And you blame SE for implementing Hunts?

Have you tried doing an advanced search with the words "notorious monsters" on these forums?

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...rious+Monsters

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...rious+Monsters

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...rious+Monsters

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http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...rious+Monsters

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...rious+Monsters

And these are only the results of the first ten pages, with the search restricted to "threads only".

What I'm trying to get at is: people wanted this. It's not SE's fault. The Hunts right now aren't working simply because (cheating aside) everyone wants to do it.

Give it the time to cool off and you will see NMs will be as enjoyable as they can be when the whole world isn't jumping on them. Look forward to the XIV version of Argus, coming soon! ;)

It's actually not bad playing on NZ/Aus times on a NA server. Last night in Coerthas there were only two hunt groups and they wiped a few times. Chat was amusing, but quite civil.

If SE listened to the forums I'd have multiple atma weapons by now.


...and a bigger butt.

Hunts are a great idea.
However the implementation is a bit wrong as the rewards are too high.

Many players are making it their main focus. Thats not how it should be.

If you stumble across a mark and could either solo a B mark, or shout for a bit of help for a A or S from players in that zone.
That would would be good.

But we have teams of players who are doing nothing but swarming on every mark. Destroying it in seconds. Not as intended.

Reduce the reward so although beneficial, it's not the main focus. Keep people doing raids and dungeons.

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Originally Posted by Scotchio

Reduce the reward so although beneficial, it's not the main focus. Keep people doing raids and dungeons.

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The amusing thing is a lot of people hated the fact that dungeons and raids (Really, anything instanced) was so much of the main focus that the open world was simply a lobby, akin to my League of Legends client when I'm not on the Rift.

We don`t blame SE for adding Notorious Monsters/Mark Hunts.

We blame SE for adding them in the worst way possible.

Peopel would be doign dungeon if they drop more than material

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Originally Posted by Scotchio

Hunts are a great idea.
However the implementation is a bit wrong as the rewards are too high.

Many players are making it their main focus. Thats not how it should be.

If you stumble across a mark and could either solo a B mark, or shout for a bit of help for a A or S from players in that zone.
That would would be good.

But we have teams of players who are doing nothing but swarming on every mark. Destroying it in seconds. Not as intended.

Reduce the reward so although beneficial, it's not the main focus. Keep people doing raids and dungeons.

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Lets keep in mind that not all suggestion or requests = good/necessary suggestions or requests. Likewise, not all manners of implementation = the proper manner of implementation. With that said, as things are implemented, unforeseen things can happen, and they need to be adjusted around the response and actions of the playerbase; as well as around the activity and lack of activity of the playerbase.

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Originally Posted by Alexander_Dragonfang

We don`t blame SE for adding Notorious Monsters/Mark Hunts.

We blame SE for adding them in the worst way possible.

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QFT!!!

/10char

Ain't gonna change anytime soon....

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Originally Posted by Alexander_Dragonfang

We don`t blame SE for adding Notorious Monsters/Mark Hunts.

We blame SE for adding them in the worst way possible.

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Honestly this.

Just because they added something that was and is massively in demand doesn't mean they chose the best method of implementing it.

It's great that they did add it, but the system still needs tuning.

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Originally Posted by TheUltimate3

The amusing thing is a lot of people hated the fact that dungeons and raids (Really, anything instanced) was so much of the main focus that the open world was simply a lobby

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I still do. Outside of a hot-joinable game like the original PSO that does the concept right, I hate instances, so anything that shifts the game away from a focus on those is welcome. Even if the hunts have... issues...
Plus, I really loathe the idea of trying to herd people into a particular type of gameplay. Trying to push me into content I dislike is only going to push me away from the game entirely. :-/

A lot of FFXI players wanted NMs in a sense where you would camp 1 spot and the mob would spawn but the thing that many FFXI players wanted is only 1 party to have claim on the said NM. However a most NMs weren't hard in FFXI either the hardest part was getting the claim.

