The medica 2 basically forced us to use cure3

I think this was the intention of the nerf.

Cure 3 still not an option for alot of fights that punish stacking and medica can also be used just fine instead for content .

In the next patch SE need to reduce the base mana cost and bring back critical hit over-cure. Tying the proc to cure 2 means we rarely see it. Sometimes if we do. The duration runs out.
Or how about tying the proc to medica 2's regen ticks? Like 10% chance each tick may give you the overcure buff.

So whm healing now unfairly costs so much more mana then scholar. Why? we have much less utility and scholar is required for fights much more then a whm is.

http://i3.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/...e57258202f.png

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Splorch

http://i3.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/...e57258202f.png

---

How exactly is this a "You don't say"?

Yoshida spouted complete BS when he said he wanted to buff us. Because he didn't, he nerfed medica 2 so we'd be forced to use cure3 since medica2 ticks are not enough to heal up people to full before the next aoe.

Healing with medica 2 was easier then healing with cure3. Not to mention how mana efficient it was.
Cure 3 doesn't work for half the fights and hasn't got the best Hp per mana. Nor will we see the new overcure proc when we need it.

New way to make people use a terrible skill: kill the alternatives. Way t go!

They should have made healing similar to BLM in the sense that spamming Cure I was your go to heal, but you had a 20% proc that Cure III would be instant with no MP cost. The difference here being that you'd have to try and keep the proc for a specific time, but still use it before it ran out or hope for another one by the time it's needed (similar to how BLM eat Firestarter procs). Cure II being a plain AoE healing spell and keeping Medica I and Medica II the way they are now and give Cure II a 50% chance to make Medica II instant and require no MP. Only reduce Holy if you're going to reduce MP cost too.

Then again, this comes from a BLM who is used to such a playstyle and isn't in any way shape or form anything related to balancing MMO's. This is just similar to how I thought it was going to be when I skimmed over the patch notes until I realized Cure II was the one that caused the proc. Don't want classes to be too similar, but a White Mage and a Black Mage are so similar in other Final Fantasy games, which each effect just switched from healing to damage, and vice versa.

(I'd also love to cast cure on skeletons to cause damage... just for old-times sake. Even just once...)

They should have just removed Cure III and given us a SS II that is maybe a bit costly but ss's the group. That way I don't have to spam it 8 times over every time I zone into/wipe a raid instance, not to mention would give us the ability to prepare for impending disasters should the other healer go down at an inopportune time.

And to the "You don't say". If an ability is highly efficient both in cost and HPS and you (as a developer) are trying to make another skill fill that niche slot how do you achieve that. You nerf the efficiency of the previous skill and then candy coat it by advertising that players, WHM's in this case, now have more "options". This has been done on almost every single MMO since the dawn of time, and if you played as many of them as I sadly have (yup, no life after hours) then it would be obvious.

Cure III range is still too small.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sharazisspecial

I think this was the intention of the nerf.
...

---

I agree with you, I found myself forced to use Cure III without a proc in certain situations last night when downing turn 5, like when a fireball hits and a conflag is just about to come, i felt like i needed to use Cure III to give everyone enough hp to be able to go into a conflag and not die.. Before that I could use Medica II and it would be more than sufficient.

I also did find myself struggling a bit more than usual with mana-- part of that could also be less virus's on death sentence tho

Honestly, I've never found Medica2 to be more useful than Medica1. The only time I ended up using Medica2 was for my first turn4 kill a very long time ago, and I had to group it with Shroud to avoid threat issues. Medica just does everything Medica2 does better.

For Twin, it's just Cure3 pre-cast once fireball shoots.

Titan (which I cbf doing anymore), Medica1 should be suffice if your SCH throws a Succor.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nofacekiller

Cure III range is still too small.

---

I agree with this statement. I initially thought that the +2y increase would be enough but it's not. I ran Haukke HM this morning and on the final boss my two dpsers (ranged) were stacked on me the whole time. Even though we were within radius of Cure III (which I did rely on) if they decided to move a little too far away it would miss. Forcing me into using Cure II to get their HP up high enough before the next rain. I hope in later updates they push it up to 10y. That's still not on par with Med I and would give room for slight error in team placement.

