SMN Nerf again PVE+ PVP

"As an adjustment to overall game balance in both PvE and PvP, the "decrease HP recovery via curing magic" additional effect Miasma and Miasma II has been reduced from 50% to 20%."


SE, you guys said that changes to summoner would only take effect inside of pvp, Making changes to pve spells based on pvp balance is unforgivable, it's the reason i quit other mmo's in the past.

This HAS to stop right now before it get's out of hand, PVP is crap in this game anyways, would be better off removing that from the game that having a negative impact on pve

Except for the whole "You rarely ever encounter enemies that can heal"

Can you explain to me why this would affect PVE ? I can see why it would be nerfed for PVP....

C'mon kid, you are just looking for a reason to complain.

-50% healing magic is overkill in PVE (Although currently pretty much useless) and PVP. Obviously they didn't 'Nerf PVE abilities because of PVP' as they nerfed/balanced abilities ONLY in PVP this patch. So obviously they believed the -Healing to be OP in both PVE and PVP separately.

In case you didn't notice, this nerf is actually still shockwave from the Warrior updates.
You realize that Bard's Rain of Death lost the damage dealt debuff, right? That's because Warrior got it in Storm's Eye, and they don't want it to stack on itself.
You notice what happened here? Both the "Healing recieved reduced" debuffs were nerfed so that their cumulative effect is roughly the same as just one of them being there. That's because Warrior can now add their effect together with Miasma's.

So...where in PvE is this effect actually useful in?

Against the Garleans? You always kill the (pretty rare) medics first.

Thronmarch? WHM heals maybe once every other minute, and for barely anything (maybe an extra attack from each DPS...maybe)

Are there even any other healers in the game you can use either ability on? (I know some class quests have medics, but I don't recall any in the MRD/WAR or ACN/SMN quests, and even then...you still kill them first...)

It's not about how useful this particular skill is or is not, it's the fact that this was never complained about in pve, it was never op and now because of crying bad people in pvp it get's nerfed, it's the fact that this is the start of the wrong road to go down, i though that would of been clear but obviously not. Just wait until the start nerfing all the classes because bad players find something else to complain about being op cos it contributes to them dying in pvp. This isn't the 1st and won't be the last game that does dumb stuff to please the minority.

Also i think this might affect the healing Garuda receives but i could be mistaken

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Originally Posted by PurpleSphinx

it's the fact that this was never complained about in pve,

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Again...how often was Miasma actually used for the healing debuff? How many ACN even know it does that?

You're honestly crying over nothing. This "nerf" isn't nearly as bad as changing the color of the Allagan Trousers of Maiming from white to blue...now THAT was a nerf (it looked so much better as white :( )

Clearly you don't understand, this isn't the first time and it won't be the last time they nerf skills because of pvp, just wait until your class gets hit with it, see how you come here to defend their actions then, if it wasn't used for the healing debuff in pve they why would they feel the need to change it?

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Originally Posted by PurpleSphinx

Clearly you don't understand, this isn't the first time and it won't be the last time they nerf skills because of pvp, just wait until your class gets hit with it, see how you come here to defend their actions then, if it wasn't used for the healing debuff in pve they why would they feel the need to change it?

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Yes...DRG is going to get nerfed. Oh wait...we did. Its called Garuda EX...

And please, name a time when that debuff was crucial to your success as a SMN. Go ahead, take your time.

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Originally Posted by PurpleSphinx

It's not about how useful this particular skill is or is not, it's the fact that this was never complained about in pve, it was never op and now because of crying bad people in pvp it get's nerfed, it's the fact that this is the start of the wrong road to go down, i though that would of been clear but obviously not. Just wait until the start nerfing all the classes because bad players find something else to complain about being op cos it contributes to them dying in pvp. This isn't the 1st and won't be the last game that does dumb stuff to please the minority.

Also i think this might affect the healing Garuda receives but i could be mistaken

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It's the start of DC Universe Online. Since they already stole so much from it. Why not nerf as it does for crying players. That game ruined itself from doing changes for pvp and it going into pve.

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Originally Posted by PArcher

Yes...DRG is going to get nerfed. Oh wait...we did. Its called Garuda EX...

And please, name a time when that debuff was crucial to your success as a SMN. Go ahead, take your time.

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Lmao, DRG got nered becuase of Garuda extreme, that says it all, basically you just admitted your a bad player who can't avoid 1 move that always comes at the same time, i run garuda with 2 melee in group and they never get hit because they are actually good players.

