So have any of you fancy math folk been able to determine exactly how this skill works?
It says +20% CHR, however there's no clear indication if that's a flat +20 to whatever your existing chance is, or if it's 20% of that chance i.e. if your current crit rate is only 10%, then it rises to 12% with the skill active (I don't think it's the latter but confirmation would be nice).
Internal Release & Crit Rate
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10-31-2013, 04:18 AMNefGPInternal Release & Crit Rate
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10-31-2013, 04:25 AMPowercow
It's a 20% boost to your overall chance; if you have 10% crit and you use IR, you have a 30% chance to crit an opponent.
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10-31-2013, 09:54 PMEphier
Powercow is correct. As there are many skills that affect the stats in the status window, take bards dex/acc buff for example. When using IR The numbers in the status window do not change. As a monk we get 30% more chance to crit. You can see/feel the difference.
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11-01-2013, 01:16 AMThorauku
Hmm. It seems that everything in this game is Additive and not Multiplicative.
Similar to how Steady Hand affects crafting. -
11-01-2013, 01:20 AMpandabearcat
If it was multiplicative it would be horrendous!
And ps most damage increases are multiplicative. -
11-01-2013, 01:41 AMMagoArcano
I also was convinced you get an extra 30% chance to crit for a long time. But read the tooltip correctly, it says: Increases critical hit rate by 30%. Duration 15s.
Crit hit rate, not critical chance % >_<. If you have 430 crit hit rate.. with an extra 30% it increases to 559. If you have a idk 12% chance to crit, it increases to idk 18 to 22% maybe
You can have a secure crit as Dragoon often with life surge. And you do not crit so often with Internal release to make it for an extra 30% chance. -
11-01-2013, 01:45 AMMisakiSatomi...Quote:
Originally Posted by MagoArcano
/10char
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ephier
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11-01-2013, 03:37 AMThoraukuCrit hit rate = Crit chance.Quote:
Originally Posted by MagoArcano
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11-01-2013, 04:06 AMMagoArcano
....................
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11-01-2013, 04:48 AMMisery1337Wrong. Crit HIT rate =/= Crit chanceQuote:
Originally Posted by Thorauku
This should be helpful http://valk.dancing-mad.com/?page_id=202 -
11-01-2013, 01:16 PMNefGP
Yeah, they are not the same thing. Critical Hit Rate is measured against your target (idk what stats specifically, in FFXI it was DEX vs target AGI though I'm oversimplifying it) to give you your actual chance to land a critical hit.
So it would appear my initial hunch may be correct, though some math to back that up would be better. -
11-01-2013, 01:28 PMThoraukuOh wow, this is the first MMO that I've played that crit hit rate and chance is different. or maybe the term is just too confusing http://i.imgur.com/8rUhDko.gifQuote:
Originally Posted by Misery1337
Edit:
On another note, I tried using the simulator in the link, and checked Internal Release and pressed Calculate, and it does increase Critical Hit Chance.
Internal Release description is Increase Critical Hit Rate by 20% and going by the link you've posted, it does increase the Critical Hit Chance, so Critical Hit Rate = Critical Hit Chance. -
11-04-2013, 08:56 AMNefGP
Rate doesn't = chance, period.
IIRC, @ 50 it's been found that roughly every 13.8 (round up to 14) Crit Rate = +1% chance to crit. -
11-04-2013, 02:26 PMThoraukuI have some basis on what I'm saying, where's yours?Quote:
Originally Posted by NefGP
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11-04-2013, 02:55 PMchococoIt does increase the chance but not by a flat rate of 20%. Try it again. All it does is increase your crit hit rate by 20% and give you the corresponding crit chance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thorauku
e.g. at 341 crit hit rate (default in calculator) = 5.15% crit hit chance
at 341 with 20% IR ticked = 9.87% crit hit chance
at 409 (=341x1.2) without IR ticked = 9.86% crit hit chance -
11-04-2013, 03:04 PMThoraukuWell, with what you've said, then it's definitely crit chance = rate.Quote:
Originally Posted by chococo
Anyhow, I won't bothered anymore, I'm only basing my assumptions from the simulator the dude from other page provided. -
11-04-2013, 03:11 PMchococoare you lost or am I misunderstanding you?Quote:
Originally Posted by Thorauku
The argument from above posters in this thread says either: 1) IR gives a flat 20% increase to hit chance; or 2) gives 20% increase to hit rate which doesn't correlate to 20% hit chance.
No one said it doesn't increase hit chance whatsoever.
What the simulator confirms is that IR =/= flat 20% increase to hit chance. -
11-04-2013, 03:21 PMThoraukuWhat I'm trying to say is that crit chance = crit rate. What your statement clears is that the formula is multiplicative and not additive which is obviously stated in the simulator and I never mentioned about it because it is TOO OBVIOUS, but the fact that Crit rate (from IR) increased the chance, then my arguement is correct when I said that chance = rate.Quote:
Originally Posted by chococo
Got it? Or is it that hard to understand for you? LOL! -
11-04-2013, 03:33 PMAllyrion
To clear up all this confusion, Critical Hit Rate in the character screen should be called "Critical Hit Rating".
The current form is wrong and misleading. It is either a typo or someone doesn't know the difference.
Critical hit rate = Critical hit chance =/= Critical hit rating
Rating is the arbitrary number used to affect the rate of critical hits.
Either way, if IR is multiplicative then why isn't the rating in the character window changed.
Skill speed changes with selene's buff and there are other examples. Why does IR not change your stats?
I agree with Powercow, pandabearcat (who has made her own sim) and Ephier that it seems to be additive.
That other simulator might just be based on an assumption as well. I don't see any backing. -
11-04-2013, 04:05 PMThorauku
Ye, it's really confusing. One way to solve this is for devs to add a feature on when you hover your pointer to the specific stat. it'll show the % of that stat.
That way, theorycrafters will have an easier way on figuring things out. And not just base on assumptions as it seems really pointless. -
11-04-2013, 04:41 PMchococoLOL, it looks like you're the one misunderstanding the simulator (whether it is correct or not). Like Allyrion has pointed out below, the field with 351 as default is the critical hit rating and the simulator applies IR as a multiplicative 20% to it. The new stat value for critical hit rating is then used to calculate the hit chance (or rate if you refer, where I do agree in literal english rate = chance).Quote:
Originally Posted by Thorauku
Whether who is right, it's these dumbass comments that make you an idiot.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thorauku
Now back to Allyrion's point, IF it really should be critical hit rating (I do remember in older producer's letter Yoshi-P did use rating to refer to DRG's role as crit dealer), then critical hit rate could mean a flat 20%. -
11-06-2013, 01:48 AMNefGP
^ pretty much. But then reading comprehension is incredibly hard for some people. The Rating is a seemingly arbitrary number that gets applied to the crit formula (whatever that formula may be, I don't personally have it written down or anything) with the end result of that being your critical hit chance.
And I agree that wording is done very badly, though that's nothing with SE - we had to deal with it for years in FFXI.