I didn't really enjoy NMs in FFXI because I wasted like 3 hours camping Fafnir only to be outclaimed by one of the other 150 people there.

Marks are going to kill the game. People are literally only doing marks day after day and all day, once their gear is fully upgraded etc.. they will not only have nothing to achieve, but they will also have burned themself out to the point there is no joy in playing. Seriously, I've seen things like this on so many games... that it upsets me that SE is actually let it happen to this.

This is the downfall of FFXIV. It has been nothing but going up since launch.. and it makes me sad.

People act like the rewards are going to stay the same in 2.4. Like they wont go back down like they've done every progression patch when they release new gear/weapons/coil. Used to hear complaints all the time about weekly lockouts/little open world content. SE sets it free in the catch-up patch and now it's QQing about that.

Yes people wanted Hunts but the way they implement these was very bad.

I feel like there's nothing wrong with the hunt and 99% of the problem are the -people- in the hunt to be honest. People are greedy, people are selfish. But at the same time people are willing to help one another and to grow together. However what you are seeing with the hunt is exactly what happens IRL with resources. Limited amounts with numerous groups fighting over one thing. Sharing in theory would be nice but someone may take it from under your nose while you are waiting for someone else to benefit. Or there's simply not enough to go around. My point is that the hunts bring out the worst and the best in human nature itself.

There's simply no way we can do hunts so that -everyone- is pleased or benefits. We could do the best we can to ensure as many people as possible do but this is oft difficult nary impossible.

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Originally Posted by Arkenaw

The customer is not always right, especially when that customer is an MMO player. Adding features just because the community wants them is terrible design. Hunts were not needed, Odin and Behemoth should have proved it doesn't work well. Not only that, but increasing their HP because the community demanded it was possibly the worst possible fix they could have added.

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Hunts were needed, they are an amazing content with an unlimited potential for players to enjoy.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-in-open-world.

Open world content is great and all, but causing a Zergfest? Lets face it the size of the maps in FFXIV, and the original idea of FFXIV is mainly on instance content, we should have saw this coming.

I think alot of the resentment stems from the fact that Hunts don't drop gear. Instead, you pick a Hunt from the bounty board and hunt it down for seals that you then use to buy the gear that people likely expected to be drops. The reason they went with seals instead of drops is the same reason people hated camping NMs in XI, the drops wound up becoming a source of strife between players. People all tying to out-camp eachother for the slim hope of getting the drop. People already complain about the atmas, imagine if you had to deal with that on a single mob on an hourly respawn schedule. The Hunt system tries to alleviate that by awarding seals and it's the seals that handle the rest of what NMs would have offered. There's also the fact you have to earn hundreds of seals, further appeasing the people complaining that gear's being handed out like candy (which it never was, but it's futile trying to tell them that).

Hunts are ok, until i heard about bogus hunters using radar apps and teleporting hacks. Disgusting to hear just to go ahead in the game. SE will never satisfy anyone until an end to this and other problems like RMT's and bots (mining with afk icons on top of them? really?) are checked and dealt with for good. Being beaten out of a mark because of a mob is one thing, even fair, but knowing that there is someone out there beating you through hacks is really below the belt.

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Originally Posted by HumsterMKX

Open world content is great and all, but causing a Zergfest? Lets face it the size of the maps in FFXIV, and the original idea of FFXIV is mainly on instance content, we should have saw this coming.

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You mean the devs should have saw this coming. Too many times now they have implemented stuff with no thought about how the players would handle/deal with it. Part of developing content for an MMO is to at least try to predict what the players will do with it, not just testing with 5 other folks and giving it the ok. I see a couple ways they can go about fixing this crap in the future, setting up a test server, or firing some of the staff and replacing them with people that can think ahead.

Yep, game is dead. I mean never before in FFXIV: ARR we were handed top-tier gear just for grinding stuff like Allagan Tomestones, and since all the Soldiery gear has the best stats everybody is getting BiS from Hunts.

