Player Lockouts for T6-T9

I have not read any confirmation on this:

Will T6-T9 have a player lockout like the current T1-T5 has?

These player lockouts from content really mess things up. My company has some people that like to play weekly (static) with each other, while some want to play with the company (static) and also help other friends with content.

What happens is the players that want to help others AND play with the company are being locked out of content because they cleared the content for the week. We all know what I am talking about.

Having no player lock out from content would only benefit the game...

Of course T6-T9 will have same coil turn lockout system.

It's to further increase the rarity/exclusivity of the gear that drops from it as it will be the new highest ilv gear.

Turns 1-5 will be available individually on the DF with no loot limits, and the weekly myth cap will be removed as part of this balance.

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Originally Posted by Pinworms

I have not read any confirmation on this:

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Sometimes people just have to read the live letter Q&A summary. It is all stated that the new turns will work exactly like current turns.

They confirmed lockouts. What wasn't confirmed was if it is current Coil style or more like CT.

To keep it fluid in the future for duty finder I'm sure it's going to still be individually separated.

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Originally Posted by Lithera

They confirmed lockouts. What wasn't confirmed was if it is current Coil style or more like CT.

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I think we can rest assured it will be like the current coil style. I don't think the devs want everyone having the full set of new gear in 11 weeks. Hell as a player I don't even want that, and I only have two pieces of Allagan currently.

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Originally Posted by Pinworms

Having no player lock out from content would only benefit the game...

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Two bad things would happen:

1. Players would fully gear in a week and complain about lack of stuff to do
2. FC's would sell coil runs more than they do now

They should just allow it to be spammed like CT with one drop a week. Runs will still be sold; but I don't really care if bad players have good gear. I don't think they should ever not have some kind of soft cap on end game content; it'll become obsolete too fast.

The way CT works still allows you to pick your gear. The BCoB is a higher restriction lockout than CT currently, as it is also the higher ilv content. That likely will not change for the next 4 turns.

This is all In Regards to T6-T9

You guys do understand that a player lockout isn't the same as a loot lockout correct? Let me explain...

Loot lockout = you get an item and you cannot get an item again until a cool down period.

Player lockout = a player does not get any loot but beats content and can no longer do the content over again.

Having a player lockout only hurts the community because people that have cleared content for that week can no longer help others. Some "static" coil parties have trouble fielding people for the current T5 because the players go help other people for their T5 kill and end up beating it...and then can't help their static or vice versa.

This has nothing to do with loot and has everything to do with just being able to play the game.

Yah I could see a hybrid style lockout. You aren't locked out of running the Turn, but after your first run through the Turn you're loot locked regardless of whether you got a drop or not..

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Originally Posted by Pinworms

This has nothing to do with loot and has everything to do with just being able to play the game.

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It does involve the ability to play that specific content, and yes it limits how freely you can go about assisting others in clears beyond words/videos.

However, you are wrong in it having nothing to do with loot, as it does in fact add another layer of restriction on loot. Therefore, it seems intentional.

Player lockouts are bad if used heavily, as it will lead to people not having much to do once they've cleared it. In the case of XIV, a player lockout is being placed only on the highest ilv content.

Personnally, I'd prefer a harder loot lock out :

Free entrance at any turn (once cleared ofc) but you can lot only at your 1st entrance. Shouldn't be too hard to adapt the CT code from "only pass lot when 1 item looted" to "only pass loy when 1 run cleared"

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Originally Posted by Lithera

Yah I could see a hybrid style lockout. You aren't locked out of running the Turn, but after your first run through the Turn you're loot locked regardless of whether you got a drop or not..

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It would just get abused once people had the turns on farm status. Groups could just level an alt each and take their mains through one at a time. Would mean 32 drops per group per week.

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Originally Posted by Alkimi

It would just get abused once people had the turns on farm status. Groups could just level an alt each and take their mains through one at a time. Would mean 32 drops per group per week.

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Just a very few would do this, as on top of leveling this alt, you would also need to gear it up to be able to complete the raid.
That's not a problem imo.

That's a LOT of work a group would have to do to "abuse" the system. Not to mention the drops are still pure RNG.

Very few people will benefit from that versus the many that will benefit from the hybrid lockout.

I personally think the current coil system is terrible because it forces players to be left out by design. There is NOT a ratio of 2 DPS per 1 tank that wants to do coil. For every DPS in excess of two per tank that wants to do coil, that's about how many players will be forced to be left out.

