SCH BiS With Allagan/AF2/R30

Weapon-Allagan
Head-Allagan/AF2
Chest-AF2
Gloves-Allagan
Belt-Af2
Pants-Allagan/AF2
Shoes-R30 (Gain 21 crit. Lose 11 Piety and 21 Spell speed over Allagan boots)
neck-AF2
Ear-AF2
Wrist-AF2
Ring1-AF2
Ring2-R30( Gain 16 crit. Lose 11 spell speed and 11 det over Vortex Ring)

"But Chronos...u lose 54 stats to gain 37. that seems bad to me" My answer would be that Crit is the most important off stat to a SCH. Crit adlo/succor is insane. 37points is about 2pct extra crit chance. crit also increases the strength of the crit, im not sure by how much tho. Spell speed is worthless because u always have lustrate. 11 piety is no issue since u should never run out of mp anyway. 11 det is = to about 1.5-2 Mind. not much of a loss.

Some would argue that Royal shoes are BiS now but you should never sacrifice mnd/vit for a small increase in crit. The only piece w/o crit now is your head. Grand total crit is 560!

The only problem with this is you gotta be R30, like myself, to be able to use it. Happy Arena gentlemen. It's a fun grind. At this point, if your arent super hardcore, i would recommend just waiting until 2.2 to get i100 stuff and make this entire list pointless.

I'm thinking of doing this too. I'm r25 but it's only 50% of the way to r30 zzzz

I'm not a SCH...but I have to say, relying on crit and crit alone just screams "bad idea". Crit only increases the chance of getting a crit...it does nothing to increase the strength of crits; you need DET for that. Crits always increases healing/damage by 50%; lower base = lower crit strength.

What is your base Physic heal for? Base Adlo? Are you able to hit a 2K shield going full crit build on a non-WAR, no Eos buff or Convalescence?

Are you really willing to trade heal potency for a slightly better chance to crit shield (the only reason for this build), eating mana and never guaranteed to actually crit when you need it to save your target?

Just things to consider.

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Originally Posted by PArcher

I'm not a SCH...but I have to say, relying on crit and crit alone just screams "bad idea". Crit only increases the chance of getting a crit...it does nothing to increase the strength of crits; you need DET for that. Crits always increases healing/damage by 50%; lower base = lower crit strength.

What is your base Physic heal for? Base Adlo? Are you able to hit a 2K shield going full crit build on a non-WAR, no Eos buff or Convalescence?

Are you really willing to trade heal potency for a slightly better chance to crit shield (the only reason for this build), eating mana and never guaranteed to actually crit when you need it to save your target?

Just things to consider.

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DTR is kinda pointless. <.<

Afaik 4 DTR equals 1 MND/STR/INT/DEX and 1MND equals 1.6Healpoints on Physick. So far I never had any problems with not healing enough.
Nevertheless, it's all just a "PoV-thing".

Edit: If you are not stacking DTR, it's the same as with SpS, thats not stacked. Pointless. :>

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Originally Posted by PArcher

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Even with DET you will never be able to hit 2k Adloqium unbuffed.

You still say AF2 body over direwolf? SCH just doesn't need the piety...

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Originally Posted by Thorauku

Even with DET you will never be able to hit 2k Adloqium unbuffed.

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He wrote 2k Adloq shield. In other words 1k Adloq crit-heal. DTR would be nice if it would boost adloq heal to 2k. xD

just throwing it out there: this build, with HQ deviled eggs, puts you above a 21% crit rate. i think it's definitely viable.

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Originally Posted by PArcher

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Crit is extremely important for SCH because of two reasons.

1. Adloquium
2. Enhanced Pet Actions

Now, as for Physick and Adlo in my crit gear, I did a little test. This is unbuffed -- no food, no party, 100 casts of Physick and Adlo.
Spell Name: Min / Avg / Max / Crit %
Physick: 984 / 1124 / 1558 / 21%
Adloquium: 740 / 862 / 1174 / 38%

Any of my Adlo crits are well above 1000, meaning my Galvanize is always going to be at least 2000 absorbed.

Note that I'm full BiS with the exception of lacking the allagan healing circlet. Also, remember, this is fully unbuffed.

Out of curiosity, what's your average adlo value non-crit?

It ranges from between 750 to 780 (again, no buffs, food, etc).

My gear is Allagan book/ring, Royal gloves (Allagan doesn't exist...), and Myth everything else. MND is 483. Did enough casts to get a decent range, this is what I get.

Adlo: 746-784, 1112-1160 crit
Physick: 996-1049, 1500-1561 crit

Probably a bit wider for max-min as I only did enough that the range of values looked good enough.

