So about low roulette...

So... I had this happen yesterday. I got on a low level job to level it up. In the q I had my friend with his 50 bard, a random 20ish tank, and a lvl 50 scholar. the tank was pure new. This was his highest level job and we got the notice "one of your party members is new blah blah blah.." lol. So as we were in the dungeon, the scholar proceeds to try and force everyone to go their way, skip mobs, skip chest, and yell at the newer player for not "speeding". shortly after the 2nd boss, they said, "jump off the cliff, its a short cut". A reply of, "There is no point, I'm here for experience. you can take the shortcut but i'm just going to pull the mobs that way then." Then the scholar left the party to eat the penalty just because it wasn't his way.


My question is, why do some lvl 50s think they have all rights in the low roulette and to make players speed and miss exp/loot? Don't they know that the low roulette is mostly intended to help newer players complete content? If they want tomes, they could probably do 2-3 bray speeds in the same time to complete 1 whole dungeon and net an additional 90 myth...

The short answer is, "because some people are assholes"

The longer answer is, "unfortunately, some people really are just assholes"

Take a quiet joy in knowing that ultimately he got absolutely nothing out of that run because he abandoned it.

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Originally Posted by Garlyle

Take a quiet joy in knowing that ultimately he got absolutely nothing out of that run because he abandoned it.

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yeah, thats what made it worth it in the end. he wasted 15 mins in the dungeon and then had to eat the penalty.

My question is, why do some low levels think they have all rights in the low roulette and to make players go slowly and loss his time? Don't they know that the low roulette is mostly intended to help newer players complete content? If they want exp, they could probably do FATE's on that extra time and get more exp.

Because, I mean..is the same. Why can anyone enforce what he wants to the others, no matter who they are?
That aside, I don't undertand why any lvl 50 do low level roulette. I only do it when I'm leveling a class. And even when I' leveling I want to do the dungeon as fast as possible. Why? Well. Multiple reasons. It's more efficient. It's more fun. You know how fun is doing Copperbell as a SCH? It is not fun at all. I can use "Follow" a rangued DPS and Eos will do all the work for me as long as I come near my mouse from time to time to move the camera. And in higher lvl dungeons it's almost de same..."almost".

That's why I prefer big pulls. And I prefer to skip trash mobs when we can cause if you're doing roulette you get more exp if you finish in less time. At least I think so. And anyway, exp/time will be better.
But of course I don't have the right do make people do as I say. And I shoudn't , that woudn't be fair. But of course I can leave if a dungeon that I think coud take 20 minutes to a good party is going to take 60 and I don't mind to take the penalty.

I find it stupid why anyone would go into a DR expecting SR's. Even the high level or expert you get tanks that try to speed run when the other party members are under geared or lack experience.

Like you said speed running BF HM in PF would be a way better use of their time so weird they even bother with DR.

Just another turd in the DF as usual, you better off without him.

If he wants the myth tomes so bad (only thing worth you get from low lvl roulette as lvl 50) then why don't you just make a PF group and speedrun Brayflox a couple of times? You will get much more tomes in less time.

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Originally Posted by Elvin

My question is, why do some low levels think they have all rights in the low roulette and to make players go slowly and loss his time? Don't they know that the low roulette is mostly intended to help newer players complete content? If they want exp, they could probably do FATE's on that extra time and get more exp.

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Low Roulette isn't always people doing roulette. The system fits people looking for roulette into a dungeon with someone looking for that specific dungeon. The Roulette system was not designed for people to just spam for free stuff, it's there so you can get a bonus for helping someone in need.

So, if you don't want to full clear, stop doing low roulette ffs.

Simply put, it's because many max level players want to rip through whatever daily they have so they can get their tomes, and get out.

When I tank a lowbie roulette, I made it a habit to check the party. If they were all synched from and in high level gear, I ran through and busted it out. If players were lower level or new, I'll ask if they want a full clear, or a tome run (usually people don't have an issue either way, some have just warned me they have like 45 mins and have to be somewhere so you work with the situation).

Point is, lots of experienced players have run the dungeons so much that they've boiled it down to the fastest method (such as sac pulls in Coil 1-1) and get upset if anyone dares not speed run.

It sucks, but you can't fix internet nature.

