Instanced Non-Objective Dungeons

This is something that I would love to see in the game and I think it would bring some much needed depth to the game.

I don't want open world dungeons, per se, because I don't think they could release enough space for everyone to be able to participate and still have good rewards, but how about something like this:

Bahamut's Scar
Bahamut's ravaging of Eorzea left several open wounds on its surface which contain mysterious and powerful enemies. Interlocking caverns and catacombs contain chambers and corridors which sunk beneath Eorzea's surface in the aftermath of the carnage . . . and some that rose from beneath the earth. Adventurers can expect to find both familiar and strange wonders and dangers alike in the caverns of Bahamut's Scar.

- Minimum iLVL requirement of 100 to enter Bahamut's Scar.
- A light party is required to enter, but players are allowed to bring a full party into Bahamut's Scar.
- Players will gain access to an instanced version of this dungeon, which will be physically the same each time (depending on point of entry, Limsa, Gridania, Ul'Dah), but will have randomized enemies.
- Players will face randomized encounters consisting of small to large groups of enemies found throughout Eorzea. Each enemy has a small change to drop gil, crafting materials, or materia. At the end of each encounter that will take place in a sealed chamber, there is a chance for anywhere between 1-4 chests to drop, containing anything from rare Glamor-only armor, to Extreme Primal Mounts, to Sands of Time, to Allagan Weapons, to little blue birds.
- Uncommonly, players will encounter larger enemies such as an Enraged Adamantoise. These encounters will involve monsters that have a large amount of hitpoints, whose attack power will scale to the number of players encounter them.
- Each encounter that you face in Bahamut's Scar will increase in difficulty and reward until your entire party is defeated.
- Players are free to change jobs at any time they are not in combat in Bahamut's Scar.
- A new gearset of iLVL 105 armor, accessories, and weapons will begin to have the chance to drop after 5 successful encounters; the more successful you are, the higher your changes to obtain this gear.
- At all times, there is a chance that the party may trigger several different environmental dangers, including but not limited to falling ceilings (think DD second boss), electronic discharges (think wave AEs from T2 and T9), and new enemies appearing from Aether disruptions!

If you don't want to read the below explanation in brown, TL;DR = something repeatable that's randomized and worth doing.

I'll leave the rest up to your imagination, but something repeatable with random elements and a wide variety of rewards would be something that would keep me logging in a lot more often. Being allowed a party size of 4-8 would make this a quick, "/fc Hey, anyone wanna do Scar? 6 people? Cool, let's go." instead of making a PF and waiting for 40 minutes for exactly 2 tanks 2 healers 1 bard 1 smn and 2 dps to hop in. Job changing in the dungeon would make for some fun - that SMN you got suck? "Hey man, do you have a healer? Switch over, I'll go to MNK that might work better."

When your party wipes, you wake up outside the dungeon and you are done, give it a 2 hour lockout and make the first 5 encounters worth while for the gil and crafting mats alone. Just make it so that you wouldn't mind going in with newer players to get those rewards, but if you can go in with your static, you have a chance to make it 11-12 encounters is and get 2 sands, an i95 Allagan weap, and an extreme mount before you die.

Encounters 1-5 would be pretty easy, with 1 being like an Alex chest and 5 being something like 2 A-rank hunts at once. 6 would start in with scaled down S-ranks for your rare boss encounters and something akin to 20 level 55 Dullahans spawning 10 seconds apart for your regular encounters. Maybe you run into Aclepius and 6 Hygeias on encounter 8 with a 4 minute death-clock.

I personally think this would be mega-fun, I know it would probably be a lot of dev time, but I'd be willing to fore-go content like chocobo leveling and the useless 4-man dungeons we get with each patch to see something like this in 2.6 or 3.0

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Originally Posted by Ehayte

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I approve this message. This would make for a lot of fun and would, as Ehayte has suggested, keep people coming back for more as each time you go in, there will be something different.

