Don't Nerf Content! Instead - Remove old content's lockouts / caps!

The fairest way to help players who are behind catch up is to remove the lockouts to the old coil turns (to enable players to quickly obtain i-level 90 Allagan gear) and remove the mythology tome cap (to enable players to quickly obtain i-level 90 AF2 gear). It sounds like SE will be doing this. However, they also mentioned they will be easing the content. I highly disagree!

While I am sure that there is a small portion of the community that wants BCB to be eased over time; I feel very strongly that majority of the game's population disagrees. Most of us like the challenges. Just because I'm a casual player who hasn't reached the challenge yet doesn't mean I don't want to eventually overcome it. Heck, if it were up to me, I would insure that Twintania has an item level 91 cap to insure that the original challenge was preserved.

I am fine with allowing players to catch up via removal of lockouts and tome caps, but please don't nerf the battles on top of everything!

Goodluck with that. This playerbase apparently only has 2 hours to game per week and can't be bothered to learn how to overcome a difficult dungeon or boss fight all on their own.

Myth cap most likely won't be removed until they released Tier 3 tomes which will contain the next set of AF which is the Real AF2 set they revealed months ago.

PS DRG AF2 Armor set is going to be a more fancy Kain Highwind set

http://cdn2.dualshockers.com/wp-cont...Live_9_148.jpg

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Originally Posted by MasamuneBranford

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This was always the plan, let hardcore players enjoy the tough challenges and when new stuff came out, nerf the old so casual players can enjoy it.

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Originally Posted by Skotie

Goodluck with that. This playerbase apparently only has 2 hours to game per week and can't be bothered to learn how to overcome a difficult dungeon or boss fight all on their own.

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Skotie - it sounds like you agree with the proposal but you don't think it will work. You might be right, but I'm hoping you are wrong and that majority of the game's population does want to preserve the challenges. I'm interested to see how many likes I get so that we can show SE that a large chunk of the player base still wants to keep the game's challenges.

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Originally Posted by Dyvid

This was always the plan, let hardcore players enjoy the tough challenges and when new stuff came out, nerf the old so casual players can enjoy it.

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It may be the plan but do you agree with it?

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Originally Posted by MasamuneBranford

It may be the plan but do you agree with it?

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New content comes out, devs want people who are struggling with old content to get to it, thus they nerf the old content to make it easier to get to the new content. It makes sense and it works. 1-5 is (apparently) only receiving the echo buff, which means everyone will still have to deal with the mechanics of each Turn just, after a few wipes, with +x amount of each stat. It will still be much faster to complete it if you can just 1 shot each turn, so it's not entirely a "nerf" per se. Just makes the content itself open to more people who would like to attempt it but lack gear or whatever.

Just removing the lockout is kinda irrelevant since people will bang their heads against whatever turn they're on no matter if the lockout exists or not. The only difference being you can get all the gear from the turns you have on farm.

The point is, if a player is skilled enough to do it, he probably is already doing it.

The reasons why anyone would still not have done BC is one of the following:

1. Not interested at all in that kind of stuff
2. Don't have time
3. Afraid of peer pressure ("what if I mess up" etc)
4. Not skilled enough

To make BC accessible to these people:

#1: obviously there's nothing you can do if someone is simply not interested in the content. But then they don't want to do it anyway, so no reason to spend any effort catering to them.

#2: as many players have said, BC can be completed in an hour, with a good static you do it in much less than that. So what's making it take so much time for these people? The matching and the perceived time investment it requires (and the wipes plus the ensuing rage quits etc). So BC in DF, each Turn as one independent dungeon (piece-meal), plus no lockouts to vastly increase the population doing the turns so matching occurs faster.

#3+#4: make the content more tolerant of mistakes, and the simplest way to do that, is to make it easier. Something that everyone says is a walk in a park won't give people too much pressure, and they are more willing to try it.

Lockouts aren't the only thing preventing people from accessing the content. The difficulty adjustment is actually required to make it truly accessible to everyone.

