the Time Limit for dungeons is unnecessary

Yesterday, i use DF to "the aurum vale" , although had some mistakes in boss fight and WIP, but everyone still worked and learn conscientious and struggle. Unfortunate the time is over ,we didnt finish it and feel regret, but it is a funny journey .

What is meaning of the "Time Limit " ? meaing you need to "rush"? or "if you need to learn fast ,or just get out "? if the time only 30mins, and the dungeons still have 1/3, what should you do? Stopping the players not the boss but the tiresome design from DEV. "Time Limit" is not funny or interest but gloomy.

I think it might've seen a precaution to people bugging bosses and taking their sweet time at it (soloing for example).

But for some dungeons, 90 minutes is tight for people that are doing it for the first time.

There is a Separate Server for Dungeons and only so many "Instances" of a dungeon can exist at one time the time limit prevent people from getting in a dungeon then going AFK or just goofing off stopping others from being able to que in because they are "holding" a spot. Best explanation I can do, hope that helps.

In my experience, long before you'll hit the time limit someone will ragequit and that leads to everyone leaving.

My guess is its to keep the DPS in check.

The time limit for dungeons is very necessary, to prevent people from tying up instances forever.

Seriously. Every dungoen has an extremely generous time limit- it in no way forces people to rush.

I completely agree, and have asked numerous times, what is the point with dungeon timers? I also know they are very generous and really there is no need to rush. But the timer creates the mentality, and for a game that relies so heavily on DF and pug grouping it is a horrible mentality to give to people. I have a scholar and marauder, so I hate the mentality the timer brings to the group. I barely have enough time to mark before dps is running in and pulling on their own. As a tank I hate this because my responsibility is to keep mobs off the group. As a healer it is damn stupid because I am wasting mp healing people who are taking unnecessary damage. People don't think to manage their hate anymore, which is a result of downing the mob as quickly as possible without taking into account this is a group effort. Sad part of it all is even when I let them do whatever and let the mobs go crazy the game is easy enough to where the dps can still survive.

People say it is because they need timers to prevent tying up the dungeons, I don't understand this reasoning. Wow doesn't have timers in dungeons, not that i can remember it has been like 5 years since I last played. Such congestion isn't an issue in WoW, why would it be in this game?

I wish they would remove the damn things, they are a silly implementation that does nothing but make pugs even worse then they already are to begin with.

aeno

The Dungeon Time Limit (and all instances for that matter) is there so that players are encouraged to try to find a group of 'friends' with like schedules so that they can play the dungeon content with. If you don't learn the strengths and weaknesses of the players you play with, you will never progress through end-game except out of pure luck.

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Originally Posted by Aenomaly

So the dungeon timer is trying make DF pointless, because instead of using DF, the point of the timer is to find static groups within our own server?? This is clearly not the point of the dungeon timer, what you said doesn't make sense. The dungeon timer is the speed up the pace of the group within the dungeon, for what reason i am unsure of. People say it is to keep the queues from becoming overcrowded, however I don't feel that is the case, and need proof. Otherwise they will remain a useless feature which creates the wrong mindset within the group.

Aeno

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Proof? PROOF!? YOU WANT PROOF!?

Okay, how about having to add Duty Finder Servers exclusively to handle the load of WP and AK for the added Philos and the increased Mytho?

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Originally Posted by Eightbit

A lot of the mid level dungeons are tight on time. Partially I think some has to do with gear, some to do with people learning, and some dungeons just seem long. I hated the time limit until I hit 50 and now it is rarely an issue unless the party really sucks. I think at most give some of those mid tier dungeons a few extra minutes and call it good.

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I didn't encounter any issues with the time limit until I hit the SIDE DUNGEONS (Primarily Sunken Temple of Qarn, Cutters Cry, Dzemael Darkhold, Aurum Vale). The main story dungeons are easy, but the side dungeons threw the difficulty wrench into overdrive for their starting level without having already experienced the dungeons.