One could argue that "relying" on a crit is bad form, but there aren't many situations where I feel I want more consistant heals (Det) over the (fairly decent) chance of crit Adlo, or even crit damage if I'm going all out. The fact of the matter is that a Det build is only 4-5 pieces different from the non-PvP crit BiS (Allagan body/ear/neck, Inferno Bangle, Vortex Ring if you weren't already using it). Not gonna produce a really large difference imo.

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Originally Posted by Alistaire

You still say AF2 body over direwolf? SCH just doesn't need the piety...

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True you dont need Piety as much...but its more useful than morale in pve. I feel that losing 37 total Piety is just too much. 10 crit (about .4pct chance) isnt worth it. Remember that aetherflow is based off of your total mana pool.

That being said...the direwolf chest is an extremely viable piece.

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Originally Posted by Chronos

True you dont need Piety as much...but its more useful than morale in pve. I feel that losing 37 total Piety is just too much. 10 crit (about .4pct chance) isnt worth it. Remember that aetherflow is based off of your total mana pool.

That being said...the direwolf chest is an extremely viable piece.

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37? You lose 26. Which idk if it's always linear but came out to 190 MP for me. If you're going to go for R30's and don't already have AF2 body, you should probably save the myth points.

Ugh, I really have no interest in doing PvP, but I guess it's something I would eventually do...

Question for anyone here but mostly TC, for some slots you have allagan AND AF2. My question is what's the difference, or is the difference so minimal it doesn't matter?

It's really just body/feet/ring you'd even consider over alternatives. Not the end of the world either way. I happen to like PVP and if it's a way to save on some myth as well, that's just a bonus.

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Originally Posted by Brady672

Ugh, I really have no interest in doing PvP, but I guess it's something I would eventually do...

Question for anyone here but mostly TC, for some slots you have allagan AND AF2. My question is what's the difference, or is the difference so minimal it doesn't matter?

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Non-PvP Crit BiS
Allagan: Hands, Ring (subjective)
Primal: Nothing (Vortex Ring over Allagan Ring is subjective)
Myth: Everything else*
*Myth and Allagan are identical for head and legs, and feet are close enough to not really matter. Assume this applies for below unless otherwise stated

PvP Crit BiS
Allagan: Hands, Ring
Primal: Nothing
PvP R30: Body, Feet, Ring
Myth: Everything else

Det BiS
Allagan: Hands, Ring, Body, Neck, Ear
Primal: Inferno Bangle, Vortex Ring
Myth: Everything else

And Allagan grimoire of healing from turn 5 goes without saying.

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Originally Posted by Alistaire

it's a way to save on some myth as well, that's just a bonus.

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My first thought was: They're just going to raise the ilvl so why grind PvP for pieces that may no longer be BiS?
My second thought was: But wait, PvP will probably also raise and you'll save whatever the myth equivalent of iLvl whatever using the wolf marks.

How long did it take you to grind up to R30?

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Originally Posted by Daenerys_Sedai

My first thought was: They're just going to raise the ilvl so why grind PvP for pieces that may no longer be BiS?
My second thought was: But wait, PvP will probably also raise and you'll save whatever the myth equivalent of iLvl whatever using the wolf marks.

How long did it take you to grind up to R30?

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I think you are relating to the next content patch (2.2). As far as i know they will introduce new Tomestones for the new gear. Which means it's probably irrelevant to save up mythos.

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Originally Posted by Chronos

Weapon-Allagan
Head-Allagan/AF2
Chest-AF2
Gloves-Allagan
Belt-Af2
Pants-Allagan/AF2
Shoes-R30 (Gain 21 crit. Lose 11 Piety and 21 Spell speed over Allagan boots)
neck-AF2
Ear-AF2
Wrist-AF2
Ring1-AF2
Ring2-R30( Gain 16 crit. Lose 11 spell speed and 11 det over Vortex Ring)

"But Chronos...u lose 54 stats to gain 37. that seems bad to me" My answer would be that Crit is the most important off stat to a SCH. Crit adlo/succor is insane. 37points is about 2pct extra crit chance. crit also increases the strength of the crit, im not sure by how much tho. Spell speed is worthless because u always have lustrate. 11 piety is no issue since u should never run out of mp anyway. 11 det is = to about 1.5-2 Mind. not much of a loss.

Some would argue that Royal shoes are BiS now but you should never sacrifice mnd/vit for a small increase in crit. The only piece w/o crit now is your head. Grand total crit is 560!

The only problem with this is you gotta be R30, like myself, to be able to use it. Happy Arena gentlemen. It's a fun grind. At this point, if your arent super hardcore, i would recommend just waiting until 2.2 to get i100 stuff and make this entire list pointless.