I don't know if there is a mechanic that you can turn on in character config that shows the radius of your own spells or not. If it doesn't exist then it should be added to help us healers with judging distance. It's challenging (for me at least) to judge the radius of a 6y heal while in the heat of battle. Using Med II on final boss would cause the adds to come right after me and put unnecessary stress on my tank (which I apologize to btw). Again I figured the reduction on HoT pot. would make it work differently but it is still producing aggro issues if used incorrectly (which I did use it incorrectly).

I'm actually fine with the 6y radius of Cure III, that's not what bothers me.

What bothers me is that it's so hard to utilize an Overcure proc when you happen to have one, or, attempting to get an Overcure proc without wasting MP in the process.

It's just not fun having to cast a 505 MP heal that has no additional effect and already requires people to stack on top of one another. At least in the rare circumstance when you do have an Overcure proc, and you actually need to use Cure III, and people are fairly stacked, it feels pretty good. It just doesn't happen often enough.

Overcure proc chance needs to be buffed to 25% or so, or the effect itself needs to be changed, yet again.

Reducing the base MP cost of Cure III to 399 would also work, and make having to cast it without a proc less of a bitter pill to swallow.

I suppose 10y would make it too easy... I'm ok with 6y but meh. Regardless the reduction to 399mp would make sense since Cure I is 133 and II 266... It would scale it in accordance. Then they could just change the proc back to the way it was or keep it the same (wouldn't matter so much anyways. I'm going to have to work on my Med II usage still. I mean later on once the level cap rises what are they gonna do for Cure IV? Make it cost 890MP-1200MP (lol)?

No time limit on the Overcure proc is the only thing that would make me happy about using Cure III right now....

What I would actually like to see is a channeled AOE spell. That would be interesting, different and could replace Cure III and/or Medica II (now that it is weak). I know there isn't even a chance, but another interesting mechanic that I have always loved is Prayer of Mending from holy priests in WoW. Would really like to see that. It could be modified to only jump to people within a shorter distance, as in melee only when initially cast on melee, etc. Just some ideas that SE would never look at.

I like the medica II change. Personally, my medica II heal does enough and the regen lasting longer is very nice.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Luso

I like the medica II change. Personally, my medica II heal does enough and the regen lasting longer is very nice.

---

Imo Medica 2 nerfed regen effect feels really useless for alot of the new fights . Well useless isnt the right word. Every little helps when it comes to healing. But the ticks are too small to make a significant difference. All it really does it save you casting another spell. I mean i could easily live without it now , i dont think it ever saved anyone.
Medica 2 saving grace now is its 20 yard range.

Its much better for randoms in duty finder who will run away from your cure3/medica. I mostly just do hard content with my fc who will group up when they need heals. Its good for fights like ultima too.

It occured to me within the last hour or so... but in regards to Cure III. If you guys can recall during some quests you would be given bombs to throw on specific objects or creatures. When clicked it would make a little circular field on the ground and would have a range to it along with a radius. I think if they did that for Cure III it would make it even more viable of a spell. That way instead of just clicking the target and casting; hoping that it will hit others around that player you could place in at any location within range. Even if they are on the perimeter of the radius it would still hit them and "feel" like it were reaching further. I would LOVE to see that implemented. It would add variety while keeping to the same spell mechanics. As for MP management a reduction to SoS' cast would be /welcome, but I'm not gonna get greedy...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Euphe

It occured to me within the last hour or so... but in regards to Cure III. If you guys can recall during some quests you would be given bombs to throw on specific objects or creatures. When clicked it would make a little circular field on the ground and would have a range to it along with a radius. I think if they did that for Cure III it would make it even more viable of a spell. That way instead of just clicking the target and casting; hoping that it will hit others around that player you could place in at any location within range. Even if they are on the perimeter of the radius it would still hit them and "feel" like it were reaching further. I would LOVE to see that implemented. It would add variety while keeping to the same spell mechanics. As for MP management a reduction to SoS' cast would be /welcome, but I'm not gonna get greedy...

---

Our mana efficiency has gone way down with the medica 2 nerf and new reliance on cure3/double medica. Some sort of mana buff would be fair compensation.

