Can we please have more cross class skills?

Title.

More customization in this game would be really nice...

because i want to become a full blm nuke when i cleric stance my whm. and my blm should be able to heal just as good as a whm because my whm has to dps to be considered a good whm.

/sarcasm

its fine the way it is.

Why bother with ability points when you have to choose certain ones? There is no real choice. There's no choice with cross class. The only true choice you get is what class you're going to be. I approve of the fair variety there. But like many mmo's the system alludes to choices that aren't really. It's basically a divide who is stupid/naive from those who are on the ball/experienced in mmo's. But this is a trinity centric game so I guess no harm done.

I will admit there are one or two skills that SHOULD be cross-classed just for balance's sake (Invigorate for WAR, for example), but for the most part, it is fine the way it is.

We haven't even had an expansion yet.

Expansion would include more levels, new skills, and logic would suggest more cross class abilities as well.

You could always unequip your soul crystal.

Expansion for subjobs? I'd really want this to be a thing.

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Originally Posted by HakuroDK

I will admit there are one or two skills that SHOULD be cross-classed just for balance's sake (Invigorate for WAR, for example), but for the most part, it is fine the way it is.

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If you're running out of TP on WAR you're doing it wrong. Burning out on Overpower spam on speedruns doesn't count. Plus giving them LNC skills gives them BFB...bad enough I see WARs who don't hit defensive CDs. Imagine those WARs then hitting BFB for teh leet Deeps. Keen Flurry wouldn't be bad though.

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Originally Posted by Lithera

If you're running out of TP on WAR you're doing it wrong. Burning out on Overpower spam on speedruns doesn't count. Plus giving them LNC skills gives them BFB...bad enough I see WARs who don't hit defensive CDs. Imagine those WARs then hitting BFB for teh leet Deeps. Keen Flurry wouldn't be bad though.

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Could just do what they do for every other skill in this case as well: only give certain ones. Give Invigorate, but not BfB (though I myself have no TP problems, so dont see a reason to even give Invigorate)

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Originally Posted by Canadane

You could always unequip your soul crystal.

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I know WARs who actually do this. When there's two tanks queueing up for a one-tank job (eg HM Titan), a WAR'll unequip their Soul Crystal and grab things like Blood For Blood and Raging Strikes via crossclassing. Since they already have class-unique damage buffs on top of that they actually have some potentially terrifying DPS capabilities (which is why I'm waiting for a DPS Job option for Warriors)

However, for most players that isn't an option. The cross class options you get access to generally aren't worth the loss of your Job Actions, nevermind the stat boosts.

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Originally Posted by Lithera

If you're running out of TP on WAR you're doing it wrong. Burning out on Overpower spam on speedruns doesn't count. Plus giving them LNC skills gives them BFB...bad enough I see WARs who don't hit defensive CDs. Imagine those WARs then hitting BFB for teh leet Deeps. Keen Flurry wouldn't be bad though.

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Well, if the WAR dies, there's no way to recover TP normally, whereas almost every other class has an ability (natural or CC) that restores their resources when being raised in the middle of combat. That's my biggest concern in every difficult fight. If WARs had Invigorate, that would be a lot easier for me to manage that kind of situation.

Also, the Keen Flurry wouldn't hurt much either, and Blood for Blood is a great PVP skill the way PVP strats are right now.

I'm still waiting on an explanation on how BRD can't use any healing spells, but has a healing limit break...

In 1.0, it was the other way around. Most abilities were cross-classable and only a few weren't. The original intent was for players to mix-match the class abilities to make their job. Want to be a paladin? Equip a melee weapon and add on some Conjury spells. The problem however was that it wasn't designed well enough as no one felt really unique and parties were massive zerg fests. The system simply just wasn't fun and needed a lot of work.

With the introduction of Jobs, classes were fine-tuned and specialized a tad. A lot of that freedom was removed.

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Originally Posted by Diavolo

I'm still waiting on an explanation on how BRD can't use any healing spells, but has a healing limit break...

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You answered your own inquiry. Bard has a healing LB because it lacks other healing skills.

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Originally Posted by HakuroDK

Well, if the WAR dies, there's no way to recover TP normally, whereas almost every other class has an ability (natural or CC) that restores their resources when being raised in the middle of combat. That's my biggest concern in every difficult fight. If WARs had Invigorate, that would be a lot easier for me to manage that kind of situation.

Also, the Keen Flurry wouldn't hurt much either, and Blood for Blood is a great PVP skill the way PVP strats are right now.

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In that case PLD needs it more. PLD's main AoE hate grab as well as their tank stance require MP. PLD needs TP to use their combo to recover MP.

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Originally Posted by Legacy_Wolfwood

its fine the way it is.

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Yeah, it's great. It's such a wonderfully deep system that offers lots of diversity in how I build my character. I mean just look at all the cool choices my BLM can pick from ARC!

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Originally Posted by UBERHAXED

You answered your own inquiry. Bard has a healing LB because it lacks other healing skills.

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No, I'm pretty sure it's because they only made four limit break animations and neither of the DPS ones make any sense for a bow user.

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Originally Posted by Diavolo

I'm still waiting on an explanation on how BRD can't use any healing spells, but has a healing limit break...

