Market Wards vs AH

I see from reading these forums that SE has succeeded beautifully in frustrating many loyal FF players with the Market Wards vs AH system. While I am sure the current system must be easier to maintain (WHEN it's maintained) I think it should be a far higher priority for them to be addressing this issue rather than class names. Until we have an effective and player friendly sell/sell-back system, FFXIV and thereby SE is going to hemorrhage players, players long dedicated to the FF brand. I had hoped under new management site maintenance and improvements would be a higher priority. Wasn't that what we were promised?

Market wards are an extremely valid alternative to AH, they just need to be adressed server-stability wise.

PS: Writing in different colors and threatening some nondescript player exodus "if you don't do what I say!" isn't exactly the best way to make your post more readable or more solid in it's contents.

Market Wards, in their original concept of a bazaar-style rummage sale based around browsing, are dead. What we have right now is a very basic AH with some walking added. There is no more "Wards vs AH" no matter how many times we repeat it. The current question is, "Are we content with this basic level of AH functionality, and how would we improve it?

There are already threads on this subject...

Huh? I thought we already had an AH. Or it least it's functionality in now on par with an AH. Aside from fixing the MArketward crashing it's time for them to focus on content and stop trying to fix what isn't broken.

I respect your opinion of course, but price setting, especially for lower level players who need every gil they can scrounge up (LEGALLY) the game is unplayable at worst and tedious at best. What do YOU do when you want to sell an item back and the Item Search shows a big fat goose egg and no price history? I like the retainers idea, kind of, but price setting needs to be addressed. That IS content in this particular game.

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Originally Posted by Xzen

Huh? I thought we already had an AH. Or it least it's functionality in now on par with an AH. Aside from fixing the MArketward crashing it's time for them to focus on content and stop trying to fix what isn't broken.

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Okay... I should rename this thread "price setting and detection in the Market Wards". My sincere apologies.

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Originally Posted by ShinChuck

Market Wards, in their original concept of a bazaar-style rummage sale based around browsing, are dead. What we have right now is a very basic AH with some walking added. There is no more "Wards vs AH" no matter how many times we repeat it. The current question is, "Are we content with this basic level of AH functionality, and how would we improve it?

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There is no need for an AH since the market wards act almost exactly like one.... I love the wards and how they are now.. I think it brings more life to the game. Only problem is stability nothing else really.

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Originally Posted by Verecund

There are already threads on this subject...

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This
/10char

Abriael, wow....I did all that? I'm female, I like colors. No offense intended. The issue, none the less, as much as I respect your other wise posts on these boards, IS a major issue for many players. Re solid contents, that is up to the reader I suppose. No intent to offend and no more colors, sir.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

Market wards are an extremely valid alternative to AH, they just need to be adressed server-stability wise.

PS: Writing in different colors and threatening some nondescript player exodus "if you don't do what I say!" isn't exactly the best way to make your post more readable or more solid in it's contents.

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all price settings do is allow the rmt to control the market like they did in ffxi.... RMT wil change the history by buying at low prices until the history fully changes then as people sell them for low prices the RMT buy them and resell them for higher.

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Originally Posted by Solfleur

I respect your opinion of course, but price setting, especially for lower level players who need every gil they can scrounge up (LEGALLY) the game is unplayable at worst and tedious at best. What do YOU do when you want to sell an item back and the Item Search shows a big fat goose egg and no price history? I like the retainers idea, kind of, but price setting needs to be addressed. That IS content in this particular game.

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Price history can (and I believe they already announced it as a future evolution) be implemented in the market wards system. You already can see the lowest price between the items on sale.

Also, I would say that you have a veeery elastic concept of "unplayable".

Market Wards allow players to "Seek Items" making it superior to an AH.

The only thing mising is a "Seeking Item" search window, which you could use to search what items retainers are auto-buying before you sit down to craft.

