew of gear designers, that task is usually handled by just a couple people and they have limited resources, so they can focus on either new designs or make sure each old design looks perfect in every single height, every single race, every single class , every single gear combination, every single emote.... and so goes the list.

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Originally Posted by Sivara

I just got the Ironworks tank body and my hands clip through the "skirt" all the way up to the wrists. -_- I am so disappointed in it. I thought Phlegethon's was bad enough. IIRC it clipped my fingertips, and during weapon-drawn-idle stance, the left shoulder spike clipped through my face. It probably wouldn't have been as bad if the female stance didn't force us to hold the axe with both hands in a prissy manner (c'mon, SE, female warriors are just as strong as male warriors! change this damn pose already!), but I digress. The clipping on Ironworks is even more of a crime, especially since it doesn't seem like it's difficult to fix. Just make the skirt part less poofy so that it falls under the hands.

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Look at this mess. It looks even worse with it clipping any sword with a blade as well:

http://i.imgur.com/aBUuHTp.jpg

I change my hairstyle depending on what I glamour. It's not ideal and I shouldn't have to, but it works.

In some cases (like the Ladon's screenshot above me) I even change my pose - I really can't stand clipping. The fact that I have to slightly change how my character is presented is irksome...but manageable.

In Lineage II. Long Hairstyles would change slightly when the character equipped an item where the hair would otherwise clip through the armor

For example when a long haired female char put on a suit of heavy armor with a large collar or plating around the neck the long hair would wrap up into a bun, or fixed into a pony tail or twin tails depending on race.

As for the skirt/robe clipping. That's always been an eyesore. Not game breaking though. Just makes you wonder "how much quality assurance went into this?" is all.

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Originally Posted by KaedrianLiang

Just makes you wonder "how much quality assurance went into this?" is all.

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Quality assurance has nothing at all to do with this if the developers are saying that they won't bother themselves with the clipping issues.

For me, I have found that I don't mind the clipping while standing or running around but being a female Miqote in a bed in painful to look at. Everything has this weird cone design if it's long... You'd think they would care about that since you basically become a tent. Or better yet, get on those sleep /changepose.

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Originally Posted by Ladon

Look at this mess. It looks even worse with it clipping any sword with a blade as well:

http://i.imgur.com/aBUuHTp.jpg

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That's a pretty good example of what I don't want to see; they don't want things like clipping to get in the way of designing gear, but they still run face into it so that clipping becomes a lot more apparent, even when standing still.

http://puu.sh/cYIQI/d1e0b2a6ab.png
Another example, though it only happens with no physics. Still though, bothers me that if they're gonna design gear just to make it seem so...blah.

The problems regarding are many fold and there's not alot of good answers to them. Dredging up a dead horse, XI's response to clipping looks stupid today. In XI they avoided it entirely. Characters walked around with their arms held out a foot from them body to let weapons and armor have enough space that there was no clipping, and legs spread out a couple inches to give boots and greaves room.. Armor itself, for the longest time, rarely extended past the thighs to keep the legs from clipping with any flowing robe elements. It wasn't until the introduction of synergy that we got long robes. Now, back to XIV, the developers pretty much said, "Clipping or no, we're having robes and characters standing in natural poses." I don't mind the clipping, it's the price for not standing around looking like a buffoon.

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Originally Posted by RiceisNice

That's a pretty good example of what I don't want to see; they don't want things like clipping to get in the way of designing gear, but they still run face into it so that clipping becomes a lot more apparent, even when standing still.

http://puu.sh/cYIQI/d1e0b2a6ab.png
Another example, though it only happens with no physics. Still though, bothers me that if they're gonna design gear just to make it seem so...blah.

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That kind of stuff is just poor modeling period due to improper mesh placement or implementing mesh deformation wrong. This has nothing to do with the design of the gear and is the kind of stuff that really needs to be fixed.

One thing that annoys me is the quiver on the Artemis Bow stabs into my characters thigh/butt every time I shoot an arrow(It's very hard to get a screen shot of)... ~_~ If they had made the Weapon just a bit smaller or made the quiver shorter it wouldn't look so ridiculous.

Everything clips through everything in this game. I've gotten used to it. My hair clips through everything. My tail clips through everything. Basically in this game if you want avoid all clipping, the only thing you can wear is a bikini.

There are no physics to clothing. It doesn't magically sway with your feet, it's animated like everything else. Sometimes those animations clash, and when they do you'll get clipping. There's too many exceptions to make it 'perfect' and if they even tried to be, people would still find a reason to moan that their dress now 'floats' above their leg as it bends.

Can't please everyone all the time.

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Originally Posted by Lemuria

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It'd be nice to animate them in a way that doesn't incur clipping (like when I'm standing still during winds for example), nor does it justify designing equips that have bulky or bloated skirts that clip into your hands at stand. At this point it's treading into the "we just don't care" boundary.

I know this is necro'ing the post but it has to be said! They recently made massive improvements to the body collision to long robes/skirts while moving. Particularly the culprit where your feet go straight though your robe/skirt while running and sprinting. Check it out!

I think they snuck it in witht he most recent hotfix without saying anything. GJ Dev team.

improvements, not 100% fixed i would say 95% fixed as you see a little bit of certain boots and armor combinations still clip through the skirt, but only slightly. Far less an eyesore compared to the before where the whole leg would go through the skirt. amirite?

This is charming:

http://i.imgur.com/0PhsFMF.jpg

I understand some small clipping, here and there...but how does this get approved and past development? serious question lol.

I think a lot of the clipping issues would be avoided if they made more gear that didn't flare up around the neck quite as much.

Right now I'm always wearing a hat of some kind. Removes the ponytail, and thus the clipping it'd have won't bug the hell out of me. But, that isn't a solution with hairstyles that are long and loose.

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Originally Posted by Mahri

I think a lot of the clipping issues would be avoided if they made more gear that didn't flare up around the neck quite as much.

Right now I'm always wearing a hat of some kind. Removes the ponytail, and thus the clipping it'd have won't bug the hell out of me. But, that isn't a solution with hairstyles that are long and loose.

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That is the reason why I avoided long hair for 1 year. I could not wait anymore and finally got a long hairstyle recently and I am trying to avoid clipping gear but it is hard. Almost everything is clipping with long hair in this game. :D

In LII, every hat changed hairstyle, that would be a solution but it would make every character less special and different... so I guess clipping is better than that.

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Originally Posted by Nuinn

And THAT is why I only wear speedos (well, pants too sometimes.... if they compliment my rear).

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And how can they compliment your non-existant rear?