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Originally Posted by Johnist

The Dungeon Time Limit (and all instances for that matter) is there so that players are encouraged to try to find a group of 'friends' with like schedules so that they can play the dungeon content with. If you don't learn the strengths and weaknesses of the players you play with, you will never progress through end-game except out of pure luck.

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So the dungeon timer is trying make DF pointless, because instead of using DF, the point of the timer is to find static groups within our own server?? This is clearly not the point of the dungeon timer, what you said doesn't make sense. The dungeon timer is the speed up the pace of the group within the dungeon, for what reason i am unsure of. People say it is to keep the queues from becoming overcrowded, however I don't feel that is the case, and need proof. Otherwise they will remain a useless feature which creates the wrong mindset within the group.

Aeno

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Originally Posted by Syncness

I think it might've seen a precaution to people bugging bosses and taking their sweet time at it (soloing for example).

But for some dungeons, 90 minutes is tight for people that are doing it for the first time.

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A lot of the mid level dungeons are tight on time. Partially I think some has to do with gear, some to do with people learning, and some dungeons just seem long. I hated the time limit until I hit 50 and now it is rarely an issue unless the party really sucks. I think at most give some of those mid tier dungeons a few extra minutes and call it good.

I like the time limit , it stops people from going AFK .. well most of the time .

There is nothing worse than .. "BRB my dog needs its tummy scratched "

Or BRB I need to go to the toilet for 15 minutes ....

It punishes people for being bad .

Wasn't the original limit 45 mins?

I have to agree, unless there's a technical reason why its needed I would love to see it removed. I recently did the vale as well, with a friendly group who progressively got better, but on our last possible attempt we were wiped with only a sliver left on the boss' health. If we had more time given I'm sure we could have downed him. In most cases this doesn't happen, but when it does it feels like an unnecessary kick when you're down ><'

So then the timer then is based on flawed dungeons and the fact they they haven't spread out enough of the currencies to enough dungeons causing people to overload the couple that do provide them. So basically this is just poor design, which wouldn't require dungeon timers if they had properly designed the later dungeons to provide appropriate amount of items for the players base. I again point back to WoW, not because i love it so but because they lack dungeon timers and do not have this issue. So the timer isn't the problem with the mythos and tombs it is the fact that they didn't give enough options endgame to farm for them therefor overloading the few options that were there.

Again, the timer as you see it wouldn't make sense if it was to deter people from playing in pugs, so that they could find people on like schedules and play without rushing. They are there for no other reason then to give people the impression they need to hurry through the dungeon. What for though I don't really know. People seem to be arguing that if they were there then people would afk or take their sweet time and overload the queues, hasn't happened, except in the two you mentioned. There wouldn't be and overload if they merely gave more options in where to farm items.

Removing dungeon timers would go a long way towards improving the multiplayer aspect of the game. But I am not completely against them, let them be an option that provide amazing exp and gil. This would allow people who enjoy them to still play with timers and give more incentive to run dungeons instead of fates.

I remember 2 dungeons who's time limit was really small.
In one of them the bosses needed some time to learn, and if you had 3 wipes, then you wouldn't be able to end the dungeon anymore. (the dung was 40ish, dont remember exact lvl nor name)
the other dung, was the manor, if you were in a party with everyone at minimum lvl, then with just a single wipe, you could end up not being able to beat it. (but if everyone was at its max lvl, you had more then enough time for even 2 wipes)
My first time in the manor, my party beat it, but we noticed we still had 1 extra key with us..so we went to find out the missing place and we barely made it in time. And we only got wiped once.

The time limits are extremely necessary to save the poor souls who don't have the guts to just leave. They are also very generous and give you plenty of time to finish.