Not only, market wards allow a buyer to actually see what an item looks like before purchasing, and include a very important factor of realistic and prosperous economies: impulse purchases.

The current market wards system needs to be polished, improved and refined, but it has plenty potential to be a better alternative to the classic AH.

To be more precise (and some would say clear cut), there's absolutely NO functionailty of an AH that cannot be implemented in the Market Wards system. On the other hand, there's plenty functionalities of the market wards system that cannot be implemented in a AH.
More options -> better.

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Originally Posted by Solfleur

I respect your opinion of course, but price setting, especially for lower level players who need every gil they can scrounge up (LEGALLY) the game is unplayable at worst and tedious at best. What do YOU do when you want to sell an item back and the Item Search shows a big fat goose egg and no price history? I like the retainers idea, kind of, but price setting needs to be addressed. That IS content in this particular game.

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So they can just add a price history. Easy peasy.

Okay, final comment to you for now, with all due respect, which I can see from your signature is earned. If zero items of the type you need to sell are listed when you Item Search, no way that I am currently aware of exists to set a price other than wandering cities checking out other player bazaars. Please educate me further if I am mistaken in this as well. Thanks for your thoughtful responses.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

Price history can (and I believe they already announced it as a future evolution) be implemented in the market wards system. You already can see the lowest price between the items on sale.

Also, I would say that you have a veeery elastic concept of "unplayable".

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i would love if they added a function that shows you the items that retainers are seeking as well as the ones wanting repairs

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Originally Posted by Xzen

Huh? I thought we already had an AH. Or it least it's functionality in now on par with an AH. Aside from fixing the MArketward crashing it's time for them to focus on content and stop trying to fix what isn't broken.

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On Par with an AH you say? Really?

The system we have now is hit and miss and far from polished. It is not on Par with any modern mmo that has an AH in my opinion. (which I'm entitled to before the pro Market Ward flamers start).

Then that would solve my issue perfectly. Meanwhile, what someone called my elastic sense of playability is affronted. *.^ Congratulations on your success in the game so far!

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Originally Posted by Xzen

So they can just add a price history. Easy peasy.

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Originally Posted by Spellstar

On Par with an AH you say? Really?

The system we have now is hit and miss and far from polished. It is not on Par with any modern mmo that has an AH in my opinion. (which I'm entitled to before the pro Market Ward flamers start).

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The only thing missing is a price history. The only "Hit and miss" is if the wards have crashed or not.

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Originally Posted by Spellstar

On Par with an AH you say? Really?

The system we have now is hit and miss and far from polished. It is not on Par with any modern mmo that has an AH in my opinion. (which I'm entitled to before the pro Market Ward flamers start).

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Bless your heart... I was feeling very alone.

We basically already have an ah, just a different name and form, but same function overall. bad topic

#1 It's much easier to compare prices in an AH
#2 It's much easier to browse Items in an AH
#3 You can actually bid in an Auction House hence "AUCTION"
#4 The player can spend more time shopping instead of picking out his/her retainer in a flood of NPC characters
#5 The player can spend more time shoopping
#6 The player can spend more time SHOPPING and less time Haggling with controls trying to sell stuff then going to buy stuff right after....hence we need an auction house...

An Auction lets you sell and buy with the same window open where you can see all your wares...

SE seriously we need an auction house don't blame us for trying something new and then having it failed...
Just fire the person who came up with the stupid market ward system and hire someone to fix this monstrosity.

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Originally Posted by Solfleur

Okay, final comment to you for now, with all due respect, which I can see from your signature is earned. If zero items of the type you need to sell are listed when you Item Search, no way that I am currently aware of exists to set a price other than wandering cities checking out other player bazaars. Please educate me further if I am mistaken in this as well. Thanks for your thoughtful responses.

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That's why they will probably implement a price history. Market wards and Price history aren't mutually exclusive concepts.