Let's face it, Hunts were supposed to be a "Casual fix", as in, casual players/non-raiders needed a way of getting their i110 gear. If you look at it from a casual player POV, log in the game, do hunts for 2-3 hours max, log out, doing this you could get up to 500 allied seals assuming Hunts are the only thing you do and that you don't miss any mark (which is really not likely). Treated like the casual content it's supposed to be, it's working as intended.

The main issue is hardcore players (aka players the Hunt's rewards weren't directed at exclusively) people who, since have probably already cleared coil for the week, have nothing left to do and no-life Hunts. People being greedy, wanting to have all the new items you can get with allied seals, is also a problem, but is one SE can't fix.

If you are one of "those" raiders, you can still look down people with only Soldiery gear since you have High Allagan so you will still feel special, there is really no downside.

How about making roulettes give allied seals as well? It will actually make people go back to doing roulettes since I'm pretty sure anyone doing Hunts cap myth and sold while doing them.

the hunt are not ok, it's not playing, we are most of the time waiting...and when finally we get to find one of this prey....they are zerg by tons of player.
the idea of the NM it's as bas as it can be. the FATE was a zerg when it was the best way to level up, it was easy to see it coming with the hunt.

i still don't see why we get more and more stuff a la FF11, when we are in FF14: ARR, not FF11-2! why they don't have used the leves system that ingame, if it was not good, update it and make it better. because if you don't level up craft and gather.... the leves are simply useless!
by the way, why add NM when we had already FATE Boss, that are actually the ancient NM of the V1? they loose of sight that the game is not only for the nostalgic nor the japanese player. NM are the worst content in a mmorpg like FF14 with soo little area.

the solution? easy, get ride of all the mechanic of NM, make the prey FATE special for the hunter only level 50. get the daily contract to be treated like Leves... and more important rethink the price/reward ratio.
like this you will still have the hunt and get something that everybody can do without fall into something stupid as the NM!

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Originally Posted by RunaRugar

Yep, game is dead. I mean never before in FFXIV: ARR we were handed top-tier gear just for grinding stuff like Allagan Tomestones...

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I'm not sure if you're being serious (One can never be certain when reading text on the internet, so forgive me if I've misread you). Do you recall in patch 2.0 and 2.1 when Allagan tomestones of Mythology gave us item level 90 gear, which was equivalent to the item level 90 gear from the Binding Coil of Bahamut?

At that time, players were, as you put it, "handed top-tier gear for just grinding out Allagan tomestones."

Just my opinion, but the introduction of the Hunt is merely taking us back to the balance of 2.1.

There was top item level gear found in the coil, and there was top item level gear found outside the coil. If you wanted BiS, you needed a combination of both. I didn't see any of this complaining when casual players could have top level gear then (although it required lots of grinding, like it does for the Hunt), so why is the world coming to an end now?

Sorry, next time I will include "/sarcasm" at the end, I know it can be difficult to convey the right tone when its on text. It was a simple satire of people going all "QQ THEM BADS GETTING i110 GEAR. OMG DEAD GAME IS DEAD" since back then we were given top tier gear easier (since it was just a tome grind) than now (tome + allied seals grind).

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Originally Posted by Alexander_Dragonfang

We don`t blame SE for adding Notorious Monsters/Mark Hunts.

We blame SE for adding them in the worst way possible.

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Notorious Monsters, Open World, non-FATE, rewards that are worth something, unrestricted... Exactly what people wanted.
And SE even said that hunts were not even planned originally, but is a result of player feedback.

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Originally Posted by Nekodar

Notorious Monsters, Open World, non-FATE, rewards that are worth something, unrestricted... Exactly what people wanted.
And SE even said that hunts were not even planned originally, but is a result of FF11's player feedback.

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i have correct you, because that the true actually.