It's to create a sense of urgency, they give you more than enough time. If healers/DPS/etc are pulling ahead of the tank then it just means they are bad players, not afraid of a time out. Not everyone has 8hrs a day to play so they don't really want to spend 2hrs in a low level dungeon they had to wait 30min to even get into. Even if you cannot find a full party grab who you can and queue up together so at least you know of two or more people who are not going to be terrible or burden the group. Most groups you can tell by 25% in your chances of taking down the boss, and if you see someone doing something crazy, TELL THEM. If no one lets them know they will assume they are doing a good job, which makes it worse on the next group.

Dead horse. Timers are pretty necessary for a number of reasons.

One of the major points is it prevents / discourages prolonged AFK.. Without a timer you would generally see more "brb in 20 mins guys! need to have a shower!".
It also promotes a small sense of urgency, I mean the reason you do EXP dungeons is to EXP.... If you have people taking forever and a day to actually do the run then it is highly inefficient or even on-par with other leveling sources.

90 mins is plenty of time to do a dungeon. If you are hitting the limit or getting even close to it, then there's generally a problem. Aside from this, if you are making the time then the fact there is a clock there doesn't really affect you.

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Originally Posted by Misaky

I remember 2 dungeons who's time limit was really small.
In one of them the bosses needed some time to learn, and if you had 3 wipes, then you wouldn't be able to end the dungeon anymore. (the dung was 40ish, dont remember exact lvl nor name)

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Probably Aurum Vale and Stone Vigil.

I wouldn't be surprised if those two are harder than any Wanderer's Palace or Amdapor Keep.

I've never ran out of time in a dungeon while leveling up. The tightest was possibly Qarn with people failing miserably on 1st boss because they had no clue how to dispel doom, which took them 3 attempts to figure out. And we still finished with 15 minutes spare.

The first dungeon I did run out of time was AK when we first attempted it, and we just couldn't get past the wall.

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Originally Posted by Aenomaly

So the dungeon timer is trying make DF pointless, because instead of using DF, the point of the timer is to find static groups within our own server?? This is clearly not the point of the dungeon timer, what you said doesn't make sense. The dungeon timer is the speed up the pace of the group within the dungeon, for what reason i am unsure of. People say it is to keep the queues from becoming overcrowded, however I don't feel that is the case, and need proof. Otherwise they will remain a useless feature which creates the wrong mindset within the group.

Aeno

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It's not about the queues, it's about the actual dungeon servers. You know how, when you have your entire party arranged, and enter the DF to go to a dungeon, and you have to wait because it's "reserving an instance"? In this case you're not queueing and waiting for more players, but for a spot on the dungeon server to open up. Congestion on AK was so bad that they changed the GC quest to send people to Aurum Vale instead, and they ALSO implemented an extra server because Amdapor was so packed with people who run there to farm tomestones.

Just to explain: you have lobby servers which handle people logging into the game, then world servers which hold thousands of players in the persistent world environment, and you also have seperate servers for instanced duties like dungeons.

If I had to guess, the timers are in place so people can't idle or take up spots for too long on the instance servers in order for other people to also get a chance to play on them.

This subject isn't a dead horse, the reason it is being brought up again is because we are seeing the affects of the dungeon timer upon the player base and DF.

The dungeon timer doesn't prevent douchebags from going AFK, they do it already, not having a group kick feature would prevent the afk. All the dungeon timer does is create a poor mentality within the groups, creating poor group dynamics and human interaction. We are still playing an mmo, so we need to realize that playing this game involves groups. Sadly this mmo has been largely pointed in a solo direction. Certainly it is bad players that rush ahead pull without listening and attack whatever they hell they please, but this promotes that, by creating a rush rush rush mentality.

Aeno

i missed my might-be-the-first-100-titan kill because the timer run out (that was a DF group)

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Originally Posted by Sterob

i missed my might-be-the-first-100-titan kill because the timer run out (that was a DF group)

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Happened to my DF Titan group as well (3% best attempt). I made my own pug the next day and got him down in 2 pulls.

It was always the same 1~3 people making mistakes and costing valuable time, a time extension is no guarantee that these people will have it figured out. 90 Min is enough time for everyone to get themselves sorted out and try to clear the content.