I never said it was useful, they could of nerfed an egi, they could of nerfed ruin or ruin 2, i don't care what the skill is, that's the point im making that it was completely not needed and the only reason it even happened is cos of bad players like yourself complaining about it in pvp

Eidt Also forgot to mention that the DRG and MNK i run Extreme primals with always top the dps charts so yeah if you can't handle 1 simple mechanic then good luck to you

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Originally Posted by PurpleSphinx

SNIP

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Ah...so you're just another someone in a nice, comfortable static who is crying nerf...level a melee and use the DF. Go ahead, try it. Then come back.

Yeah, still haven't actually given a reason why you were nerfed, other then "OMG something was changed so it must be bad!" You sound like the people overgearing Thornmarch and complaining about its nerf...

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Originally Posted by PurpleSphinx

*SNIP*

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Healing debuff was not important in PvE, and I'm sure it's much easier for them to make adjustments globally without writing additional code for PvP specific changes. There was no negative effect on SMN in PvE, and therefore no reason to complain. Please get over it.

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Originally Posted by Mitski

Healing debuff was not important in PvE, and I'm sure it's much easier for them to make adjustments globally without writing additional code for PvP specific changes. There was no negative effect on SMN in PvE, and therefore no reason to complain. Please get over it.

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This. Get over it.

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Originally Posted by PurpleSphinx

Lmao, DRG got nered becuase of Garuda extreme, that says it all, basically you just admitted your a bad player who can't avoid 1 move that always comes at the same time, i run garuda with 2 melee in group and they never get hit because they are actually good players.

I never said it was useful, they could of nerfed an egi, they could of nerfed ruin or ruin 2, i don't care what the skill is, that's the point im making that it was completely not needed and the only reason it even happened is cos of bad players like yourself complaining about it in pvp

Eidt Also forgot to mention that the DRG and MNK i run Extreme primals with always top the dps charts so yeah if you can't handle 1 simple mechanic then good luck to you

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Double post coz can't edit on phone.
Just wanted to point out it's ironic that you are getting out dps'd by a monk and dragoon and yet are calling someone else bad.

Why would i level a melee? I don't want to play one, not unless we get Samurai, until then i will stick to ranged, and yeah i have a static for coil but extreme primals i mostly run in groups through PF, never have i ever failed due to a melee dying though, took me 60+ runs of titan extreme to find a good group, You think you got hit hard go play a blm in titan extreme

I like how people thought SE would keep their word that pvp wouldn't effect pve. Lol

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Originally Posted by KoujiGeki

I like how people thought SE would keep their word that pvp wouldn't effect pve. Lol

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But this change doesn't effect PvE.

At least not at any meaningful level. And hell, if you're in one of the few instances where it was relevant (mostly a few random quests) Miasma does in fact trivialize the mechanic, so even it you do want to point to the two or three times in the game where the healing debuff is useful in PvE the nerf is still justifiable.

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Originally Posted by PArcher

Yes...DRG is going to get nerfed. Oh wait...we did. Its called Garuda EX...

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legitimately lol'd

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Originally Posted by PArcher

Yes...DRG is going to get nerfed. Oh wait...we did. Its called Garuda EX...

And please, name a time when that debuff was crucial to your success as a SMN. Go ahead, take your time.

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Don't forget Ifrit Ex, no healer wants to join a party with melee.

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Originally Posted by paradigmfellow

Don't forget Ifrit Ex, no healer wants to join a party with melee.

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Not the case here in Masamune. Most Party Finder here have atleast 1 melee in all EX Primals.

The healing aspect is not considered op in pve because there was no relevant content for it yet. Chances are that in the upcoming patches they plan to introduce such mechanics (maybe leviathan) and realized that bringing a WAR and SMN with each bringing a 50% healing debuff would absolutely trivialize such content.

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Originally Posted by ChaozK

The healing aspect is not considered op in pve because there was no relevant content for it yet. Chances are that in the upcoming patches they plan to introduce such mechanics (maybe leviathan) and realized that bringing a WAR and SMN with each bringing a 50% healing debuff would absolutely trivialize such content.

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This. End thread. OP, nobody's agreeing with you, and for very good reason. As for "they nerfed pve for pvp reasons, they may do it again", that's both paranoid and missing the point. Probably what happened was the pvp situation alerted them to the pve op'ness of the war/smn combo vs any future content involving enemy healing, and nerfed it before it became an issue.

Everything's just fine....well, except for how much the "3-man pvp fix" missed the point. But that's another thread.