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The validity of this post is correct to some degree- the additional crit is good for aldo- unfortunately succor doesn't get the some benefit aldo gets from crit but still is a nice pack of additional heals. Crit is our best secondary stat, yet you might want to do some more testing instead of blindly falling unto the crit theory- find out the hard cap on crit if there is one, show some testing and then analyze your readings then relay. Other than that it's not a bad list and any SCH should know this list since September. (excluding r30 gear). Good Post Nonetheless

Cheers

Vitto

How are you people getting AF2 given that it's not even in the game yet?

:P

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Originally Posted by Velox

How are you people getting AF2 given that it's not even in the game yet?

:P

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everyone has different terms for gear AF2 is what some people use for myth gear because it looks like AF armor but colored different.

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Originally Posted by YuiSasaki

I think you are relating to the next content patch (2.2). As far as i know they will introduce new Tomestones for the new gear. Which means it's probably irrelevant to save up mythos.

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From my post:

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Originally Posted by Daenerys_Sedai

But wait, PvP will probably also raise and you'll save whatever the myth equivalent of iLvl whatever using the wolf marks.

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What I meant to say (though it's probably not as clear) was that if they raise the iLvl and you can purchase new gear with those new tomes they're planning on releasing (my "myth equivalent"), then it's likely there will be a PvP item of equal iLvl and some items might have preferable stats.

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Originally Posted by Daenerys_Sedai

From my post:


What I meant to say (though it's probably not as clear) was that if they raise the iLvl and you can purchase new gear with those new tomes they're planning on releasing (my "myth equivalent"), then it's likely there will be a PvP item of equal iLvl and some items might have preferable stats.

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Yeah, i could've misread your post :|. However, they could introduce new PvP-Items later on and not immediately with 2.2. Well, let's wait and see what will come with 2.2^^

How'd you get 560 crit? I equipped all of those and got 550. typo?

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Originally Posted by Kaizersan

everyone has different terms for gear AF2 is what some people use for myth gear because it looks like AF armor but colored different.

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I know, my question was strictly to point out the issue :P
Once AF2 is introduced into the game in the coming updates, it will be important for players not to refer to the gear bought with myth tomes as AF2, as this will cause a lot of confusion in the playerbase. It's best to break habits before they become a problem meow. ^-^

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Originally Posted by PArcher

What is your base Physic heal for? Base Adlo? Are you able to hit a 2K shield going full crit build on a non-WAR, no Eos buff or Convalescence?

Are you really willing to trade heal potency for a slightly better chance to crit shield (the only reason for this build), eating mana and never guaranteed to actually crit when you need it to save your target?

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Thats a question, I did also think over. All that "what is BiS" talking is based on static benchmarks like on traning puppys or selfhealing for some time without any real fight.

For example look at T4, the first DN, when it eats all 4 bugs. Beside his autoattack it does something like a cleave. Sometime both hit nearly the same time. Sometime they crit the same time. When this happens (sometimes the next crit pack is not fare away), the pala tank can loose around 6000 HP nearly instant. So whats to do? The tank has to get topped the whole fight. Keeping up Adlo eats to much mana. To keep someone topped, you need heals that will be there for sure. So that can be only done by maxing out the base heal. Skilling to crit will make wipe or win to much based on luck in my eyes. Also crits will be the most time useless overheal.

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Originally Posted by KarstenS

*snip*

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Well, yes sometimes the crits can kinda frighten you, but apparently you forget some things.

1. You are not healing alone and if you can trust the other healer you'll never have problems.
2. There are some things to reduce incoming damage (e.g.: Virus; Eye for an Eye; Adloq pre-cast, etc.)
3. Panic-Button-Lustrate will save the day ;)

Not to mention, that - in my opinion - +100 Heal on Physick (and that is quite high calculated) won't save the tank. Plus I am not running out of mana even if I'm overusing Adloq - which I am to be honest^^.

On a side note - to answer the one you quoted: I'm critting with Adloq for 1020 (sometimes more sometimes less; never seen a crit below 1k for quite sometime) on a PLD without buffs.

Astral Bracelet may be a better choice of its hero counterpart.

You gain +8 Det, +9 Vit, +1 in crit and but you lose 4 Mnd.

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Originally Posted by Taruranto

Astral Bracelet may be a better choice of its hero counterpart.

You gain +8 Det, +9 Vit, +1 in crit and but you lose 4 Mnd.

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To be honest, that is one of the options i would not choose.

As I stated earlier, 4 DTR (or Det whichever abbreviation you appreciate more) equals 1 Mind.
You dont need any further Vita once you reach ~3.6-4k for the most content. Gaining just 1 Crit. Furthermore you also lose 12 Piety, yes of course it is not that relevant, yet it is more relevant than 1 crit.

In other words if you consider switching Myth-Bracelet for the Astral Bracelet it is - in my opinion - not advisable.