A reason for it could be even though the other healer is needed is irreplaceable. They can choose to forgo all piety gear and still have no mana concerns even without healing efficiently. SE seem to be trying to make the healers equal. But currently this is an imbalance between them.

If you're waiting until the damage hits for Med II, you're doing it wrong. It works the way it does now to ease up on hate generation. Basically, we can now preventatively heal. Cure III is a good melee heal. If you're in a dungeon, meh. Unless stacked on Siren. If you're in a raid, then Cure III will certainly have a place.

Sure, it's still a meh heal. We just need to get used to new mechanics is all. And I agree, an AOE SS would be nice.

EDIT: Cure III has 550 potentcy, so I wouldn't dismiss it too much. It's just a little screwy, unless you use it as a situational heal and that was what was intended.

Wait until you all get into Titan Extreme. Medica II just doesn't cut it there.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nofacekiller

Cure III range is still too small.

---

While I agree it could be a wee bit bigger, and should be a wee bit bigger, the REAL problem isn't the spells...it's DD's and tanks don't gather close enough when they should and could gather close enough for Cure III to be effective. They got use to the old way, and aren't adjusting at all to help. It's a team sport out there. (and yes, there are plenty of times where the whole group/those taking damage could be gathered nice and tight).

Two days with the new Medica II now. During most fights I keep it up at all times but to be frank, I don't even think it makes a difference if the regen part is up or not. There is hardly ever a situation where you let the dot tick and don't top a team member up. It's kinda nice to have something tick while you are busy removing debuffs during the Siren fight but frankly, I really don't think it's of any importance or is the reason to win or lose that fight.

And as I've said quite a few times now: The proc on Cure II for Cure III is utterly useless and doesn't help with MP management at all.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kyomih

And as I've said quite a few times now: The proc on Cure II for Cure III is utterly useless and doesn't help with MP management at all.

---

This this and more of this!. That is what I want 'fixed' I don't know how if should be fixed, whether Cure I might have a chance to proc another Cure I or even if they down, proc'd so a Cure III could proc a free cure II a Cure II a Free Cure I. But it is just not at all very White Magey to 'wait for a proc' and/or use a heal 'bigger than you need' just because it's free. I'd rather it gave us Spell Speed if we Crit or something...but the current Free Procs are crap.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kinseykinz

This this and more of this!. That is what I want 'fixed' I don't know how if should be fixed, whether Cure I might have a chance to proc another Cure I or even if they down, proc'd so a Cure III could proc a free cure II a Cure II a Free Cure I. But it is just not at all very White Magey to 'wait for a proc' and/or use a heal 'bigger than you need' just because it's free. I'd rather it gave us Spell Speed if we Crit or something...but the current Free Procs are crap.

---

I think I suggested some changes in another thread:
Either just put the proc to crit again and instead adjust SoS's cool-down slightly (or make it %based on MP)
Or leave the proc on Cure II but increase it to 25% instead of 15%. I don't think that would make it OP since Cure III is already situational and we don't/can't spam Cure II to have a lot of procs going off anyway.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Astrolia

What I would actually like to see is a channeled AOE spell. That would be interesting, different and could replace Cure III and/or Medica II (now that it is weak).

---

Ok I have to ask, since everybody else seems to know and I'm the odd one. What do you mean with channelling? Makes me think of a leech, GW's blood magic/TSW rifle style but really no clue.

As for new battles: I tried upkeeping Medica2 in Siren, hoped it could help me top for charm, but really felt like that regen wasnt even there.:/ Tried using Cure3 everytime people was stacked, and even got some procs, but sometimes it didn't go through at all (????) is it normal?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tlamila

Ok I have to ask, since everybody else seems to know and I'm the odd one. What do you mean with channelling? Makes me think of a leech, GW's blood magic/TSW rifle style but really no clue.

As for new battles: I tried upkeeping Medica2 in Siren, hoped it could help me top for charm, but really felt like that regen wasnt even there.:/ Tried using Cure3 everytime people was stacked, and even got some procs, but sometimes it didn't go through at all (????) is it normal?