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Originally Posted by Arkenaw

It seemed kinda obvious to me, lol.

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I've seen people far more serious about far more outrageous things... The internet is a scary place... :(

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Originally Posted by Nekodar

Notorious Monsters, Open World, non-FATE, rewards that are worth something, unrestricted... Exactly what people wanted.
And SE even said that hunts were not even planned originally, but is a result of player feedback.

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I'm not a fan of FFXI's timed spawn/placeholder NMs, but let's be serious. No one who wanted FFXI style NMs wanted to see a massive chocobo stampede rushing around from zone to zone zerging down mobs in seconds. Hunts in their current form are more like FATEs with a different name than they are like FFXI's NMs.

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Originally Posted by Lionhand

Hunts are ok, until i heard about bogus hunters using radar apps and teleporting hacks. Disgusting to hear just to go ahead in the game. SE will never satisfy anyone until an end to this and other problems like RMT's and bots (mining with afk icons on top of them? really?) are checked and dealt with for good. Being beaten out of a mark because of a mob is one thing, even fair, but knowing that there is someone out there beating you through hacks is really below the belt.

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Agree. This makes the situation worst and as long as such program exist this will make hunts unfair to those player who wants to do them legit.

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Originally Posted by Spellbinder

Do you recall in patch 2.0 and 2.1 when Allagan tomestones of Mythology gave us item level 90 gear, which was equivalent to the item level 90 gear from the Binding Coil of Bahamut?

At that time, players were, as you put it, "handed top-tier gear for just grinding out Allagan tomestones."

There was top item level gear found in the coil, and there was top item level gear found outside the coil. If you wanted BiS, you needed a combination of both. I didn't see any of this complaining when casual players could have top level gear then (although it required lots of grinding, like it does for the Hunt), so why is the world coming to an end now?

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And the game was probably dead then too, oh wait, she's back, and the game is dead again?

Hardcore Final Fantasy fans, who want to play a Final Fantasy MMO, have two places to go, here or back to XI, they can do what they want, people will probably stay here.

I don't mean anyone insult or malice, but XI was dead in 2006, STO and SWTOR were both dead some time back, and surprisingly im still waiting for any of those to stop breathing.

Hunts are a drunken donnybrook brawl in an 1860's saloon, but they wont be the end of XIV.

Spellbinder gets it.

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Originally Posted by Susanoh

I'm not a fan of FFXI's timed spawn/placeholder NMs, but let's be serious. No one who wanted FFXI style NMs wanted to see a massive chocobo stampede rushing around from zone to zone zerging down mobs in seconds. Hunts in their current form are more like FATEs with a different name than they are like FFXI's NMs.

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What did you think would happen?
They were certainly not going to make the "Notorious Monsters" claimable so that only one party could get anything from them by being first.
If they had made them with pop items instead, there would have been other complaints how it's not truly open world, bla bla.

If they hadn't made the rewards high and relevant, there would have been complaints that it wasn't worth doing.

If they had made them with any kind of lockout, there would have been complaints...


There are plenty of things they could do to make the current system better, but what we got is essentially what people asked for. People that shot down anyone that voiced concerns about how it would turn into a mess like we have now.

I am not fond of this hunt system, it has exposed much of the dark side of humanity in this game some people like to call community.

I am an older gamer (52), perhaps because I have always worked heavy labor jobs I have developed a "kick down a wall and walk out of here" mentality.

SE and the players will work this out, me, I like to hit things until they stop moving, it isn't broke so I don't fix it.

Log in and get your weapons and gear, go hunt, have fun.

At the risk of being too realistic, go get the job done.

This hunt system sucks, show them it wont stop you.

When I have a bad day sometimes I take my trusty warchicken to one of the strongholds and just try to get killed, the right spot in lvl 50 mob areas with a fate boss and tightly packed adds ocassionaly gets that job done,, great way to shed stress.