Ofc it will.

If you are that desperate to help people outside your fc, level a whole new character to 50 and you wont be having lockouts. In 2.2 you can easily get the guy up to i90 gear in coil 1-5 anyway since no lockout or myth cap.

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Originally Posted by Noahlimits

Two bad things would happen:

1. Players would fully gear in a week and complain about lack of stuff to do
2. FC's would sell coil runs more than they do now

They should just allow it to be spammed like CT with one drop a week. Runs will still be sold; but I don't really care if bad players have good gear. I don't think they should ever not have some kind of soft cap on end game content; it'll become obsolete too fast.

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All this is why we have lock outs. It has been a staple in MMO for years.

Poeple are complaining about nothing to do with the lockout so what's the difference?

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Originally Posted by 00039

Poeple are complaining about nothing to do with the lockout so what's the difference?

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Because people will always complain and just because they do does not mean something should be changed. Lockouts are the carrots on the stick that keep people subbed.

I hate hate hate the player lockout. It has put a big strain on friendships and the FC.

They do it to keep the content exclusive and gear rare. Twin wins will be sold the second 2.2 comes out. The experienced shells would have been doing this for months like EX if they could spam it.

Player lockout is the single WORST design decision in this game.
Folks from the same LS/FC can't go back to help out friends. The ones lucky enough to run with the main gangs progresses while everyone else languishes.
- The ones that ran ahead quit because nothing to do.
- The ones left behind quit because they can't get to do anything.

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Originally Posted by tymora

Player lockout is the single WORST design decision in this game.
Folks from the same LS/FC can't go back to help out friends. The ones lucky enough to run with the main gangs progresses while everyone else languishes.
- The ones that ran ahead quit because nothing to do.
- The ones left behind quit because they can't get to do anything.

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Plenty of FCs find ways to get through this with more than 1 group.

Again, it's clearly an obvious way of increasing exclusivity, and preventing players from being carried so heavily by others who have cleared it. Can it be done? Yes, however the incentive is halted by the lockout, making it difficult to do so. Therefore, simply sharing strategies and videos is encouraged.

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Originally Posted by SirTaint

I hate hate hate the player lockout. It has put a big strain on friendships and the FC.

They do it to keep the content exclusive and gear rare. Twin wins will be sold the second 2.2 comes out. The experienced shells would have been doing this for months like EX if they could spam it.

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t5 turns are already sold on my server my the top fc.

Even under the most ideal situations, FCs will then need to be in multiples of 8 and then be of the perfect combination of jobs.
Even statics have issues because there are days people can't turn up. Now you are down by a couple of people and there are only 2 options:
1) Either can't do the run because you don't want to leave them behind
2) Go ahead and ditch them for the week.

Loot lockout is so much more preferable over this.

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Originally Posted by SirTaint

I hate hate hate the player lockout. It has put a big strain on friendships and the FC.

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Why are people putting games on a pedestal? How is it a strain on your friendship and FC? You can still talk to them, run other content with them, roleplay with them or w/e. The only thing it's stopping you from is certain dungeons with them. Is it so hard to find other players in the game to run the content with you? That you absolutely NEED these players to run with you?

It's a strain because you depend on 7 other people to NOT run ahead with a different group and clear content. This screws the "static" because the person is either selfish or impatient, or is helping friends with content. Either way it screws people over in the end. Yeah it causes strain on friendships, groups, etc.

There is nothing wrong with SE letting players go into the turn and as soon as the turn is complete they are LOOT locked for the week. That doesn't change. This next part is the change...ALLOW players to renter the content without any loot rewards....it's revolutionary... So revolutionary DC Universe Online has been doing it for over a year now with their 8 man groups.

There is no reason for players to not be able to renter and play content solely to help others.

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Originally Posted by Pinworms

There is no reason for players to not be able to renter and play content solely to help others.

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Except that this would allow for players to be carried, and open up the content for merc runs.

Nope.

I don't think you understand the concept that it is restricted to this degree on purpose, and that it does indeed restrict the loot as well as the number of players who clear it quite effectively whilst promoting long-term teams to be formed.

Uh people are already being carried. People are already "selling" runs. That's going to continue regardless of the lockout, and it is a weak defense as to why the lockout cant be changed. Think outside the box for a moment.