---

Channeling means in most situations that your mp gets depleated as you keep a person under a constant influx of healing (imagine a beam coming from you that you keep up and the HP of your target goes up as long as you keep channeling). You basically keep a button pressed as long as you want the healing to active.
The regen on Siren really doesn't help much. Especially if you have the healing debuff up. It basically nullifies the regen. Just use Medica I and Cure 2 to top people off asap. You can try a DS Medica II, though :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Astrolia

No time limit on the Overcure proc is the only thing that would make me happy about using Cure III right now....
[...]

---

To be honest I think that is a great Idea.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Miiu

To be honest I think that is a great Idea.

---

I agree. Unlimited proc so we can asve it for when it is actually needed/useful would make it incredibly viable (espcially for fireballs on T5). That + a SoS fix should help bring us back in being able to burst aoe heal, keeping people topped off and saving MP.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kyomih

Channeling means in most situations that your mp gets depleated as you keep a person under a constant influx of healing (imagine a beam coming from you that you keep up and the HP of your target goes up as long as you keep channeling). You basically keep a button pressed as long as you want the healing to active.

---

Oh ok thank you, now I got it. Though I could hardly see this applied to us, with how bad our mp is already <.<

AoE healing was a complete joke prior to this nerf. One medica 2 was enough to take a group from 10% health to 100% health in a matter of seconds.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by reality_check

AoE healing was a complete joke prior to this nerf. One medica 2 was enough to take a group from 10% health to 100% health in a matter of seconds.

---

Not even sure how to respond to this. Are you saying Medica 2 nerf was justified? Perhaps SCH deserve a lot of nerfs then since they can take a tank from the same amount and do that every minute without using MP. All this patch did was give WHM more MP issues

Even post-patch I still haven't found any good reasons to want to use Cure 3. The radius is still awful, the proc never comes when it's needed and the MP cost is too high without it. I usually cast Medica II and then follow with Medica. It's ridiculously expensive, but it's the only way to guarantee that everyone actually gets healed without spamming individual Cure 2's on everyone.

Honestly, I doubt if anyone at SE actually played the class post-nerf to see if it was still viable.

I think it's a little excessive to imply that WHM might not be viable.


Us being optimal on the other hand is in question right now.

My idea for a new Cure III mechanic. I'm trying to build up support for them to implement this method so please give feedback!

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...Please-Read%21

My other idea to help with MP management (haven't suggested it yet because I'm unsure about it):

Possible Ability that can help with MP management!

Sanctum:
Cast: Self/Cast Time: Instant/Duration: 30min
Info: Grants the caster the ability to regenerate 10% of the health over-healed on a target back as mana.

I did 10% because it's a fair number. I don't believe it would "break" mechanics too much. I did consider 5% however, but the idea is get some returns from an over-heal and 5% seems like it is too low considering that most of us have 4k MP now anyways. To put it in perspective a 1k over-heal would only return 100MP. That's not even a full return from casting Cure I... So that is why I say it's "fair".

This wouldn't make WHM too OP would it?

I think perhaps 1 or 2 more y would be perfect, I have been trying to implement it, the easiest way I found was test the range in a party by targeting yourself, then when I use cure III I cast it onmyself and use my character to center on the other players, but even like this it is a little to small, getting better, but If I stand behind the boss and cure III myself I want to be able to hit the tank as well as all the melee and myself, could I beg SE for another Y or 2 on cure III or just give me a targeting redicle like place pet?

all they should do is simply increase the range of Cure III.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jarlax

I think perhaps 1 or 2 more y would be perfect, I have been trying to implement it, the easiest way I found was test the range in a party by targeting yourself, then when I use cure III I cast it onmyself and use my character to center on the other players, but even like this it is a little to small, getting better, but If I stand behind the boss and cure III myself I want to be able to hit the tank as well as all the melee and myself, could I beg SE for another Y or 2 on cure III or just give me a targeting redicle like place pet?

---

My suggestion would give us the choice of holding the heal until people were in range of each other or we could drop it on their heads right away. Either case this would help solve the radius problem IMO. This would also give WHMs a new "fun factor" to play around with.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...Please-Read%21