Maybe one day when there are millions of more players ( hopefully ) they can have 2 different duty finders for people who want to speed run and those who are there are the sights and exp.

My general rule of thumb is - if I didn't make the party, then dont try to own it after queuing in. I can run either way, be it a speed or a standard method. Generally a low level roulette I'll go in as a mnk or a brd due to ease of combat at lower levels and the skills available versus my main of blm on end content. Plus, being on a melee dd helps ensure that if I get put in with a brd or an caster dd, that there's no issues regarding the usage of the LB for the final boss.

Joining any DF party, through intentional selection or roulette should be left up to everyone in the party. If you don't like the flow, then get out, no role is irreplaceable, no matter how wonderful of a tank, healer or dps you may think you are.

It's also why whenever I happen to go into a main scenario roulette and the tanks want to push the content ahead in a SR method, typically with at least one obviously new person to the run, I just shrug it off and let them. I've been locked out of the first fight several times due to the load times on the PS3, I truly do not even care anymore.


Party Finder was designed for this exact reason as well and this same topic will come up until the end of time most likely. If you specifically want to just speed run things, then create your own party. Unless, upon joining a party, if everyone agrees on the same flow, then great. If not, accept it or bail, but you cannot truly force anyone to play the way you want.

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Originally Posted by Elvin

if you're doing roulette you get more exp if you finish in less time. At least I think so. And anyway, exp/time will be better.

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The DR exp bonus you get in a Low Level DR is based solely upon how far down someone gets sync'd, and has nothing to do with the time spent.

If you are doing the Low Level DR for experience, the further down you get sync'd the less you may desire a full clear, but bear in mind that you are still getting experience for each kill. It may not be the 3-5 k exp you can get per kill in Aurum Vale, but if you wanted that experience then you should have queue'd directly for it. The only time you should expect a speed run, rather than a full clear, in any sub-50 dungeon is when you form the party yourself beforehand. Expect Low Level DR to dump you in with someone who selected that dungeon specifically for current level experience.

Not everyone is always in a rush. Dungeons are not "hardcore territory" by any stretch of imagination. If the majority wants to go slow, then the hardcore speedrunner is in the wrong and should either suck it up or leave (after a proper warning first, of course).

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Originally Posted by Elvin

I don't undertand why any lvl 50 do low level roulette.

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Variety in myth tome farming. Easy gil. Low level gear for glamors. Company seals without having to bash your head against the FATE wall. Challenge log completion. etc etc etc.

For low roulette:

http://i.imgur.com/laBvGgX.jpg

Yah the speed component is only tied to the "first time" completion bonus and is extremely forgiving anyways so you actually have to TRY to NOT get it if there's a first timer lol The end of dungeon exp is scaled based on sync so that all the trash+end exp in Copperbell is roughly on par with all the trash+end exp if you somehow landed in Aurum Vale. Aside from a couple of oddball detours like the dead end upstairs in Haukke or doubling back in Toto-Rak, it's normally worth it to pull as much of the trash as possible if you have people in the party after experience and not roulette tomes. If you don't like lowbie dungeons then don't do low roulette. If you're going to do low roulette then be ready for a full clear.

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Originally Posted by Legacy_Wolfwood

... proceeds to try and force everyone to go their way...

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I have seen such players since last year before roulette has been impletmented.
I think some players just got bad attitube, regardless what job or what content they were doing.

Most important was, their way was not the good way ^^;

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Originally Posted by Elvin

That aside, I don't undertand why any lvl 50 do low level roulette.

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I'm an iL91 Paladin. And I do the low roulette every day, even when I don't have time to do the hard or expert roulette. Why?

1) I like the low level dungeons.

2) I like helping out new players.

3) The rewards are kind of nice.

4) I can have a warm-up dungeon, blow the dust off my skills, before going on and running harder content with my linkshell.

Technically low level roulette = tam tara.
If you don't like then gtfo lol
Well from my experience i only got tam tara and a few titan story mode. Still have yet to get any other dungeon lol...

I seem to get Cutter's Cry more often than anything else.

DF means random members, so it is quit normal to meet different attitudes, different player skill. lv50 player want speed, new player want exp / loot, both have their rights, no one should force another to follow. Just take it easy if anyone leave DF party and wait another.

