Melee Hit Detection

So, I haven't seen this addressed as of recent. It is usually wrapped up into some "lag" thread, but I don't want to make this thread purely about "lag".

Right now for all melee (and future melee obviously) the hit detection on moving enemies is simply unacceptable. I know it has been out a while, and we are simply "dealing with it" currently, but I am just baffled it has gone on so long without Dev attention. When you are literally unable to hit moving enemies without great effort, e.g.: Garuda in EX, or a plume, or suparna/chirada as they move, or even Titan EX add spawns, or how about Knights being kited in T4, Caduceus being kited, Twintania being moved, Bombs in CT (Vassago/KB), Iron Giants being positioned/moved (KB/Acheron), Skeles on Bone Dragon, etc. (the list is essentially endless), YOU HAVE A SERIOUS MELEE PROBLEM!

I'm sure most think of melee DPS a forefront problem, but it even extends to all tanking, and threat gen on a moving target. Forget about positional requirements, and often times trying to keep up buffs/combos (GL3, flank attacks, etc.). This is all really, really terrible design, and I hope the Devs will recognize it and address it. It is simply unacceptable that a modern MMO does not have the ability for a melee to connect hits reliably on a moving target. I feel like I'm back in FFXI losing all my TP to a Weapon skill "out of range" error. It is really terrible.

I realize this has been talked about, but its really not brought up enough. This is a serious issue that should be on the forefront of the Dev's minds for fixing. It is a big blight on their combat system overall, and I'm not even touching PVP.

Honestly, I think it's a problem that cropped up when they got rid of the depth in the battle system - For example LNC/DRG/MRD/WAR had pretty decent reach on enemies, when they removed that for ARR it likely cause this issue to be more glaring than it was in 1.x.

Not to mention you used to have throwing items to counter mobile targets so you could still gain TP..:\ It probably won't ever be fixed though.

I agree with you 100%.

I don't necessary mind on a certain degree, but I expected Dragoon to have atleast further reach than other melee classes. Like come on, that long spear and you're telling me I'm out of range?

What's even worse is that MNK's 'Shoulder Tackle' actually misses on moving targets as well, and that's supposedly to be a distance closer. If the target is moving in any direction other than away (yes, sometimes you miss as it's moving towards you, wth), you get an error, and the ability goes on CD.

Well... for now there seems to be a 'sweetspot' for moving enemies if you want to hit them, which is actually trying to move AHEAD of them while attacking, just like counter-strikes hit-box detection in that you shoot ahead of the character model in motion (I don't think that got fixed either for future shooters). -_-

I also agree with this thread, I've found it incredibly annoying to deal with. I don't really care about pvp that much myself, but even in pve this is a huge hassle as mentioned by the OP.

It's not just an issue of moving. Look at enemies like "titans heart" that move while he is attacking and changing positions. You could be hitting the heart just fine then he switches positions or attacks and the heart moves out of range briefly. This disrupts your ability to DPS efficiently and during heart phase... THAT MATTERS. This is just one example, there are others.

I hate losing a shoulder tackle that way, but usually I am at least at the enemy at that point and that's most of what I was trying to do (though uneven terrain and such will prevent that as well). The only times this seems to be a problem for me and it matters are instances where adds spawn on a boss and move at full speed to a specified target (other than me). With position checking the way it is, the server thinks I'm much further behind the enemy than my client indicates to me. Given the innate restrictions of online gaming (namely the speed of light) I'm not sure how you can effectively combat this, but they should be able to do better. I wonder if it's alleviated at all in the low latency instances. I haven't encountered those sort of mechanics in those fights so I haven't noticed (or I'm so used to it I haven't noticed).

Don't get me started on Shoulder Tackle... also how it stuns, it can mess up stun-rotations... I think it should Bind rather (tradeoff could be higher potency or reduced CD), besides how buggy it is.

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Originally Posted by Gesser

Don't get me started on Shoulder Tackle... also how it stuns, it can mess up stun-rotations... I think it should Bind rather (tradeoff could be higher potency or reduced CD), besides how buggy it is.

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Bind might be interesting and worth it. I don't really like the Shoulder Tackle stun, as its only a few seconds instead of the 6 of others, and is a waste of a DR. In cases where it matters, its better not to Shoulder Tackle so someone can get the full 6 second stun.

I'm certainly no expert, but you'd think SE could put in some form of lag compensation, or client side hit detection for the initial hit alone. I get so tired of seeing half the animation go off and it get canceled, when it should be a simple "out of range" or not. If the hit is correctly positioned to trigger animation, it should finish.

That's because the monster isn't actually near you. Yu see it right beside you, but it's 2-3 steps ahead. This was the same problem FFXI had.