Right now, once you have the mechanics of a Dungeon/Raid down, it's just rinse and repeat and gets boring after a few clears.

+1 from me!

Sounds like a really fun idea! Almost like a survival mode dungeon with scaling enemies/rewards for how much further you can progress. +1 OP

LOL - you mean, can they take "inspiration" from that other game franchise they own and operated for 11 years already? FFXI has Nyzul Isle with "randomized" floor. Personally they should just copy some of ToAU and Seekers of Adoulin content such as skirmish and delve and put it here. I am all about catering to the casuals, but the game need a middle section content to bridge the super happy casuals and super hardcore.

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Originally Posted by Luvbunny

LOL - you mean, can they take "inspiration" from that other game franchise they own and operated for 11 years already? FFXI has Nyzul Isle with "randomized" floor. Personally they should just copy some of ToAU and Seekers of Adoulin content such as skirmish and delve and put it here. I am all about catering to the casuals, but the game need a middle section content to bridge the super happy casuals and super hardcore.

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I never played FFXI, but I did play Everquest 1, which had LOTS of open world dungeons that had some similar elements. I LIKE the way FFXIV is designed so far, its a good game. The #1 thing missing is variety in the content that people repeat. Everything that has good (read: interesting) rewards on a weekly basis is the same thing every time, for a chance at the same set of rewards.

I think this would certainly bridge casual/hardcore because with a 2 hour lockout, its not so severe that uber_elite_01 wouldn't want to run it with their fresh 50 buddy. The first 5 encounters would be worth while for all players (gil, crafting mats to sell, materia to sell, etc), and the real substantial rewards that actually make your character more powerful will require a mixture of skill and effort. If your team is totally badass, you could make it rain extreme mounts and i105 gear for your alt-classes. And by i105 I mean that to be the scale of gear it would drop in today's world, if this would be 2.6 I would expect it to be... I dunno, 115-125.

Want more attention. Give.

Sounds like your classic "side game" that you see in many multiplayer games i.e zombie mode, survival, etc. I like the idea but would like to add power-ups upon defeating mobs like "Full Cure" or "Attack Boost" that will add dimension to the game. Large arenas with multiple levels (similar to T2) with random enemy spawn points will keep the party on their toes. Combined with power ups dropping from random enemies and places on the map you as a player and as party need to decide whether to risk running across the map for a "Full Cure" but run into a possible ambush or try to stick it out in your area with dwindling MP/HP/TP.

Either way this would be an awesome addition to the game.

This would be so cool for expansion content :0 or maybe even a major patch. It seems as if each patch has an open world thing or glamor/mini game thing to do: 2.1 Wolve's Den/Beast tribe/Treasure Hunt/Housing. 2.2 Big Fishing/Gardening/Retainer Ventures/Glamour 2.3 Desynthesis/Hunts/Chocobo Training/Frontlines. 2.4 Who knows? 2.5 Golden Saucer/bahamut's scar? ;)

I like this idea except for the 'change jobs while in the instance'. It would too easily become a requirement for anyone who wants to get very far to have 1 healer 1 tank 1 melee DD and 1 ranged DD all leveled and geared.

"System limitations" "ps3 blah blah blah "too complicated for newer players" "etc.. etc.." can already see the slew of excuses from the devs on this. Good ideas though I like them

I wouldn't mind seeing this as well. It sounds really fun and it's something I think a lo tof people would enjoy. I do think the lockout of 2h is a bit low. Maybe 6h. Don't think primal mounts or allagan weapons should be dropping from there... atleast not the existing ones. Maybe some new designs.

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Originally Posted by Marxam

SI like the idea but would like to add power-ups upon defeating mobs like "Full Cure" or "Attack Boost" that will add dimension to the game.

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I actually have to disagree with you there - to me that would take away from using player skill and it would segregate it from the core gameplay. If you got temporary echo buffs or free cures, etc, it wouldn't teach you to be a BA as your own class, it wouldn't test you to see how far you could push your job.

