WHM Needs Insta spells.

I have a whm, and I would like to know if the devs have any plans of making some of the healing spells insta cast or reducing how often someone could be stun locked. As a healer your the first one targeted first one to die, regardless of position be it front of the line or in the back behind the stone pillar popping your head out just enough to try and cas...stun. Being locked down unable to move cast or anything else except wait and die is not fun in any shape or form. Cant even try and gain any ground to heal, your just dead. WHM casts take way to long be it heal or holy if you manage to find the time to do some kind of damage instead of trying to live. Need more insta cast heals at least cure I while on the move it's just way to easy to get locked up and reduce cast time maybe even add a debuff that limits how often a player can be stunned silence paralyzed slowed every half a second. I think it would be better if the whole stun lock thing was removed, why cant people just bash each others brains out with a few healing spells. You just don't need silence, paralyzed, slow, blind, sleep ect in pvp.

Hate to say this, but you just need to get more experience. WHM heals are amazing in PvP with the right group / support.

Take a look at thisand this. FFXIV's PvP healing is a different beast from most other MMOs. I absolutely hated it at first/ and if you look far enough back in the forums I'm sure you'll find me bitching somewhere about it. However, once I got some experience and got in the groove of things it became insanely fun and rewarding. You have to find a balance between staying nimble, effectively healing and, of course, properly managing your cooldowns. Give it some time.

well if we are talking about interrupts, i havent seen any game yet with so many interrupts. as a healer myself if i get like 2 people on me i will probably never be able to cast any heal. in 2 second i would just get interrupted 2-3 times.
of course there's a lot about being skilled. but if you get that #1 mark on you, it's going to be a hell.

surecast, quickcast, equanimity are all ways around the stun. also there is no way in hell whm need an instacast heal because that would require them to revamp the entire class to have some sort of charge like aetherflow. i would agree with you if scholars could run around spamming lustrate but we AT BEST get 6 uses of that skill and chances are in if you need more then 1 or 2 you will likely be dead anyways.

I just go into frontlines now if I think my character needs a nap.
Seem to just spend the whole time asleep thanks to the stupid black mages >.<

And of course, the other healer is too busy running for their lives to use esuna/leeches.

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Originally Posted by Akyio

well if we are talking about interrupts, i havent seen any game yet with so many interrupts. as a healer myself if i get like 2 people on me i will probably never be able to cast any heal. in 2 second i would just get interrupted 2-3 times.
of course there's a lot about being skilled. but if you get that #1 mark on you, it's going to be a hell.

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The main difference between SCH and WHM is that SCH needs to "stop" to heal and can do so because of its shields. WHM has to be more slippery. Even though CC has been gimped from the previous patch, I see too many new WHMs trying to stand still and spam Cure 2.

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Originally Posted by jlewiss

surecast, quickcast, equanimity are all ways around the stun. also there is no way in hell whm need an instacast heal because that would require them to revamp the entire class to have some sort of charge like aetherflow. i would agree with you if scholars could run around spamming lustrate but we AT BEST get 6 uses of that skill and chances are in if you need more then 1 or 2 you will likely be dead anyways.

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skills to solve "the stun" that doesnt do crap when you have 2+ people on you and your group isn't actually trying to help the healers leaving you stun locked by 2 paladins 3 bards and a black mage. like I said first targeted first dead, enemy players see WHM or SCH that's who they go after. maybe it wouldnt be so bad if they never actually displayed job names to everyone. sadly this is every frontlines group iv seen, its not a battle ground its more a free for all and healers are at the bottom in it. they really need to remove crowd controls all together. I may keep suffering through and do minimal anything just to try and score the wins for the mount then after that, Im done...pvp here isn't fun at all, used to be fun in wow til again CC's became this rage now that sucks too.

Sooo.....
Have you ever tried swiftcast stone skin then PoM chain healing?
You guys obviously have no clue on the multiple uses of stonekin in the game.
Stoneskin can:
- absorb damage
- negate most debuffs
( ignoring high voltage in T2)
-prevent repel in demon wall fight
- negate interruptions
(I.e a monk punching you in pvp )
- retain the max 18% shield of your hp at the time you casted stoneskin. (I.e use VIT potion before casting stoneskin )
-can be a better alternative if shroud is on CD and you are 1 cure away from grabbing hate.
* chain stoneskinning on tank till ur emnity drops to a safe level.
Ti'm pretty sure there are more uses than i listed lol.

