Honest opinion on DPS queue times

Honestly I don't see why DPS are even complaining about the long queue times. Seeing as there are 9 classes with 2 of them are allocated to tanks and another 2 to healers with the remaining 5 allocated to healers. This leaves 5/9 or around 55% of the classes available to fill 50% of a group which is almost equal to the desired amount you would require having each role have equal proportions of available classes to available spots in a dungeon.

The problem lies in the distribution of the classes where everyone is rolling the most desired role which happens to be DPS or DD classes. Having a majority of people role DPS classes means that there are large amounts of people who are all queueing for dungeons at the same time for the same role which causes the bottleneck of supplying the other classes such as tank/healer to fill the last role required in order to find said run.

The solution isn't to just increase the proportion of spots that are available for DPS queuing otherwise you will always be running into the problem of making everything larger to accommodate for all the DPS players and there will be no end to it within any reasonable limit. You will soon see 8 man dungeons that aren't raids to try and fit 6 dps per tank and healer in order to shorten queue times and hinder FC's that run together or raiding groups that run content together as the distribution for them wouldn't be the same as those that are required for raids have the 2/2/4 requirement and unable to slot in to 1/1/6 to have the same effect.

The solution has been said a million times which is to either level up a tank and queue for your tomes or run with your FC as the dungeon requirements scale well for the raids being 1/1/2 into being 2/2/4 when you start raiding. It also takes you out of the bottleneck of the duty finder which tries to pair you amongst all the other dps classes

Don't level up a tank because you have to be a tank , level up a tank because you like tanking .

You need to be a certain kind of person to play a tank . For years I played a healer in most games because I enjoyed keeping people alive especially in those rare wtfshithit the fan moments when a bad healer would mean wipe .

To be a tank you have to have situational awareness, know all the mechanics of a fight . You have to know how to hold agro , how to regain agro if you lose it .

You have to know your healers / groups limit on how much to pull and for pugs this means you need to know very quickly .

You need to beable to position bosses correctly so DPS can kill without being killed .

Need to know when to pop cooldowns and not blow them at the wrong time causing wipe.


Yep screw being a tank , I levelled from 15 to 50 2 tanks in dungeons . Expert at tanking .

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Originally Posted by Grailer

You need to be a certain kind of person to play a tank

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You are really trying to sell tank as a difficult role to play when it's probably 2nd easiest after ranged dps.

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Originally Posted by alexstrasza

You are really trying to sell tank as a difficult role to play when it's probably 2nd easiest after ranged dps.

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then explain to me why half of the tanks i have queued with in duty finder have no clue how to play their role. its bad enough if your still running tank with blinders on at brayflox, but still acting like so by end-game is unacceptable.

sure, you could blame fate grinding for such habits, but if you level a job, you should at least have a basic understanding of how the role plays in this game.

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Originally Posted by saber_alter

then explain to me why half of the tanks i have queued with in duty finder have no clue how to play their role. its bad enough if your still running tank with blinders on at brayflox, but still acting like so by end-game is unacceptable.

sure, you could blame fate grinding for such habits, but if you level a job, you should at least have a basic understanding of how the role plays in this game.

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Pretty simple really. A Tank mistake is more likely to cause an issue for the group compared to a DPS mistake, therefore you notice them more.

There are plenty of DPS who have no clue how to play their class, it just has little affect on the group for most content.

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Originally Posted by Misted

another 2 to healers with the remaining 5 allocated to healers.

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You mean DPS, right? Otherwise this has gone over my tiny little head!

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Don't level up a tank because you have to be a tank , level up a tank because you like tanking .

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This is something I've always held true to myself. Why play a class you don't really feel like playing? Unless you're forced to in some way.

And then you get to Titan HM and realize DPS has way easier time finding a group than tank, especially Warriors....

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Originally Posted by alexstrasza

You are really trying to sell tank as a difficult role to play when it's probably 2nd easiest after ranged dps.

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Its not difficult its boring, i think thats what he means.
Only some people find tank enjoyable.

I agree that you don't have to lv a class because you need it but because you want to play it. I recently leveled WHM because I wanted to try it,and in the end, it's a job i really LOVE to play! Oh and if you're about to lv a Tank or a Healer, please don't FATE grind... FATE won't show you how to really play the game.

A good part of the problem lies in that you'll never see an arcanist in the dungeon finder. Ever. Why should they have to, why they can both tank and heal?

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Originally Posted by Misted

The solution has been said a million times which is to either level up a tank and queue for your tomes or run with your FC as the dungeon requirements scale well for the raids being 1/1/2 into being 2/2/4 when you start raiding.

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Not always a viable solution when you've levelled your tanking job and are wanting to work on a DD one. FCs also don't provide a guaranteed solution to this either as I find given the choice most of my friends will play anything other than their healers. I'm sure not everyone who plays a healer feels that way but there's no denying there's a distinct lack of them out there.

S-E maybe need to look at those jobs to make them as desirable to play as DD roles. I know from my limited experience of levelling Cnj to 15 that it was quite possibly the most boring experience I've had to date in this game. I'm not averse to playing a healing class, I've done so in other MMOs, but there's not one thing I find attractive about doing so in FFXIV.

Healers are fun to play at high levels. They're not bad at DPS!

My opinion on DPS queue times stems from a couple of factors.

