White Mage Gear - Stats

Link here to FFXIV Guild guide

I play WHM as my 2nd job after Warrior. Currently Item Level 76 and generally it's my go to for coil. This guide confuses me some based on what I've heard other people state.

It suggests not using Crit at all, and I was under the impression that most "Skill Speed/Spell Speed" stats were underwhelming.

Anyhow care to give their two cents?

The reason why most WHMs avoid Crit is that either they arguement like:

-Your heals are big enough - there is no reason for them to heal more.

or

- More healvalue results in more aggro; and more aggro results in more getting face-smacked by mobs

However, I build my WHM on crit - the most obvious reason is probably that I'm using the gear from my SCH ( xD ).
Yet, I don't have any aggro issues, at least if I dont want them :>.
Plus i despise Spell Speed. If it's not stacked it's worthless and if it's stacked the difference is about 0.2 secs on GCD.
Well, the "other stat" which appears to be relevant for a heal is accuracy...gnahahahaha just kidding xD.... is Determination(in short: DTR).
As far as I know 4 points in DTR equals 1MND(/STR/DEX/INT). Well, yes it sounds great in the first place, but - as far as my testing, on SCH, goes - 1 MND equals 1.5 - 1.6 Pts of heal on a 400Potency spell (Physick/Cure1).
As a result of all these points i chose Crit for myself.

This a widely debated subject. In my opinion, Determination > Spell Speed > Critical Hit Rate. There are many that will agree with me on this as well as many who would not.

My reasoning for this is consistency. Determination provides a consistently measurable benefit. As does spell speed, even if it is only small. Critical hits can be very nice when you're in a curing spam war trying to keep your tank up or speed running something, etc, but they are by no means consistent enough to rely on which is why I wouldn't bother investing into them. In addition big heals when not intended can also lead to over heals which can be a problem in encounters when you have to watch your hate.

Sorry, edited my original post for the link that suggests my statements.

I am of the mind that for WHM stat priority is Determination = Spell Speed > Critical Hit Rate since both det and ss give consistent returns in different ways. The main reason for crit to be considered the weaker stat is that since it can't be controlled you can't plan around it happening like you can with slightly larger heals or slightly faster cast times. Also we have no "side effect" mitigation for the downsides like scholars. Scholars gain benefit on double sized adloqium shields and the ss buff from their pet on crit, which can outweigh the unpredictability of crit. Also scholars are less likely to have their target topped off because of the shields attached to two of their main heals which means a crit is likely to go to actual health as well rather than overhealing. WHM has none of these things and so its a better min/max choice to go with det or ss.

The reality is that because of the minute difference in stat stacking at this point it isn't like any build isn't viable, but I feel its pretty safe to say from a min/max standpoint crit is already behind the other two. But until stat stacking matters more have fun playing what you like!

Making an attempt to stack SpS on my WHM (accessory drops are not being kind to me). I can say for sure that SpS has saved my tank's asses many many times. I value SpS much more then Det and I value both MUCH more then Crit

I agree with CamAlch & Pharazon in the point that crit is absolutely not reliable. Yet it comes in handy once in a while. Anyway as said before, it's kind of irrelevant at the moment in which secondary stat you invest, try it out and use the one that suits you most or brings you the most fun or close your eyes and point on one, which ever option you prefer.

Well, in my head, seems like Spell Speed would be much more useful, even if it means a smaller heal. In DCUO, I played a Nature Healer, where Critical Heals made up a huge bonus because they were big on healing over time. But not sure regen/medica II tics make crits any more viable, considering Regen usually is only 1-2 targets, and medica II is such a hate builder.

As far as I see it:

Spell speed only contributes to your throughput when you are chain casting cures, an individual cast gains absolutely nothing, it also doesn't do anything for our HoTs or cool downs. If the cast time reduction is saving your tank then you simply need to precast more. Also keep in mind, using spell speed to achieve a higher HP per second tally actually increases the rate at which you burn through mp.

Crit is sketchy and erratic, strings of cure 1 crits are a boon when they occur and it's also worth noting that our hots can crit as well. *edit* Avoid having it ticking when adds pop or on the initial pull and the agro really isn't an issue unless you have tank issues.

Det has a fairly small impact on our potency but it boosts everything we do. Be it spam curing, a single cast or a lone regen, Determination comes into play. Unlike spell speed, the increase in HP per second doesn't come at the expense of our MP.

Needless to say, as whm I stack Det > Crit > Spell speed. I weigh Piety between Det and Crit.

Yeah, SpS is a very bad suggestion. This is not WoW where you have to anticipate attacks and then react quickly. Every fight in this game is choreographed -- you know exactly what is coming and when. Additionally, the amount of SpS you need to reach any useful breakpoint is massive, and SpS does NOT effect H/DoTs. If your you ever say that SpS "saved" your tank, it's because you, the healer, did not know how to do the fight, did not know what abilities were coming, or did not time spells between auto-attacks. Essentially, you failed at knowing what you were doing, and should review your play footage to improve.
Crit is not optimal as this offers uncontrollable bursts of healing output and nothing that WHM has depends on Crit.
Determination on the other hand offers a consistent increase in your throughput. It is the best stat to focus on, period.

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Originally Posted by Zaft

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I respect your opinion as a member of Blue Garter but I think simply dismissing SpS because of choreographed fights is wrong. You play the game with people who are going to make mistakes and avoidable damage will be taken which means that you will have to "react quickly" to damage that you weren't anticipating. During that choreographed fight you will know how long of a recovery window you have for the next set of predicted damage and have to decide if you can afford to heal the damage you weren't anticipating within that window and this is where SpS and not Det can mean the difference. I'm not saying that this alone is enough to push SpS above Det but I feel it has more merit than you are giving it credit for.