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Originally Posted by Alistaire

This. End thread. OP, nobody's agreeing with you, and for very good reason. As for "they nerfed pve for pvp reasons, they may do it again", that's both paranoid and missing the point. Probably what happened was the pvp situation alerted them to the pve op'ness of the war/smn combo vs any future content involving enemy healing, and nerfed it before it became an issue.

Everything's just fine....well, except for how much the "3-man pvp fix" missed the point. But that's another thread.

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If it's to balance against future content, shouldn't you/we be complaining that now you will HAVE TO take a warrior and a summoner to any fight like that? There aren't supposed to be party set-ups which are quite that restrictive...

Oh -mocking- edit: end thread. Why do people say that, it doesn't magically end the thread, just makes you sound like you're trying too hard.

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Originally Posted by PurpleSphinx

You think you got hit hard go play a blm in titan extreme

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BLM is fine in Titan Ex. If anything it challenges you to find ways to play better. Is it going to beat out a well geared and skilled Bard/melee? Probably not. But they can hold their own.

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Originally Posted by Thorauku

Not the case here in Masamune. Most Party Finder here have atleast 1 melee in all EX Primals.

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Yeah, we like to have a melee for LB3 for the big nail. Smart melee players (or any smart people really) can find ways to overcome particular challenges in a fight. Like melee can dps the nails that aren't on the side where the debuff is. If they can't get to any nails or have the chain on them, just dps Ifrit. It's not rocket science.

Well for PvE I know this will affect one of the ACN story quests. The one where you first have miasma and they want you to stop some healers from being able to heal up the tankish enemies. And again when you're on the boat (unless that was the same mission)

And I don't know if it will affect these but it could potentially be a thing for ADS healing when it absorbs other orbs, and Dreadnaughts healing in T4 when they eat spiders.

We don't know what the battle team has planned for the future, this could be a preemptive balancing for 2.2+. You do know that any buff or nerf on pve will always effect PvP...

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Originally Posted by Madoka

And I don't know if it will affect these but it could potentially be a thing for ADS healing when it absorbs other orbs, and Dreadnaughts healing in T4 when they eat spiders.

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I know those aren't affect by Miasma. Just like WAR self-heals with Inner Beast or Storm's Eye (or WAR, DRG, PLD, MNK with Bloodbath) aren't affected by disease/Goobbue snot.

I believe the healing aspect of disease only affects healing via magical cures, such as physick/cure. This "nerf" wasn't even worth making a thread about it. Now if they lowered the heavy effect from disease in PvE, that would be worth crying over as it helps immensely during fights, such as the slime in Wanderer's Palace and Dreadnoughts in T5.

Are you an idiot ? SE could easily change abilities for PvP and keep as it is in PvE, IF it's necessary....

Was it necessary in this case ? NO ! It doesn't affect PvE in any way at all.... So quit your whining !

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Originally Posted by PArcher

So...where in PvE is this effect actually useful in?

Against the Garleans? You always kill the (pretty rare) medics first.

Thronmarch? WHM heals maybe once every other minute, and for barely anything (maybe an extra attack from each DPS...maybe)

Are there even any other healers in the game you can use either ability on? (I know some class quests have medics, but I don't recall any in the MRD/WAR or ACN/SMN quests, and even then...you still kill them first...)

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Turn 4 Clockwork bugs have a small life drain. Not sure if this will stop Dreadnaught from recovering when eating bugs, but again, thats a really case scenario <_<

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Originally Posted by Itseotle

Turn 4 Clockwork bugs have a small life drain. Not sure if this will stop Dreadnaught from recovering when eating bugs, but again, thats a really case scenario <_<

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They do, and I usually Miasma 2 them.. but...

Did turn 4 last night with a sub-optimal group with sub-optimal AoE DPS, and had no issues in T4, still beat it before the enrage started. I don't think the Miasma changes will really impact any current PvE content in a meaningful way.

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Originally Posted by Itseotle

Turn 4 Clockwork bugs have a small life drain. Not sure if this will stop Dreadnaught from recovering when eating bugs, but again, thats a really case scenario <_<

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Self-cures (like Bloodbath, Inner Beast and the like for PCs, and I assume Life Drain-like attacks from Bats, Skeletons and the bugs) bypass disease. Play a WAR and run WP...very easy to see on the first boss, or in CT against those stupid tail-swiping mobs.

Also, it really helps to read the description of the effect...
"Reduces HP recovered by cure spells by 20% and inflicts Heavy +40%"

Disease has no effect on T4 at all

Cause we all know how reliable ability descriptions have been so far.