But ! Most of these ONLY work if your hp is high enough as the stoneskin magic will only work if your shield's current hp is higher than the attack recieved.

sooo..
again seeing as regardless if im in the front of everyone or in the back i get swarmed by everyone again targeted first dead first getting one spell off is short of a miracle. so if you know of a way to cast a spell while running im all ears

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Originally Posted by Valthein

sooo..
again seeing as regardless if im in the front of everyone or in the back i get swarmed by everyone again targeted first dead first getting one spell off is short of a miracle. so if you know of a way to cast a spell while running im all ears

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we both already gave you suggestions. if your solo healing I agree it tends to be more difficult but not impossible to do. 2 or even 3 healers though there is no reason you should be having problems. There are way too many healers saying they aren't having a problem for you to make the magical exception. Really learn to use your skills and get comfortable with them.

They do not need instant casts, should not get instant casts, and will never get instant casts.

In one cast, WHM can heal themselves or everyone around them to full from near death. It would take a DPS/Tank a good 6-10 GCDs to take people down to the point where ONE of a WHM's spells might fully heal them. So, AT MOST, you should only be able to pull off ONE cast-time heal every 4-5 GCDs on average for balancing purposes. And, with the amount of people that target and CC healers, that's about right where it is with proper CD usage.

WHM is balanced around having 1-2 people on them pretty much full time. If a WHM has more than that, and they're not being assisted by their teammates, then it is not WHM being weak that caused their death, they died because their team doesn't know good teamwork. If a WHM dies to 1-2 people, then the WHM either got outplayed or was at a cooldown disadvantage.

In the end, healers SHOULD die. They should never be able to sustain everyone indefinitely, or even for a long time, unless they are let to freecast. It is bad for PvP to have healers who are able to survive being focused for prolonged periods of time or that can completely negate the disadvantages of a focused caster by having instant cast spells.

In PvP, a healer's role is not to stave off death entirely, but rather to slow it down.

I don't understand, so you just wan't WHMs to not be bothered and have free reign to heal without any interruption and remove crowd control so they can become unstoppable? lol?

Yeah i'm thinking maybe healing in pvp just isnt for you, have you tried any other classes yet? i noticed you have a Bard, Bards are quite fun to play frontlines and as you know their attacks are all instant, you'll still be subject to crowd control like everyone else, but that's what purify is for, and tbh the thought of removing crowd control in pvp is one of the most silliest things i have ever heard.

But in case you still wan't to play WHM, here are a list of instant heals/casts and general defensive skills a whm has...

Regen, instant
Benediction, full heal, instant
Swiftcast> medica/cure II etc.
Esuna, nigh instant, heavy and binds mean little to healers
Divine seal, instant, best used in conjunction with regen or medica II
Sacred Prism, instant AOE, nullifies 40% physical damage and heals any teammate who enters for 30s(upgraded)
Aetheric Burst, instant, decreases enemy skill speed by up to 50% for 15s(upgraded)
Attunement, instant, 10s of nigh-immortality at the cost of becoming a statue, counters burst
Divine Breath, insta raise
Presence of mind, instant, 15s of increased spell speed
Fluid Aura, instant, great ability for pvp, 6s bind with a knockback for insta kills off the heliodrome, fun times
Repose, single target sleep, best used right after fluid aura or with surecast
Surecast, instant, casts only stoppable by stuns and silence
Equanimity, instant, basically 15s of surecast
E4E, instant, best used on a fellow healer if you think he may get focused by melee/tanks
Virus, instant, well...it's something...
Sprint, instant, you can use it freely without penalty, melee and bards can't, they can only counter it with weapon throw or waste their tp cooldowns. All the good WHMs i see move alot when focused, zig-zagging to avoid melee and not allow them to get their positionals, or straight up running away from battle for a while and sneaking back when their attackers lose interest.

Then of course there are other factors in your survival, such as friendly tanks peeling off your attackers with stuns and using cover/tetsudo to protect you, your team can even counter focus your attackers or use sleep/bind to stop them in their tracks, also you are top priority in your fellow healers eyes.