I am not arguing that Det isn't the most consistent stat, because it is, but I don't think SpS should be ruled out quite so quickly.

That gear guide is poor.

Mind > Determination > Piety > Spell Speed > Crit

Heal potency, heal consistency, longevity, reaction time, over-cure.

Larger heals from MIND, more consistent high heals from DET, better regen & independence from PIE, better OH SHI- from SS, better enmity gain from CRIT.

As stated; fights are predictable. SS isn't bad, but isn't required if you know the fight. Consider 'knowing the fight' a stat that YOU, the player can level. Not your character.

Don't underestimate PIE on WHM. One significant pain-point of WHM is mana consumption. Any additional PIE is welcome.

What about the i90 weapon from the Primals quest? I know that has crit on it, but I have just a normal relic atm. Should I just go for the Zenith even though I really don't want to use myth on my white mage yet or go ahead and grab the staff for now?

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Originally Posted by FadingMoon

What about the i90 weapon from the Primals quest? I know that has crit on it, but I have just a normal relic atm. Should I just go for the Zenith even though I really don't want to use myth on my white mage yet or go ahead and grab the staff for now?

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i90 stick is i90 stick. Save the myth.

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Originally Posted by FadingMoon

What about the i90 weapon from the Primals quest? I know that has crit on it, but I have just a normal relic atm. Should I just go for the Zenith even though I really don't want to use myth on my white mage yet or go ahead and grab the staff for now?

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If you don't want to spend myth the primal staff is fine. It has alot of piety so some healers may prefer it. I just think its creepy looking...

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Originally Posted by Eriane

If you don't want to spend myth the primal staff is fine. It has alot of piety so some healers may prefer it. I just think its creepy looking...

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Yea it is really creepy, but vanity is coming next month.

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Originally Posted by SeraviEdalborez

i90 stick is i90 stick. Save the myth.

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I thought so. Thanks for the advice!

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Originally Posted by Pharazon

You play the game with people who are going to make mistakes and avoidable damage will be taken which means that you will have to "react quickly" to damage that you weren't anticipating.

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The issue is finding a situation where a dps was saved because your heal was .2 seconds faster. The theory is fine, the actualization is that unless you stack the stat you cannot see a noticable difference. For a sticky situation you are better off relying on a cd. If you were late to react to unexpected damage no amount of spell speed will save you.

It hardly even matters. What you really want is the mind and pie you get with whatever tertiary. And at full i90 you can't get more/less mind and, while it varies a bit, pie ends up pretty much good enough no matter what gear you have.

With few i90 pieces I'd go for the stuff with the most pie, including the primal weapon. As you get more of the good stuff you might think about the Zenith.

With the benefit of well timed drops I went pretty much full det where I could. It works pretty well for me. Now I'm trying (but not very hard) to replace SS pieces with crit.
In a world where tertiaries mattered SS might increase healing throughput overall in a vacuum but it also increases mana consumption.
I'd rather have "efficiency" stats of det/crit.
In the current game it makes little practical difference.

Personally, I stack spell speed on my WHM. Initially, I was planning on going the Determination route, but through sheer dumb luck with drops and myth purchases I ended up with somewhere around 490 spell speed. It was inadvertent and I thought nothing of it until I went and did Titan and realized that I'd run, assuming my spell would stop casting, but it finished anyway. With as much dodging as this game has for everyone in general, I find this way more valuable than a bit more cure potency from Determination. You can argue that because the fights are scripted you know when you have to move, and you're right. But until you've done these fights over and over and over, with the same people, that isn't relevant. Different tanks have different cooldown rotations, different co-healers have different synergy, and sometimes your DPS just get hit (often at the worst possible time.)

For me, it isn't the global cool down, it’s the reduction in spell cast time that is important. Right now my Cure has a 1.88 cast time (vs 2.0) and I'm not even in a full spell speed build. That .12 of a second might not seem like much, but it makes a noticeable difference in something like Titan Ex where you're moving constantly.

To each his own, but for my playstyle, spell speed is better.

Do ya know why there is a constant debate over this? It is because there is no BIS. It is all about personal preference along with fitting your groups needs. I know people who swear for one or the other don't wanna hear this, and I know you just love to hate on and boast about how your stat is best, and yes it is.... for you. The other guy is also correct in saying his stat is best..... for him/her.

It is a good and bad thing that the game doesn't rely so much on 2nd stats for WHM right now. It is nice because you can take a balance of them and work them into your gear as you see the need for them for your static. It is bad because some if not most players rely on having a BIS list to think for them so they can have the best thoughtput. ANd in most MMOs there is a clear cut BIS, but then again not always at launch. In all honesty, in the end there is no BIS. Some fights may call for some more DET, some have more of a use for SS, and all of it depends on the skill level of you and your group.

This is why these threads keep popping up, and will keep doing so as new players start playing and find that it is sometimes hard to tell which stat helps the most. It is becuase none of them honestly outshine the others to the point of an obvious choice. Gear yourself as your group and your play style needs and you will be fine.

Also having multiple sets is a very good idea too as in some fights you will find SS is useful, but on others it isn't needed as much so some extra DET is handy. So don't be shy to put multiple sets together as well.

I don't even think it's a play style thing. There's just no real impact with the tertiary stats.

Give me a full det or ss i90 set and as long as they've got basically the same pie and mind I doubt I'd have to do a thing differently between them.
Crit is a bit of a different beasty. But it'd mostly just be praying CureIII doesn't crit everyone for massive agro?

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Originally Posted by Eriane

If you don't want to spend myth the primal staff is fine. It has alot of piety so some healers may prefer it. I just think its creepy looking...

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That's the best part about it lol.