BTW, full party ignore DF penalty.

I leveled up blm recently through df roulette ... It was frustrating, not because of the wait times, but because of people skipping trash and loot.

I usually roulette as tank, so here's what I'm used to.
First I check the party. If everyone is geared, I usually pull big. If it's too hard or people don't want to do it, I ease off. No big deal.
If people are low level, then I ask if they want xp/loot. If they do, then I do a full clear at a reasonable speed. Also no big deal. It takes a bit longer but gives them a ton of xp and gear they can use.

Anyway, in almost every df I was in leveling a dps, people just skipped everything without asking or checking the party. Or the tank / healer quit if they didn't like the dungeon.

Some people are selfish and treat roulette like their personal myth farming service, rather than as a way to get a reward and have fun helping out lower level players. Not surprising, but disappointing.

I was using DF regularly in the last weeks to finish the low level dungeons for the ATMA books. Low Level Roulette is the worst of all it seems. I am always glad if the party IS low level and no other Level 50 player is around. I rather explain the dungeon to three people and wipe a few times than having to see ego players who think they shine like the Sun and everybody else must play as they think is best (for their egoistic needs).

I wonder why do they do Low Level roulette anyways? For 40 myth tomes? Ridiculous. Can have 10 more in less time doing one of the 2.2 HM dungeons. Go there to help others and bring in some time or stay out ffs.

When I am in a low level dungeon for an Atma book, I go with the pace the people who are actually on that level are setting. If they want to go in every corner because they are looking for gear, then I am on their side. Without bitching or asking to speed up and skip this or that. EXP per mob is actually really nice in these low level dungeons and it seems some of the Endgamers have forgotten about that. And forgotten their manners lol.

Take a step back and ask yourself how it was for you when you entered Sastasha or other low Level dungeons for the 1st time. Did you rush through them? Without making mistakes? I surely didn't and I assume the vast majority didn't either. Stop fishing for the best and quickest runs only. Roulette is to help people and sometimes a troublesome run can also be a satisfying one.

I feel bad for the players who actually just register to a low Level dungeon and then a Level 50 player comes in on Roulette and all he wants is a speedy run without any trouble. And if not, bitching followed by leaving or just silently leaving. I wonder what people on their 1st character think about them or if they can even understand what's going on. I mean when you are fresh, everything is interesting. Each new dungeon I unlocked was something I looked forward to a lot and I was very excited on my first runs into anything that was new to me. Overwhelming sometimes and derping from time to time. Sure. But also loads of fun. But the Level 50 roulette players can ruin such feelings in a few minutes only.

I mostly use the low level roulette for my leveling jobs so it's rare I use it on a level 50 and if I do it will be on a healing job and I'm more than happy to kill every mob in the dungeon if that's what people want to do. The deal with the roulette is I get myth for helping others in progression content. If that content is leveling then it's perfectly understandable they want to get as much exp as possible.

When the boot is on the other foot and I'm in a dungeon leveling a class I find it quite frustrating if the group skips half the dungeon, in fact it's one of the hidden perks of leveling a tank class, they usually set the pace and choose what to fight.

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Originally Posted by Kiyouma

For low roulette:

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another funny thing about that is, a SCH in low level dungeons up till like haukke CAN be the 3rd dps.
fairies can heal their way up. people totally forget that the purpose of the low lvl roulette
is to help new players and you get rewards as well. everyone wins. the lack of patience in this game is overwhelming
to say the least...i mean sheezus.

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Originally Posted by Elvin

And by the way, the key here is "to complete dungeons". That's it. It's not meant for speedruns and is not mean for skip trash mobs. But it isn't for full runs either.

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But you can use it whatever you want...

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So which is it?

What? The purpose of the low lvl roulette is to help new players? O,o?

Where did you come up with that..? The low level roulette is just another "tool" in the game to have fun. Use it do to whatever you want, exp, gils, tomes...

That may be you opinion. Maybe even a developer said that "it's nice to help new players", and of course, it'sdesigned as a system that will help replayability and the chance for low level player to complete dungeons that almost no one did anymore. But you can use it whatever you want...

And by the way, the key here is "to complete dungeons". That's it. It's not meant for speedruns and is not mean for skip trash mobs. But it isn't for full runs either. It's up to the party to decide that. Usually that means the tank. Don't like the flow? Ask to changue it. They don't want? Deal with it and try to follow it, or leave and take the 30 min.