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Originally Posted by Altijacek

This would be so cool for expansion content :0 or maybe even a major patch.

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I mean - would it be awesome if they put something like this is? Absolutely. Would it even be possible before 3.0? Probably not. It doesn't seem to be gaining much steam so I doubt its even going to get a serious look or anything.

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Originally Posted by Cutie_McSnuggles

I like this idea except for the 'change jobs while in the instance'. It would too easily become a requirement for anyone who wants to get very far to have 1 healer 1 tank 1 melee DD and 1 ranged DD all leveled and geared.

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Eh, I think with just a 2 hr lockout people aren't going to want to wait for 40 minutes to an hour to get the right mix. Just grab 5-8 people and go, if you only get 4-6 rooms down, oh well, you probably made 40k gil and got a few crafting items to sell or maybe even a minion or mount.

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Originally Posted by DenariusJay

"System limitations" "ps3 blah blah blah "too complicated for newer players" "etc.. etc.." can already see the slew of excuses from the devs on this. Good ideas though I like them

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Yeah, I know. Eventually they will have to break on one of those excuses. I can only speak anecdotally and on my own behalf but I am getting really really bored with this game. I'm logging in for coil and to deal with coil related static replacements, etc. I know that right now we are the farthest away from new meaningful content, but I think people are getting more and more despondent with this game the longer it holds this formula that is, admittedly, OK but not great.

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Originally Posted by ruskie

Don't think primal mounts or allagan weapons should be dropping from there... atleast not the existing ones. Maybe some new designs.

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Why not give people the option to get those items from outdated content without having to do the outdated content?

That being saiiiid.... If they did reskin, it would be cool to use materia for something new:

Scarred Allagan Blade - would be a useless i105 weapon with no stats and 1 weapon damage. Unequipable of course, and would look like a boring version of the Allagan Blade.

BUT - it would have one single materia slot, with a 25% chance of a successful meld, and only T4 materia will work. When you successfully meld any materia of your choice, you get "Scarred Allagan Blade of ________". In my ideal world, the stat WOULD NOT just be the materia's stat. For instance, if you inserted a Vitality IV materia into the Scarred Allagan Blade, it might be:

Scarred Allagan Blade of Vitality - i105
Phys Dmg: 50 | Magic Dmg: 37
STR: 28
VIT: 33
Accur: 23
Par: 23
+5% to healing received while equipped

OR, for a Skill Speed IV

Scarred Allagan Blade of Deftness - i105
Phys Dmg: 50 | Magic Dmg: 37
STR: 28
VIT: 33
Accur: 23
Par: 23
+3% boost to Parry rate

With regards to the changing class thing, maybe make it so there are designated 'safe-spots' placed sparingly throughout the map? Think like the one in frontlines, but just in more places. They should require no aggro on mobs to enter and allow you to change classes and whatever there.

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Originally Posted by Ehayte

I actually have to disagree with you there - to me that would take away from using player skill and it would segregate it from the core gameplay. If you got temporary echo buffs or free cures, etc, it wouldn't teach you to be a BA as your own class, it wouldn't test you to see how far you could push your job.

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Perhaps randomised debuffs then? nothing too drastic of course. But if the dungeon goes until you die, it may be worth giving a helping hand in the matter. Say like a -5% party-wide HP debuff or a 3 yalm range debuff on ranged classes. Maybe turning one DPS into a frog for 10 seconds mid-battle?

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Originally Posted by Alihabra

With regards to the changing class thing, maybe make it so there are designated 'safe-spots' placed sparingly throughout the map? Think like the one in frontlines, but just in more places. They should require no aggro on mobs to enter and allow you to change classes and whatever there.