So yeah, WHM need no buffs or any more insta heals whatsoever in frontlines, some people even say healers are a little too OP as you can probably tell by all the threads lately.
If you don't like being focused and the center of attention, then play dps, IMO it's way funner than healing and nowhere near as stressfull.

actually dont play this guy anymore, have a different character working on other classes. still say cc's should be removed completely hell remove healing too just make it a body count to see who wins. much perfer that over this, so ill be the one prolly queing up running around the battle grounds hoping to get carried. lack of teamwork and coordination makes healers weak yes and thats why i say need heals we can cast on the run or insta, no ones going to help protect and defend healers while having an entire 8 man squad pounce on them then they need to be re worked. most of you saying healing is fine are probably in static pvp groups. dont have that luxury hell dont even have the luxury for a static raid and i still say healers should be buffed or remove healing and cc altogether from pvp.

Whm buff on pvp?! are you f*cking you serious?
Edit: Sorry for being rude, i just got out of a frontlines match against 4 whms. But i kinda mean it its ridiculous how whms are op on pvp.

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Originally Posted by Valthein

no ones going to help protect and defend healers while having an entire 8 man squad pounce on them then they need to be re worked.

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Sorry to break it to you, but that's not how balancing works. Not assisting your healers? That's called being bad at PvP. If your entire team is bad enough at PvP to not assist healers, then your team DESERVES to lose, because, obviously, you're being massively outplayed by a team that DOES assist their healers.

A healer should NOT be able to literally hold their own against more than 2 people for more than the duration of their "oh shit" cooldowns without assistance. The entire point of group content is that everyone is reliant on the rest of their group, and to change that would be a very bad thing. It would completely destroy any semblance of balance in the game and would mean that healers were the be all end all role of PvP. No. Never. Stop.

Healers are fine. WHM is fine. The problem is not the class, it's the team and/or the person playing the healer.

Now, if you're arguing that it's not FUN, then that's your opinion and you're entitled to it. I don't know what it FEELS like, because I don't play healer, but I'm in no rush to try it, either, because I don't think it'd be my style of play, in PvE nor PvP. If you're not enjoying healing in PvP, then you should just play something other than a healer. Who knows, maybe one day they'll find a way to make it more fun for you to play healer without breaking the game's balance, but, until then, it is how it is and you can only adapt or quit.

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Originally Posted by Valthein

Wall of text.

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God, this wall of texts is killing me, good luck to your other job with that mindset.

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Originally Posted by Yumi_umi

Sooo.....
Have you ever tried swiftcast stone skin then PoM chain healing?
You guys obviously have no clue on the multiple uses of stonekin in the game.
Stoneskin can:
- absorb damage
- negate most debuffs
( ignoring high voltage in T2)
-prevent repel in demon wall fight
- negate interruptions
(I.e a monk punching you in pvp )
- retain the max 18% shield of your hp at the time you casted stoneskin. (I.e use VIT potion before casting stoneskin )
.

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I enjoyed your post. Its nice to see someone who understands the class well. There are many unique things you can do as a WHM to keep yourself alive. Try out your pvp skills. Try out some of those other skills that you dont use much. You might find they all have a use.

A lot of people talk like you can simply not get interrupted in this game when in reality it's easier said than done. Yes, swiftcast helps..but it has a 60 second cooldown. Surecast is good too..but it can be canceled by a stun. Casting stoneskin wont help much if you have people hitting you too much..which strips away the buff in two or so seconds thus leading to you being interrupted even more. Out of all the MMO's i've played. This one literally has the most interruptions of them all combined. In the others, a stun, gank, or a big hit (or crit) will interrupt a cast. Here..literally a smack from a smn pet will interrupt your skills and of course no one will agree with this because they're too busy thinking healers are "op". BLM's are op..yet I haven't seen anyone complain about them.

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Originally Posted by Seoulstar

[things about interrupts]

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Personally, I wish they'd just go the WoW route with interrupts for PvP. Give all melee the same short-CD PvP skill interrupt while leaving interrupt chance on incoming melee hits the exact same it is against PvE mobs (where there's only a small change of interruption). Balance healers and casters in PvP around this factor and... Boom! Best of both worlds, imo.