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Originally Posted by Elvin

What? The purpose of the low lvl roulette is to help new players? O,o?

Where did you come up with that..? The low level roulette is just another "tool" in the game to have fun. Use it do to whatever you want, exp, gils, tomes...

That may be you opinion. Maybe even a developer said that "it's nice to help new players", and of course, it'sdesigned as a system that will help replayability and the chance for low level player to complete dungeons that almost no one did anymore. But you can use it whatever you want...

And by the way, the key here is "to complete dungeons". That's it. It's not meant for speedruns and is not mean for skip trash mobs. But it isn't for full runs either. It's up to the party to decide that. Usually that means the tank. Don't like the flow? Ask to changue it. They don't want? Deal with it and try to follow it, or leave and take the 30 min.

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Actually, yes, that's basically what the low level roulette is for. But even if it wasn't, most people at the level of the dungeon that you might get did NOT use roulette. They queued normally most likely, and if they're there for experience, what right do you have to rush them? Especially considering that most of the low level dungeons are there for leveling in the first place.

So yeah, you can adapt or leave, but they do have a bit more right there than the L50 who just wants to speed run.

Luxx, saying that is not for one thing neither for the other, what I'm saying is that it isn't specificaly for any of those options. Those 2 options are a posibility, and no one have any right to enforce any of them.


People saying that new players shoud shut up and do the speedrun are wrong. People saying that players who want speedruns are assholes and shoudn't do the roulette are wrong.

When you enter the roulette you can't expect anything. If you don't like the flow of the dungeons, try to changue it. Ask the tank to skip trash mobs, or ask the tank to do all the trash mobs. Whatever you want. And if they don't want to do what you want, deal with it or leave the dungeon. Just that.

And no one have more right that others, that's just something in your mind for god knows what reason. Yeah, they're probably there for experience. Or maybe just for advance on the main story. And? They're there for that, you are there for another thing. The only compulsory thing is the common goal, complete the dungeon. People doesn't have more rights for being lower or higher level, we are all players.

I am a 50 Dragoon but I also have a 33 Tank from me I know the rules of a dungeon and that is, do not piss off the Tank or healer.

Most time you get spoiled brats who think they can boss around anyone in a dungeon when really its the healers and tanks call, if the tank thinks he can hold mobs aggro and the healer can keep up with that then its the DD's job to take them down as fast as they can. When you see that kind of person again just vote to kick them or call them out of being a dick.

Funny. When I tank low level dungeons via roulette and decide to make it speedy, people are usually glad for a smooth and fast run. Of course it depends if the healer can pull his/her weight too. It offers a bit of challenge, and I think it's what people want in this game. The low level dungeons are tediously easy (even with half the party undergeared), yet so very slow. As a healer I just pop cleric stance and let my fairy do the job.

And really, do you really need that one chest with 1 potion in it and one or two trash mobs guarding it worth less than 1/10000 of your exp bar and 5-10 gil. Really, because that's what most speed runs are skipping.

/edit: And to not sound completely like a major douchebag, I do listen to my party should they want a full and complete clear

I was with my tank in toto rak (my tank is level 50, i needed this dungeon for my atma book). I begin to evade other way and chest, and some guys ask me, can we clean everything i'm here for xp.

I have answer sure, and we have clean all the dungeon and i got 3 honors at the end. The thing is to don't think about only yourself but think about other, they are here for xp, if i rush, i will do it only for me. Sometime we need to take 5 minut for clean everything, this is better than be an asshole.

Thats just a bad scholar/player (in OP's post), but not all are like that. Its rife in every dungeon and trial found through duty finder which is why I avoid it if I've got a purpose. Try your FC members or party finder instead.

It's definitely yet another growing problem with the community in this game.

To answer the question of "Why we have a low level roulette", it's absolutely to get more people into lower level dungeons.

This is especially true about those first three. Players level through the 15-20 range extremely quickly. After the first couple months, the population of level 15+ players queing for those dungeons dropped extremely. The que time became longer and longer because there were so few people wanting/needing to clear one of those dungeons. Anyone 20+ in the que had far more rewarding dungeons to que for, and level 50s had zero reason to do any dungeon below 50.