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Originally Posted by MasamuneBranford

It may be the plan but do you agree with it?

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Sure, why not? Hard core players can move on to tougher content and casual players can enjoy the stuff they couldn't get into. Win, win in my book.

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Originally Posted by MasamuneBranford

It may be the plan but do you agree with it?

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I disagree with the OP 100%, you had your fun with the content, now it's time to stop being so selfish and let others enjoy the content you enjoyed. Not everyone wants a super challange that requires memorizing a pattern perfectly (and since when is remembering a pattern challenging, that sounds likes a kid in school memorizing the answers to the test. Was the test hard? Nah, he just memorized the answers.)

What is it with some people that they can't get it through their heads that this is a CASUAL online FF game, that translates to everyone having access to everything, not just the lifeless/jobless only, like FFXI used to be before all solo updates. Seriously, it's an exremely simple concept, why is it so hard for some to understand?

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Originally Posted by Cegiana

What is it with some people that they can't get it through their heads that this is a CASUAL online FF game, that translates to everyone having access to everything, not just the lifeless/jobless only, like FFXI used to be before all solo updates. Seriously, it's an exremely simple concept, why is it so hard for some to understand?

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I understand your simple concept. But can you also understand the simple concept that there are people who like to complete "all" challenges of a game who don't want to have to put life on hold to rush to get to these challenges before they are nerfed? Give us more time. We aren't even getting a year before content is being made easier.

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Originally Posted by MasamuneBranford

It may be the plan but do you agree with it?

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Totally agree with it. don't quite agree with the timing. I would remove lock out for coil 1-5 and put the CT loot lock out on it now
and remove that when tier 3 coil came out. You can't hold back newbs as they come in later down the road and lowering helps them catch up.

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Originally Posted by Haibel

Totally agree with it. don't quite agree with the timing. I would remove lock out for coil 1-5 and put the CT loot lock out on it now
and remove that when tier 3 coil came out. You can't hold back newbs as they come in later down the road and lowering helps them catch up.

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ok. This sounds in line with my last post. The timing seems too soon. SE needs to give its playerbase more time before throwing in the towel.

I don't mind them giving a buff to help get folks that are lagging behind a hand up to get through it, though I would appreciate it if the buff was voluntary, and maybe add an achievement for beating a turn without the buff.

I agree, we don't need the lockout removed and the echo buff. Removing the lock out is fine enough because one of the big issues is that players that can beat stuff like Twintania already have statics for it. Allowing players from those kind of statics to help others if they want will help a lot more than making the content easier because it will help players become better as a whole and refine their skills more.

I am with you on "don't nerf it" to a certain extend.
With Coil, It is not supposed to be easy, it is supposed to take you on. The lockout sucks I am happy they are going to remove it on the early turns.
With Pharos? Even the trashmobs feel hard. The Bosses take ridicolous amount of damage before they go down and the adds are not to joke about either. Haukke and Copperbell HM on the other hand are easy if you know what to do. Yeah Pharos gets easier too when you know what to do. But compared to Haukke and Copperbell HM it is hell.

Tell me again. What exactly is Casual in FFXIV?
Primals EX are not
Coil is not
Pharos is not
While easy CT Haukke and Coperbell are not.
Crafting? No
Advancing in Story? Well consdiering you need 2 times for manin story 8 people .... that isnt casual anymore

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Originally Posted by Cegiana

I disagree with the OP 100%, you had your fun with the content, now it's time to stop being so selfish and let others enjoy the content you enjoyed. Not everyone wants a super challange that requires memorizing a pattern perfectly (and since when is remembering a pattern challenging, that sounds likes a kid in school memorizing the answers to the test. Was the test hard? Nah, he just memorized the answers.)

What is it with some people that they can't get it through their heads that this is a CASUAL online FF game, that translates to everyone having access to everything, not just the lifeless/jobless only, like FFXI used to be before all solo updates. Seriously, it's an exremely simple concept, why is it so hard for some to understand?

