Seven Hells?

I often hear the colloquialism "Seven Hells" or "Seventh Hell" from NPCs, and I always wondered about it. It seems to be a prevalent phrase across Eorzea, possibly connected to the Twelve mythos. At the same time, many Eorzeans acknowledge that the dead (unless anchored to the corporeal realm) diffuse into the Aether.

So what in the Seven Hells are the Seven Hells? Do people experience actual realms while drifting the Aether? Are they arranged according to type of sin like in Dante's Inferno, or severity? Both? Are there any other concepts involved?

Finally (and I won't hold my breath on this one) will we ever go there? (inb4 snarky answers like "you might")

I think it might be similar to as in the real world, where we have assumptions about death that are completely based in faith (God(s) exist(s), there is a "way" and those who follow it are rewarded where those who do not are punished), completely based in science (you die, the electrical circuits in your brain stop working, everything you are and were goes extinct and you fade into oblivion), or some hybrid of the two (any mix whereby science is at least somewhat taken into account but you have a soul, damnit.)

Eorzean physics seems to side with the "back to the aether" thing, but they seem to still hold other beliefs, particularly about their version of The Adversary, the Black Warden, who dwells in the lowest hell. Interestingly, the seven hells correspond to the seven umbral eras - six based in the elements and one final threat rooted in oblivion.

If the rumours about Urianger are to be trusted as containing any truth it all, it seems to also be believed that each hell has its own Lord, and that there may be a cabal of mages dedicated to serving them in attempts to fell all existence to their darkness (Ascians, perhaps?), but who knows. Mythology is meant to be opaque.

Depending on what is true, what is metaphor, and what is myth alone, we could end up there. But who's to define where that is?

Glad I asked.

I figured it was just a myth, a remnant of old culture long-since refuted as mankind learned more about Aether. Although I'm still curious, since so many ideas we consider "fantastic" are quite literal in Eorzea, if there is any source for the myth. Maybe it's in some way connected to the Void, which is as well-known source of demons.

(Cue Fern rushing in with "What? The Void is no hell! It is a happy place, full of love and fuzzy marmots! I should take you there sometime!" which I will tentatively decline.)

That's the real question, isn't it? The Void is of an umbrella term for Eorzeans, used to describe anything beyond conventional wisdom's worldview. For that reason, it's easy for us as observers to attribute everything we don't understand to the same ideal. What if Louisoix's time-limbo is the Void? What if the Seven Hells are of the Void? What if reality is contained inside a bubble of concentrated aetheric energy that forms reality and everything outside of it is the Void? Is it all of those things?

In FFI and FFVIII we see that the Void can be used to traverse time, which makes as much sense as one can hope for. If reality is aether and outside of it is Void, inside of it is where physics matter and thus is where time exists. Likewise, a common theme is that it is separate from physical reality (both the light and dark worlds, if indeed both are used), and can return it to the nothingness it once was if the crystal were to be destroyed.

I should clarify that this isn't building up to a point, I'm just musing again. However, after seeing what very well may have been a dark crystal, perhaps the Seven Hells are actually the Dark World and we have yet to see the true power of Void (outside of perhaps Atomos?), but then again, Atomos spawned the very same demonic entities that the Ascians do, so perhaps we've cast aside the dual world method for FFXIV and we're just seeing an abyss of intangible ideas and essences that are made manifest by concentrated aether in one world of light under the crystal.

If I were to create an alternative theory to that of Catapult, mine would state that every world in the Final Fantasy universe (aside from VII and X) takes place in a different reality, a different canon, and a different world, but many share the same Void.

Think about it this way: What if the big bang isn't the start of the entire universe, but simply our bubble of it? The solar and galactic levels weren't the top of the chain, might there be vast distances of void between universes that share different make-ups and laws? Perhaps the Mothercrystal of Eorzea is but one of many aetheric concentrations in the void. Sure, she makes up all of our reality, but across the Void another concentration forms another Mothercrystal and within that isolated bubble of reality exists Vana'diel.

What I really mean to say is that I have nothing to offer you aside from that bit of lore above. We could see them do anything in the future.

I just assumed it meant the "Seventh Umbral Era", since an Umbral era is a time of cataclysm and scarcity, hence being defined as "Hell" by its occupants.

"Seven Hells" possibly referring to the 7 Umbral eras as a collective? After reading the above posts I feel so simple-minded.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Anonymoose

If I were to create an alternative theory to that of Catapult, mine would state that every world in the Final Fantasy universe (aside from VII and X) takes place in a different reality, a different canon, and a different world, but many share the same Void.