The roulette changed that. For a level 20-49 player, the low level roulette gives you a change of scenery once a day and a big bonus of exp at the end. For a level 50, you get something like 80 Myth tomes. The purpose of all this bait is to improve que times for those who need to run a specific dungeon.

And it worked. However today we are in an ugly place. On one hand we have a flood of new PS4 players and most are T-E-R-R-I-B-L-E and don't listen. On the other hand, there are a whole lot of selfish level 50 jerks in the que who just want their reward and don't give a damn about helping low levels learn a dungeon and earn some exp. People like me are caught in the middle of that crap-sandwich.

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Originally Posted by Synra

And it worked. However today we are in an ugly place. On one hand we have a flood of new PS4 players and most are T-E-R-R-I-B-L-E and don't listen. On the other hand, there are a whole lot of selfish level 50 jerks in the que who just want their reward and don't give a damn about helping low levels learn a dungeon and earn some exp. People like me are caught in the middle of that crap-sandwich.

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Sadly, this is why i only use expert and trial roulette. The myths you can earn doing a low level roulette doesn't worth the pain (you can do 2-3 brayflox in the same time it takes to do one level dungeon). Only did low level dungeons to get my Animus ><

Someone in my pt. tried that "shortcut".

You can skip a part of the road by falling down HOWEVER you still need to pull the lever down there to open the gate to the big room. So it's pretty pointless really. Just kill the mobs, you have time for that.

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Originally Posted by Elvin

And no one have more right that others, that's just something in your mind for god knows what reason. Yeah, they're probably there for experience. Or maybe just for advance on the main story. And? They're there for that, you are there for another thing. The only compulsory thing is the common goal, complete the dungeon. People doesn't have more rights for being lower or higher level, we are all players.

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When you join via roulette, most likely the non-50's joined that dungeon explicitly for exp. It's usually the 50's that want a speed run and it usually only happens when the tank is the one who DR'd. I'm okay with people who joined via roulette to ask if they can speed, but if anyone wants full clear for exp, that should be the default. As others have said, a single non-roulette run of Brayflox/Halatali/Amdapor nets more tomes than a Low DR; if you're against a full clear, don't do Low DR.

The Roulette system was implemented to ensure that players will always be able to find assistance to clear content which requires a party. Players participating in Roulette are there to help these other players, and they are being paid for this service by way of Roulette bonuses. As such, all decisions regarding what is done in a dungeon (skipped chest, speed runs, etc) should be in favor of the NON-Roulette participants. You are there to help them - you are being PAID to help them - not the other way around. Note that in a case where EVERYONE is on Roulette, this does not apply, obviously; you can come to a group consensus as to how the dungeon should be run, but more likely than not everyone will be in favor of speed.

All that said, the tank, and no one else, decides the pace of a dungeon run. A courteous tank will respect the wishes of their party, but in the end a party has little alternative but to do what the tank wants. In the case of the OP, it sounds as though the SCH took the one alternative available - leaving the run.

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Originally Posted by sanosuke001

When you join via roulette, most likely the non-50's joined that dungeon explicitly for exp. It's usually the 50's that want a speed run and it usually only happens when the tank is the one who DR'd. I'm okay with people who joined via roulette to ask if they can speed, but if anyone wants full clear for exp, that should be the default. As others have said, a single non-roulette run of Brayflox/Halatali/Amdapor nets more tomes than a Low DR; if you're against a full clear, don't do Low DR.

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Tha'ts not true. (the first part of what you say) I never do low level roulette as a 50, only when leveling. And almost never want a full run.

But once you are in it, and past the 2nd boss, to leave is really a bigger waste of time. Than to just kill a few more mobs?

ilvl 92 tank, i run low lvl roulette for the bonus at least twice a week, its easy fast and ill kill extra stuff if people need xp.

As a tank main, I actually really enjoy helping newbies get EXP and chests in Low Level dungeons. I'll always ask first though. I figure that if I were in their shoes, I'd really appreciate the help personally.

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Originally Posted by Elvin

Tha'ts not true. (the first part of what you say) I never do low level roulette as a 50, only when leveling. And almost never want a full run.

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So it's not true for you, yet for many it is.