1) FATE's have easier and faster XP than dungeons. People will naturally gravitate to the path of least resistance.
2) Dungeon rewards (gear) are not really needed and are a pain in the arse to get, especially if you want a certain full set. You can farm the Fates for seals and buy GC gear, which in most cases is on par with or better than what you can get in dungeons AND has a set bonus, which dungeon gears do not have.

All in all, there is absolutely NO reason to queue for dungeons other than story progression.

My only gripe with the queue times is I don't particularly want to do FATEs to fill in the void for my XP. Unless I go out of my way do them, that 30 mins to an hour I'm waiting is wasted because the XP I would gain from the dungeon won't make up for the time I spent doing nothing towards my class because I didn't want to do FATEs.

This is why I want dungeon XP boosted. For people that don't like them, they can keep doing FATEs. For those that prefer to do dungeons, this would be the optimal way to level, plus you get the experience of actually playing your class and not spamming the same one button over and over.

its really hard to do main story quests in duty finder for low levels...not sure how it is for end game since this is my first toon. I do hope they atleast make it 5 a 5 man instance like in other games maybe it would be better

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Originally Posted by DMCain

All in all, there is absolutely NO reason to queue for dungeons other than story progression.

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We are in agreement.

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Originally Posted by Ishmachiah

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Originally Posted by DMCain

All in all, there is absolutely NO reason to queue for dungeons other than story progression.

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We are in agreement.

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Not really. I prefer dungeons over FATEs for my primary source of XP, I was just stating a simple fact as the game stands at this point.

Why someone queues a dungeon is irrelevant, the queue times are horrid.

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Originally Posted by DMCain

Not really. I prefer dungeons over FATEs for my primary source of XP, I was just stating a simple fact as the game stands at this point.

Why someone queues a dungeon is irrelevant, the queue times are horrid.

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That's why I combine the two. I Don't bother with getting in a group while FATE grinding, queue up for a couple level appropriate dungeons, and spend the queue time doing FATEs solo.

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Originally Posted by Klutz64

That's why I combine the two. I Don't bother with getting in a group while FATE grinding, queue up for a couple level appropriate dungeons, and spend the queue time doing FATEs solo.

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Problem there is you can rock up to a Duty with gear on the point of breaking unless you can repair within the party accept countdown.

I don't even use df anymore. Sit in revelance toll and shout that I'm looking, or ask in any ls I might be in. Always better parties this way and quicker. Haven't used df in ages.

Well,

it's true that tanking is not that big of a deal.

My main is a SCH raiding Coil, but I also have a PLD because I also like tanking.
I still have to raid with it, but honestly in dungeons most of the time you sit in your position and spam your Halone combo using CDs when needed.
At least as a DPS or Healer you have to deal with mechanics a bit - as a tank that's pretty much moot in most encounters.

Yeah, if you lose aggro the party is screwed, but that might be in some cases a dps fault for having poor aggro management.

Fact is, people usually want to pew pew. They want big damage, they want to be the badasses that hurt their enemies.

Tanking and healing is, admittedly, something that requires a little more "responsability" at least in early game, and while if the tank or healer dies it's pretty much game over, dying as a dps is not THAT problematic unless you are in a dps race.

Honestly I don't care about DPS whining - next time they can man up and roll another role :P

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Originally Posted by saber_alter

then explain to me why half of the tanks i have queued with in duty finder have no clue how to play their role. its bad enough if your still running tank with blinders on at brayflox, but still acting like so by end-game is unacceptable.

sure, you could blame fate grinding for such habits, but if you level a job, you should at least have a basic understanding of how the role plays in this game.

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Same reason there were so many bad Arcane Mages in CataWow. They've been told how easy it is and they're shitty players to begin with.

I have a tank and healer at 50, love them both. Also played my wife's Bard a lot for endgame events. Tanking is infinitely easier in this game (Which is not the norm for MMOs).

Having tanked in DaoC, WoW, and AC, I am interested that you think it's easier in this game vs. the other two roles. I don't have a high level healer, but DPS feels a lot like DPS in WoW, which was...well, pretty easy. I certainly only rarely had to actually interact with other players in WoW, most of it was watching hate meters and applying damage on a set rotation correctly, and mathing out that rotation with each patch / spec / gear build.

The "problem" here is that this is a trinity game and there are two pieces of the trinity that are *generally* failure inducing if they go down: tank and healer. As such, they place more responsibility on the player, more pressure when playing, and for the tank they are center stage in the most important encounters, meaning all of their mistakes are highly visible. Otoh, I've finished plenty of pre-AK content in a fight with just me and the healer and our two dead DPS. Sure, there are DPS check fights, but there are plenty where they aren't essential, while there are very few fights where a tank and a healer aren't essential.

So, unless we disagree there, I see it as human nature -- the majority wants the big numbers and the strut without the "work," especially since this is a game. From there you get population imbalance. Nothing Sqenix does will fix this; the solutions given really are the solutions -- either change what population you choose to participate in, or accept the things that go along with the population you do choose to play in. I play both dps and tank, and do I miss tank queues (queues? I don't even know...) on my dps, sure, but I understand why they happen.

I don't understand why everyone bags on us dps saying all we want is easy mode. I plan on leveling a healer next actually, and played both healer and tank in previous mmos. I actually rarely played dps and wanted a change of pace, but I also wanted a challenge, so I chose mnk as my dps class (which actually when I chose pug back in 1.0, it could tank). I haven't leveled a tank yet because I don't want to, not because I want easy mode. Get over yourself.