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Originally Posted by Silvyaniss

#1 It's much easier to compare prices in an AH
#2 It's much easier to browse Items in an AH
#3 You can actually bid in an Auction House hence "AUCTION"
#4 The player can spend more time shopping instead of picking out his/her retainer in a flood of NPC characters
#5 The player can spend more time shoopping
#6 The player can spend more time SHOPPING and less time Haggling with controls trying to sell stuff then going to buy stuff right after....hence we need an auction house...

An Auction lets you sell and buy with the same window open where you can see all your wares...

SE seriously we need an auction house don't blame us for trying something new and then having it failed...
Just fire the person who came up with the stupid market ward system and hire someone to fix this monstrosity.

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Most implementation of auction houses in most MMORPG don't involve any bidding. Search is no more or no less easy, and keyword search can be implemented in the market wards system easily. The Star on top of the character's head is the first thing that appears when entering a market ward, so there isn't any time wasted on "picking".

Again. Nothing that is part of an AH cannot be implemented in the MArket Wards system. On the other hand, several features in the market wards system cannot be replicated by an AH.

More options -> better.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

Most implementation of auction houses in most MMORPG don't involve any bidding. Search is no more or no less easy, and keyword search can be implemented in the market wards system easily. The Star on top of the character's head is the first thing that appears when entering a market ward, so there isn't any time wasted on "picking".

Again. Nothing that is part of an AH cannot be implemented in the MArket Wards system. On the other hand, several features in the market wards system cannot be replicated by an AH.

More options -> better.

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Why not just program something that can be done from a centralized UI element? Why waste my time with loading and walking to a person with a star over their head? I'd rather walk up to a counter, and look at a list... and make a purchase.

Would you like to know what part of an AH cannot be implemented in a Market Ward system?

Convenience.

Market wards keeps more competition between sellers going, it keeps the prices low and hurts the gil sellers.

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Originally Posted by Dingleberry

We basically already have an ah, just a different name and form, but same function overall. bad topic

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OMG the market wards are an AH?!

*tries to buy an item from the search counter*
*tries to search for a +1 weapon with the search function*
*tries to take my gil from a delivery box*
*tries to find a delivery box*

*fails*

YOU LIED TO ME! D=<

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Originally Posted by Warp

Why not just program something that can be done from a centralized UI element? Why waste my time with loading and walking to a person with a star over their head? I'd rather walk up to a counter, and look at a list... and make a purchase.

Would you like to know what part of an AH cannot be implemented in a Market Ward system?

Convenience.

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You'd rather. I'd rather not, simply because I enjoy previewing the item I'm going to buy before actually paying. Also, as a seller, I'd rather have the possibility of getting people to buy something from my retainer just because they walked in front of her, saw something they liked, and bought it. It's called "impulse purchase", it's a very important part of any prosperous economy, and it's completely excluded in Auction Houses.

There's still some walking involved, also Auction houses normally involve scrolling between long lists of items which isn't less time consuming thanm "walking to someone with a star on his head".

Convenience is an absolute term. "I'd rather" is a completely different cup of tea.

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Originally Posted by Solfleur

I'm female, I like colors. No offense intended.

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I will thank you to refrain from blaming every little bit of fluff you choose to engage in on my gender.

The market wards are charming at best, time consuming and disengaging at worst. Our transactions should all be in one large Marketplace, dissolving the instanced wards. But instead of retainers, each type of goods/ward should be embodied by an NPC auctioneer. This would create the buzz of a real life marketplace and give the players time to all share each others' presences doing our shopping together instead of in a room full of NPC's. The loading and the magic porting aren't doing it for me each time I need an item in a different ward that looks exactly the same as the last.
The retainers could me more purposed than they are by taking the items you want them to sell and setting the auction up with the corresponding auctioneer. Maybe they could make deliveries like goods and letters to other players.(ala Earthbound). Retainer gets mugged en route? Time to rescue them until they get stronger and wiser to make longer trips.