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My original idea and in the OP I would say at any point you aren't in combat. Each chamber in which you fought something would lock like a boss battle, so you can only change classes pre-combat and post-combat

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Originally Posted by Alihabra

Perhaps randomised debuffs then? nothing too drastic of course. But if the dungeon goes until you die, it may be worth giving a helping hand in the matter. Say like a -5% party-wide HP debuff or a 3 yalm range debuff on ranged classes. Maybe turning one DPS into a frog for 10 seconds mid-battle?

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For sure - that's kind of the idea behind the randomly triggered events (causing AE dmg, red zones, etc). I think everything should be temporary though (15-30 seconds), if you remember FFVII's battle arena it could sometimes become impossible to win if you got the wrong combination of debuffs. I think it accomplishes its goal of being real, meaty content only by keeping the integrity of playing your class normally in-tact.

Nyzul Isle---randomly would receive a blessing (haste, refresh, etc) or a pathos (no white magic, slow +50, etc).

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Originally Posted by AlexandeRW

Nyzul Isle---randomly would receive a blessing (haste, refresh, etc) or a pathos (no white magic, slow +50, etc).

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Mmm. Again, I wouldn't want a silly gimmick-style zone. This would be a serious run into content that scales up the further you get. This has two externalities that I think would bring a lot of benefit:

1 - It allows everyone to participate, and participate together. Good players would go into Scar with crappy people because they could carry anyone through 1-5, which would allow for some decent rewards for the 25 mins they would spend every 2 hours. Even if its 8 crappy players in there together, they could at least get 3-4 waves down which would allow them some at least gil/crafting/materia rewards.
2 - Without the buffs/debuffs, you get to learn your class that you are playing. Its meaningful enough that you have to actually try, but its reset is low enough that you can go in with your i100 SCH instead of having to bring your i109 MNK. If you get crazy buffs to your healing potency, its not going to teach you to be a good SCH. This has the benefit of getting good players in with crappy players so that crappy players can learn and get better. Nice mix of casual and hardcore.

I really like this idea and would also like to see it in the game. :)

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Originally Posted by Sanghelios

I really like this idea and would also like to see it in the game. :)

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Thanks - keep liking and posting if people want the devs to take some of these ideas into consideration!

If you want to spice it up, you could add a mode where you loot things only when you quit the dungeon (dungeon crawler mode)

For example, imagine a map with various floor, after each floor, you can choose to proceed to the next or leave.
If you leave, you get a big chest with various thing inside. The further you go, the better the reward BUT if you die in the fight (wipe) then it's over and you loose everything (or perhaps the last 3 to 5 floor's reward for example).

It would add a little gamble that could be fun.

I really like this idea. Kind of reminds me of The Endless Tower in RO, except randomized.

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Originally Posted by Aura_Shurifon

The further you go, the better the reward BUT if you die in the fight (wipe) then it's over and you loose everything (or perhaps the last 3 to 5 floor's reward for example).

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I could see this as a Bahamut's Scar Extreme mode or something, but that would definitely breed elitism in getting people together for this. One of the main reason I devised this was to think of something that wouldn't require 8 really really good players in specific roles to go in and do. If you lost everything on a wipe, I wouldn't want to take in any newbies with me; even if I was only locked out for two hours, I would still get nothing for my efforts!

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Originally Posted by Alihabra

With regards to the changing class thing, maybe make it so there are designated 'safe-spots' placed sparingly throughout the map? Think like the one in frontlines, but just in more places. They should require no aggro on mobs to enter and allow you to change classes and whatever there.



Perhaps randomised debuffs then? nothing too drastic of course. But if the dungeon goes until you die, it may be worth giving a helping hand in the matter. Say like a -5% party-wide HP debuff or a 3 yalm range debuff on ranged classes. Maybe turning one DPS into a frog for 10 seconds mid-battle?

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They could do something like Salvage in FFXI. When you enter the instance you are unable to wear armor or use ability/magic. Clearing enemies dropped items used to unlock gear slots and the use of ability/magic as you progressed through the dungeon.