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Originally Posted by Lamentations

I am not fond of this hunt system, it has exposed much of the dark side of humanity in this game some people like to call community.

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I have to object here. While -some- players are certainly making colossal anuses out of themelves (fake S-rank shouts, general hunt-related trolling, pulling a mark when the person who actually found the damn thing elected to send out a shout and wait for a decent group of people to have a chance to come get it, and of course the hackers) I've also seen a LOT of really good play. Maybe it's just because I tend to hunt "off-hours" and do things at least semi-old-fashioned (I'm not in a hunting LS and don't plan on it, my favorite way is for a party of eight players to each search a different zone and call to the others if they find stuff) but the players I've ended up hunting with are 99% great guys. They crack jokes, they announce "here's the mob, I'm gonna pull it at XX:XX time, hurry on over!", they more than happily invite people who ask to party up unless their party's already full... I spent four hours farming marks yesterday and wound up with about 350 seals total over the run. And aside from one or two jerks who didn't want to play nice, it was a very pleasant and enjoyable time.

Saying the system sucks, or it's shown the dark side of humanity, is far FAR too simplistic a perspective to take here. There's a lot, a LOT of great playstyle and sportsmanship and community that's popped up far in excess.

... now if Square could just fix the rendering problem. T_T I was in one of the parties that downed Bonnacon yesterday and I never actually once saw him, all I could do was run around guessing at his location and spamming Flash/Scorn all over the place. While looking at about ten different area effects from people not even in my party, and waving hi to the inexplicably visible Eos and Selene some scholars from another party entirely had out.

[QUOTE=Brine_Gildchaff;2278730]I have to object here. While -some- players are certainly making colossal anuses out of themelves (fake S-rank shouts, general hunt-related trolling, pulling a mark when the person who actually found the damn thing elected to send out a shout and wait for a decent group of people to have a chance to come get it, and of course the hackers)

I stopped right here, because you agreed with me then disagreed with me, ok.

I also hunt off hours, and a group (including me) waited almost 3 minutes before a blm pulled, good people are out there and so are the bad.

I ignore the bad, but they are still there, and they make the most noise, you look at the silver linings, I see both.

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Originally Posted by Bluevann

What I'm trying to get at is: people wanted this.

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I don't think you know what notorious monsters are

because they sure aren't hunts

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Originally Posted by Lamentations

Hardcore Final Fantasy fans, who want to play a Final Fantasy MMO, have two places to go, here or back to XI, they can do what they want, people will probably stay here.

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Sorry to say you that but a lot of people who stoped the XI to go to the XIV returned to the XI... not all (far from it) but i'll say that 50% of the XI players i knew who went to the XIV returned to the XI (when i asked the reason i heard was: game too easy, no end-game...) I continue to play FFXI 2 times/week for some LS events (you know, massive event the XIV doesn't have)

Lower the reward, add higher ranks. Give us some serious marks to take down. Like S+, S++, and even S++plus. Hell give us super rare doomsday once a couple weeks multi-raid marks.

I know this isn't EQ. It's not supposed to be. But I _do_ miss the super hard mobs that require highly tuned groups/raids. So far FFXIV has nothing the currently compares to the kind of requirements EQ has for some epic mobs.

Other than that, quit your bitchin.

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Originally Posted by Nekodar

What did you think would happen?

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Depends on how they implemented it. Since they implemented it as world spawns that all drop generic currency that can be used to upgrade all soldiery equipment in the game, that can be attacked by anyone with rewards based on contribution, what we got is stampedes of players teleporting around zones zerging everything in site.

People are now acting as if this is what FFXI NM campers wanted, when the two activities are taken on in completely different ways. What we got in hunts is the same experience we had when ARR first came out and everyone was running around the popular zones zerging every fate in site, except now those FATEs have been replaced with hunt mobs. If FFXI NM campers got that experience, you're right, plenty of people would complain, but what we have now in hunts just isn't it.