I think the market wards are extremely tedious compared to standard AH in MMOs like WoW and LOTRO. You need to constantly run between your retainers and the item counter to check price and set prices in your bazaar. Checking prices is also a multi step process, you have to first locate what category it should be under, than scroll to find your item (no filter or search), and that's not even enough, you have to click to list the prices in another window.

I'd much rather have a centralized interface where I can click one of my items, list matching items already on sale and then set my price accordingly.

Browsing is a little confusing for beginners too. When all I care is upgrading gear for an ARC, it's not obvious where I should look. I'd rather just be able to look up items by their names, or stats or class.

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Originally Posted by Vangelis

I think the market wards are extremely tedious compared to standard AH in MMOs like WoW and LOTRO. You need to constantly run between your retainers and the item counter to check price and set prices in your bazaar.

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if you do it like that, either you're exaggerating for effect, or you're doing it wrong. Try pen and paper. I know many don't know the usage of those arcane items (as a more modern alternative, the Notepad works too), but I assure you they work.

Searching all prices and writing them down and then setting up all the items for sale will be STILL faster/more convenient than looking up one item at a time in any average AH UI and then setting it for sale. Over and over.

This, of course, without mentioning that the sole existance/possibility of impulse purchases (that does not exist with a classic AH) will help you sell more items faster.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

You'd rather. I'd rather not, simply because I enjoy previewing the item I'm going to buy before actually paying. Also, as a seller, I'd rather have the possibility of getting people to buy something from my retainer just because they walked in front of her, saw something they liked, and bought it. It's called "impulse purchase", it's a very important part of any prosperous economy, and it's completely excluded in Auction Houses.

There's still some walking involved, also Auction houses normally involve scrolling between long lists of items which isn't less time consuming thanm "walking to someone with a star on his head".

Convenience is an absolute term. "I'd rather" is a completely different cup of tea.

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You can't make an impulse purchase from a normal AH? You're also forgetting that 'long lists' of items can be sorted in a million different ways. You say it's not less time consuming, but you do know that there are a bunch of different wards, right? What happens when your item that you want is in a different ward?... you have to endure a load screen.

I will admit that i was price gouging quite a bit (though i never sell things for more than you can get them from the vendor) till the price listings came up.

Now that they are making retainers pretty easy to use, and the market wards easy to browse, there really is not a need for a auction house. Current system is fine IMO.

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Originally Posted by Warp

You can't make an impulse purchase from a normal AH?

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An impulse purchase is by definition something you weren't looking for, and that just appeared in front of your eyes and you bought.
An AH has no "windows shopping" system, so by-definition impulse purchases aren't part of the concept. You cannot just walk around an AH. You have to make an active search effort in order to have items offered to you.
That's not what an impulse purchase is.

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you have to endure a load screen.

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And you have to endure lists loading with an AH.

I don't hate the market wards. They are actually not as bad now a days. However, anything that makes my buying/selling experience faster is always a plus. An AH is the logical conclusion. I am a typical male, and just like in RL, I don't go shopping, I go on a mission. My goal is to get in and out of the grocery store as fast as humanly possible. Which is why I make a list and shop at odd hours to avoid the crowds.

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Originally Posted by Amsai

I don't hate the market wards. They are actually not as bad now a days. However, anything that makes my buying/selling experience faster is always a plus. An AH is the logical conclusion. I am a typical male, and just like in RL, I don't go shopping, I go on a mission. My goal is to get in and out of the grocery store as fast as humanly possible. Which is why I make a list and shop at odd hours to avoid the crowds.

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Market Ward: Pick Ward -> Pick item/compare price -> Walk to item -> Buy item

Real world: Pick shop -> Pick item/compare price -> Walk to item -> Buy item

Just like in RL you can easily "go on a mission" with Market Wards.

Please add Auction house and get rid of wards they are useless and anoying and we need a mailbox really really bad anyways its long overdue.