---

This is an attractive theory.

Idle thought: how many of those masked men have we seen? They're the Ascians, right? Could they be the lords of the Seven Hells? I suppose I'll have to count more actively once I've seen the whole story in order to form a more educated guess, although like anything else we can't speak with certainty unless it's made abundantly clear with in-game text.

This reminds me once more of the Dragonriders of Pern. The dragons cross into a place of extreme cold and sensory deprivation called "between" when they teleport. They can even time travel that way. The only differences is that they can only do so with a conscious effort, and it never happens without their triggering it intentionally. They also can't travel to coordinates that don't exist, and will only wind up in places that best match their mental images. They can even teleport to points that are occupied by other objects, such as a solid mountain, resulting in immediate death.

The authors never depict a dragon crossing into other realities, although there was a short story where they suggest a realm "beyond" that I have yet to read. I'm curious if it's simply a final resting place for the dead (which it seems to be) or if there might be other realms that could be reached if only a dragon had a guiding image. I'm also still not sure if between itself is actually a place, or if it's simply what we experience when traveling in a manner beyond what we can perceive of physics.

Back On Topic
I wonder how much we could learn from a clearer understanding of Atomos and the "Voidsent". The word itself could just mean "thing from elsewhere", which would allow for the notion that Atomos can draw monsters from various realities and throw them up on Hydaelyn. If I remember correctly, anything in the "Voidsent" category was coming from those gaping maws. Side Note: How many aggressive maws were there, exactly? 2 in Mor Dhona, 2 in Thanalan, 3 in Coerthas... how many in Shroud? I'm probably overthinking this.

No, it's most likely that Atomos' mouth leads to one place, and because anything "Voidsent" can come from Atomos, then anything "Voidsent" comes from that one place. It's clearly not so chaotic that it can't support cohesive entities like the Deepvoid Slave or Fernehalwes, which can exist in our world under our laws of physics. Alternatively, maybe Atomos is a biogenitor like Titan in FFXIII, creating the Voidsent himself. Does that mean the Ascians can do the same? Wasn't the BLM final boss something like that? I suppose that would break tradition, since he's usually an inter-dimensional portal.

So this may be a stupid question and I'm sorry if it is, but it has a little to do with the "Seven Hells" or the Void itself kind of... I think... So if the Seven Hells and the Void are "connected" does this mean that Atomos has appeared in Eorzea before? Assumably during the Umbral Eras. If so, why hasn't his name been brought up before in canon as such. Unless he was eluded to and I wasn't aware of such a thing. Or was Atomos only around for the end of the Sixth Astral/ beginning of the Seventh Umbral due to aether? If this is the case, would there have been other Voidsent "gateways" around for previous calamities? Again sorry if this is a stupid question or if someone has stated this somewhere else prior to this.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Haxaan

So this may be a stupid question...

---

Not a stupid question at all; we know next to nothing about Atomos. We've confirmed that (at least as far as Eorzeans are concerned) he qualifies as a voidsent and, as far as I know, that's about it. Nobody seemed to liken him to past legends or existing knowledge, so if he did come around before, evidence he left is even less than the Allag, about whom we know very little aside from students of their relics and ruins.

We do have confirmation, though, that its role in the Calamity was an introduction to a more important role in ARR, so you'll get your answers in time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Haxaan

So this may be a stupid question and I'm sorry if it is, but it has a little to do with the "Seven Hells" or the Void itself kind of... I think... So if the Seven Hells and the Void are "connected" does this mean that Atomos has appeared in Eorzea before? Assumably during the Umbral Eras. If so, why hasn't his name been brought up before in canon as such. Unless he was eluded to and I wasn't aware of such a thing. Or was Atomos only around for the end of the Sixth Astral/ beginning of the Seventh Umbral due to aether? If this is the case, would there have been other Voidsent "gateways" around for previous calamities? Again sorry if this is a stupid question or if someone has stated this somewhere else prior to this.

---

I don't think we have enough information at our fingertips to draw inferrences about previous calamities, nor can we properly assert the true nature of the seven hells yet, but it is certainly something we can explore along the way.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Anonymoose

If I were to create an alternative theory to that of Catapult, mine would state that every world in the Final Fantasy universe (aside from VII and X) takes place in a different reality, a different canon, and a different world, but many share the same Void.

---

This is what I've been thinking for some time and it was actually Dissidia that gave me the idea, with a little help from FFV.
My little theory simply sought to reconcile III and XIV in the same world (which I think we've sufficiently proven is not the case by now, as interesting a rabbit hole as it was).