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This is the problem with you people.You want everything handed to you. Where is your drive to earn something or accomplish something. This isn't as casual a game as you might think. As someone already mentioned you have to work at a lot of the content in the game (ex primals and coil used to be HM titan). Content shouldn't be nerfed because they are too lazy to put the time into learning.If remembering a pattern is so easy then why haven't you been able to down the content. Why hasn't anyone been able to down the content.

And as for the lifeless/jobless. My group raids 6 hours a week tops. We learned the fights and downed them in that time frame. If playing for 6 hours a week means you have no life/job then i'll be damned there must be a lot of homeless, anti social people in the world.

If they remove the lock then maybe they can gear up faster to clear the content and that's ok. But if they nerf it then there isn't a challenge there for people who still want to earn something rather then have it be given.

Apparently Pharos Sirius is difficult.... LOL

Answer: Lets nerf it so no one can find content enjoyable.

thanks SE for nerf it
too many elitist ingame now that make me cant progress to coil
i agree with OP if only the community is friendly....but that just a dream
with almost everyone that do endgame content is elitist, this make new player/casual unable to enjoy the game
and also the existence of troll on df

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Originally Posted by Zezlar

Apparently Pharos Sirius is difficult.... LOL

Answer: Lets nerf it so no one can find content enjoyable.

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It is not just difficult, is is beyond fun difficult. It should be at same gearlevel as Hauke and Copperbell below CT. But the bosses have stronger attacks than CT bosses, and some trashmob parts are, for a 4 man group, harder than the "trashmob" part in CT. Just match the difficulty to Haukke and Copperbell and Pharos still will be a dungeon that will be a challange. Or make it harder and put it on similar ilvl versions as Ex Primals (Come on it IS siren after all)

Oh my....

The only "hard" part of Pharos is when you run into it overgeared and you realise the bosses all have health % based abillities, I swear the only time I've ever had issues is when overgeared DPS can't rev down.

Never had issues when I go in with people with a Ilvl near the recomended.

I just got to coil so I would rather experience it the way it was designed then play a nerfed version. I say unlock the lockout then way down the road nerf it. I don't want easy mode.

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Originally Posted by Cegiana

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Where was it stated that this is a casual mmorpg? Also casual does not mean easy.

Totally agree with OP.

Honestly I think removing the lockout is enough simply because it allows those players in statics to help others.

It's as though Yoshida imagines these players will all have to be new 8-man groups that never played coil before. In reality I'm sure many FC's will help some of their other members once the lockout is gone. Not to mention players will basically be guaranteed the gear they want by spamming turns 1-4 until they are pretty much full i90, which isn't even necessary to beat turn 5.

Turn 1 is easy, SE ok'd the "enrage strat" for turn 2 (so that's easy also), and I'm sure after gearing up by spamming those turns, turn 4 will be easier for anyone that still has trouble with it.

Chill SE, a ton of new people will beat it when the lockout is removed... you don't need to nerf 1-5 ON TOP of that...

I have to say I was stunned when I saw Coil was being nerfed. We all knew it was going to happen, they said so from the beginning, but this soon? The game has only been out what, six months? Even with the introduction of Turns 6-9 I think this is highly unnecessary. And before anyone starts complaining that I'm just some elitist jerk who doesn't want the casuals to enjoy it, it's actually the total opposite. Only in the last month or so have I gotten to the point of consistently downing Turn 4, now I'm finally getting my chance against Twintania...except in a month or so that goes away. Despite how infuriating the fight can be, I wanted to beat Twintania myself, not have the win handed to me. Now if I fail to beat her in the next month or so, I'll surely get my win in the weeks following the patch, but it won't be the same. I won't get the same rush or feeling of joy from beating her, it will just feel meaningless.

As far as I'm aware, the actual difficulty of Turns 1-5 aren't going to be lowered, but we only get the echo buff? Which doesn't make it much of a nerf, but more like we got buffed. After getting shanked a few times, of course.