Though, at the very least, ACH/BRD and all class Pets (ARC/SMN stuff and any future class pets) should not automatically interrupt. Melee have to work to stay in range to keep up interrupts, BRD do not, and, hell, pet interrupts are passive crowd control, which is a terrible mechanic to see in PvP.

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Originally Posted by RoseyRed

stuff

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You forget Stone that can do 12 sec heavy effect :P

Generally i find that the healers who complain that they die instantly are:

1: Terrible
2: Sporting a tiny 3.5k hp
3: Both

Guess what guys? you're a tank in pvp, start building some tank items so you don't get melted

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Originally Posted by Tralaix

Snip.

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Been playing tank whm ever since i got my relic.
I kinda thought it\\'d be interesting to go down the path and theory craft/ test it out on multiple things. Found some really interesting things that can help failing parties i\\'m in not fail lol.
Also i remember i used to do this in wolves den before the skills unlock patch.
I would put sacred prism out then pop my upgraded duration equnamity and spam stoneskin.
I felt like the four winds bosses as my stoneskin never broke literally lol.
Had the dps and tank bash on me trying to kill me looool.
But my hp was high enough for it to sustain till the next stoneskin refresh.
I had shroud and mana draw so it was like stoneskin all day baby. XD
If all else failed i would attunement then fluid aura highest damager and virus them.

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Originally Posted by tehomegaking

You can live just fine with 3.5k hp. HP does not compensate for lack of skill.

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Never said it did, thats why there was a "both" option in my post

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Originally Posted by Yumi_umi

Sooo.....
Have you ever tried swiftcast stone skin then PoM chain healing?
You guys obviously have no clue on the multiple uses of stonekin in the game.
Stoneskin can: ...

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Stoneskin should never be used with swiftcast, EVER. The shielding never even comes close to that of cure 2 or medica 2 and even with full vit accessories and full vit stats, it is still weaker than a non crit cure 2. If you have 2 or more DPS on you, it will break immediately unless the dps are just horrible, which in that case you can just regen and kite easily.

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Originally Posted by Slib

Stoneskin should never be used with swiftcast, EVER. The shielding never even comes close to that of cure 2 or medica 2 and even with full vit accessories and full vit stats, it is still weaker than a non crit cure 2. If you have 2 or more DPS on you, it will break immediately unless the dps are just horrible, which in that case you can just regen and kite easily.

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Generally yes, but if you have nearly full hp and someone's about to LB you, you can get stoneskin up to soften the blow 9 times out of 10 (or you can attune)

Completely disagree with topic starter. When I go on my WHM, I heal around 200-400k depending on how good my team is. They don't need an instant cast healing spell lol.

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Originally Posted by Slib

Stoneskin should never be used with swiftcast, EVER. The shielding never even comes close to that of cure 2 or medica 2 and even with full vit accessories and full vit stats, it is still weaker than a non crit cure 2. If you have 2 or more DPS on you, it will break immediately unless the dps are just horrible, which in that case you can just regen and kite easily.

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Yeah i was under the impression that the best thing to do when being focused as a WHM is

Divine Seal + Swiftcast Medica II and Regen while running around and using PvP abilities and the occasional surecast/equinimity

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Originally Posted by Sen_Terrechant

Yeah i was under the impression that the best thing to do when being focused as a WHM is

Divine Seal + Swiftcast Medica II and Regen while running around and using PvP abilities and the occasional surecast/equinimity

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Regen -> swiftcast holy -> surecast medica II -> cleric stance + PoM -> HOLY HOLY HOLY HOLY

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Originally Posted by CeveArthu

Regen -> swiftcast holy -> surecast medica II -> cleric stance + PoM -> HOLY HOLY HOLY HOLY

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That sounds like a way to get killed. Every WHM that ive seen even attempting to use holy offensively has been melted. Plus diminishing returns after the first Holy means it isnt doing much.

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Originally Posted by Sen_Terrechant

That sounds like a way to get killed. Every WHM that ive seen even attempting to use holy offensively has been melted. Plus diminishing returns after the first Holy means it isnt doing much.

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Most white mages run in like morons and just assume their team is ready.

Most healers have around 35% less HP than I have, I'd wager that other pvp healers who frequent the forum will have even more hp than me