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Because Bard is suppose to be a support class, but sucks till end-game where are used often more. In 1.0 I believe they use to have actual buffs that gives like Phy/Magic def up and raises hp/mp for a period of time or something...Can't find previous skill list.
They removed 2 really good support skills at that. Though if a healer dies, and you have a bard they can be handy...LB system is rushed anyways.
And they kinda screwed up bard to be a DPS/Support where they should just be ranger and find a way to make a good support class fit in this game.

Edit: Forgot to mention CNJ use to be a req in 1.0, they changed it to PGL.

yeah just make it like 1.0 …..

There are a few situations where it would make more sense(for balance) to have cross-class, one of them being WAR and TP regeneration upon Raise/Ressuretion.


And as far as the BRD LB goes.. I am a firm believer of it being a balancing choice.

I don't even use all my cross class slots.

The main thing that bugs me about cross class skills, is that there aren't really cross class skills. Yes, technically you obtain them from separate classes. But everyone uses the same ones, and some of them should be givens anyway really. What healer in the right mind would not have swiftcast for example. It would just be nice for some sort of variety.

Unfortunately, I do feel FFXI is superior in this regard. The sub-job system just felt far more compelling than what we have here. Yeah... yeah yeah, you had your standard setups that were "mandated" by the community. However, it also allowed for some fun, quirky, and the occasional, "WTH, this shouldn't work but it does and it is really fun!". Most cross class abilities are basically short-term buffs and nothing more (exception of a few spells from DoMs).

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Originally Posted by rwyan

Unfortunately, I do feel FFXI is superior in this regard. The sub-job system just felt far more compelling than what we have here. Yeah... yeah yeah, you had your standard setups that were "mandated" by the community. However, it also allowed for some fun, quirky, and the occasional, "WTH, this shouldn't work but it does and it is really fun!". Most cross class abilities are basically short-term buffs and nothing more (exception of a few spells from DoMs).

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I think it worked really with certain jobs. Red Mage was a great job to customize with subjobs.

If you want this, there is a game that caters it to you 100% already out. It's called FFXI. If you want that, go there and leave here. This isn't that, and will never be that. Doing what's requested in this thread would throw class balance out of whack.

In short, if you don't like it, leave.

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Originally Posted by Insidious

If you want this, there is a game that caters it to you 100% already out. It's called FFXI. If you want that, go there and leave here. This isn't that, and will never be that. Doing what's requested in this thread would throw class balance out of whack.

In short, if you don't like it, leave.

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While this is a terrible attitude to take, I agree somewhat. This isn't a game about compelling character building. It's really more about having the ability to make a character that can do everything to the fullest. There are certainly better examples of character customization than FFXI, which isn't actually very deep in that way, but more to the point, I hope that they do make new skills post expansion CC. They made very few higher level skills cross class at the 2.0 launch and I hope that isn't indicative of their intentions to make cross class skills always be extremely accessible without getting invested in the class the skill is from. Personally I would like to see some means of differentiating players who are playing the same class, but since it's an MMO they have to be very tight with the balance. If one option is more than .05% better then everyone will flock to that and ignore anything else. I'd like to see them implement something where this isn't a problem because the paths you have to choose from are so different that you can't compare them directly.

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Originally Posted by UBERHAXED

You answered your own inquiry. Bard has a healing LB because it lacks other healing skills.

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That makes no sense. Oh man, I can't cast a basic cure spell but I can suddenly summon up some healing wind, etc. The logic is lacking.

Oh god. I'm having enough trouble as is to fit all of these skills to cross hotbar.
If you add more then at least just make them be better versions of the existing ones so we could just map them over the weaker skills.

Keeping eye on cooldowns in 2 sections of the cross hotbar is next to impossible.

To think one of the best things about the Job System was how flexible it was in term of abilities...

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Originally Posted by Insidious

If you want this, there is a game that caters it to you 100% already out. It's called FFXI. If you want that, go there and leave here. This isn't that, and will never be that. Doing what's requested in this thread would throw class balance out of whack.

In short, if you don't like it, leave.

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What an awful attitude! I think it is perfectly fair to provide feedback. There have been some many constructive things said in this thread (positive and negative). There are MANY things I like more in FF14 to FF11. That is why I am in here. If you had experienced FF14 1.0 to its fullest, you'd understand that the original version of the armory system had A LOT of potential to do great things. Unfortunately, it was one of many features poorly implemented which is why we have 2.0. Yoshida and his crew did an amazing job, but there were obviously costs and one those being the freedom in character building the original system afforded.

My main point of contention with the current system is Provoke. As a warrior I MUST 100% WITHOUT FAIL have provoke on my bar. Most end game fights have tank swapping mechanics that absolutely require provoke to do. This essentially means I lost one cross class slot to a skill I have no choice but to have, Warriors need a native provoke if this tank swapping is to continue.

FFXI did it right years ago. No limits aside to what subjob you chose and the halved level cap. It was fair and really useful, a lot of fun, just all around win-win.

I say keep jobs the way they are, highly specialized for trinity, and give classes the ability to have sub-classes for better versatility. They would both have their perks. Then again, I have not done my homework on possible balance havoc.