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Originally Posted by Pinworms

It's a strain because you depend on 7 other people to NOT run ahead with a different group and clear content. This screws the "static" because the person is either selfish or impatient, or is helping friends with content. Either way it screws people over in the end. Yeah it causes strain on friendships, groups, etc.

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So you want a "selfish or impatient" person in a group with you for all content? Last I remembered, a static was a set group of people that you got together and completed an objective with. If somebody was running off and doing stuff on their own, knowing that they would not be able to do it later with you, then that's not really a static in my opinion. That's an unreliable member that should be replaced anyways.

The way it looks to me is that you are too dependant on your "friends" and fc to run with you and if they happen to run with their other "friends", you got your feelings hurt. You weren't put on a blacklist, you weren't ignored, you weren't sent to a corner with a dunce hat. Just a static was formed with a set of people and it didn't include you for a set of dungeons because of game mechanics.

Just to put it out there, I'm not against removing player lockouts. I just don't see how, just because you aren't able to run a few dungeons with certain people puts a strain on your friendship while there are still content in the game that you are able to play with them.

People will start to sell runs earlier, they will also sell more runs. Right now a group can sell 1 run a week, with this change the number of runs sold would skyrocket. Ah what happy times those gilsellers would have.
While being able to help FC-member completing content they have a problem with, you will end up doing them a disservice. They will not learn their class if they get carried, there will be no reason for them to improve since the boss will go down anyway and they will get their loot without having to do anything.

Coil drops the best gear in the game, the lockout is there for a reason. SE does not want everyone to have access to the best gear from day 1, week 1 or even month 1. For easy loot you have CT, that is the purpose of CT.

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Originally Posted by Pinworms

Uh people are already being carried. People are already "selling" runs. That's going to continue regardless of the lockout, and it is a weak defense as to why the lockout cant be changed. Think outside the box for a moment.

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You don't sell runs until you've cleared them for months with your group already. So no... it's not a weak argument. You're trying to how people are selling runs now in BCoB 6 months after its release to people selling runs in turns 6-9 soon after they release. If there is no player lockout, sales will begin as soon as they are cleared.

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Originally Posted by illuminapanic

So you want a "selfish or impatient" person in a group with you for all content? Last I remembered, a static was a set group of people that you got together and completed an objective with. If somebody was running off and doing stuff on their own, knowing that they would not be able to do it later with you, then that's not really a static in my opinion. That's an unreliable member that should be replaced anyways.

The way it looks to me is that you are too dependant on your "friends" and fc to run with you and if they happen to run with their other "friends", you got your feelings hurt. You weren't put on a blacklist, you weren't ignored, you weren't sent to a corner with a dunce hat. Just a static was formed with a set of people and it didn't include you for a set of dungeons because of game mechanics.

Just to put it out there, I'm not against removing player lockouts. I just don't see how, just because you aren't able to run a few dungeons with certain people puts a strain on your friendship while there are still content in the game that you are able to play with them.

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I actually orginize our free company statics - the shot caller if you will. My feelings aren't hurt, that people went to go help,others. It makes it hard for the 7 people left behind to pick up the slack, esp on t5 wher you have to re teach players. We changed our raiding days to strict tue/Thursday t1-5 and t5 thrusday. Sunday is a fun day..you wanna go kill it
Twin in Sunday that on them since see resets Monday.

Its really hard for smallers FC's to have a Player Lockout. I would prefer a Loot-Lockout too over the actual System.

There are plently FC's out there who want it to be familar within the FC..so they dont want 100+ Players to get 4+ Static Groups (Downside is : The Family Part goes down the Sewer very fast). Many FC's have working Peoples with Shifts. Allone these two Points are speaking for Loot-Lockouts.

And you cannot say : Then they are dont made to do the HighEnd Stuff. Why not ? because every single Player pays for the Game.

Its just loot geez lol,
Just go farm the new tomes and stop caring about what other ppl do.
Statics = a job within a game
( u get together on a specific time, beat objectives, reap the rewards, then go back to ur own life again) * logging off for the rest of week, doing other stuff in ff, etc
Loot lock out prevents loot farming but enables content to become old quickly and easily accessible.
Player lockout prevents content from quickly becoming old but enables the solidity/ corruption of statics.
So Pick ur poison and feel free to succumb to it.