All this made encounter design better a few years ago. (my opinion)

After seeing the latest LL and Yoshida giving us a sneak peek into the upcoming Raid (M5) something was quite obvious. M5 will be very simular to M1. Another Left/Right dodge at the start. (With Savage probably having Buddy- or Lightpartystacks again) This is not the first time SE did this.
It's no secret that Buddy- ,Lightparty- 8-Manstacks, Speads, Proteanpositions are part of FFXIVs Raids since the early days BUT we had something other than this going on while playing the mechanic.

Alphascape V1 (o9s)
o9 had like most other fights in this game. Stacks, Speards, Flares ect. but in the form of debuffs that had to be played correctly and in a different way other than just a stack or spread.
https://i.imgur.com/Th53rce.png
https://i.imgur.com/CFBaUx9.png
https://i.imgur.com/apgxp5s.png
https://i.imgur.com/s5AbP5e.png

Different Paths giving more "replayability" for especially melee-/tankplayers that like to optimize. Last seen in P8S but totally negated by the large hitboxes and full uptime in Endwalker.
https://i.imgur.com/G0oJXiE.png


I wanted to parse orange but all I got instead was damage downs and a bucket of salt. :Smadge:
https://i.imgur.com/LC0Vk2m.png
Failing a mechanic today ends up in a Vulnerability-Up/DMG-Down for the entire party.
It used to be only for yourself/the player that failed the mechanic. (In most raids)
The partywide DMG-Downs/Vuln-Ups are making PF'ing quite annoying. Getting punished this way is not fun. Especially as a "Helper" (Parser in disguise) in clear and kff's.
The PF was way more alive and filled with KFF's, Clear- and Funruns before the change to partywide DMG-Downs/Vuln-Ups.


Unique ways of punishing the player for failing a mechanic. Only needs one picture!
https://i.imgur.com/ni07cnh.png
Its really sad to not see something like this anymore.



I could list so many more things that went better back in the days but im honestly quite tired of this game now.

Please share your own opinion aswell. What made encounter design better for you?

O8S Forsaken 1

https://youtu.be/obJEyZpb1Vg?si=l2szDJcmvL6E3Iwg&t=70

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Red-thunder

Back in Stormblood there was a Savage raid called O8S.

One of the mechanics was called Forsaken.

Forsaken 1 was probably the most interesting heal check they've ever put into this game and it was more than just walking to the correct spot.

Kefka starts by casting Heartless Archangel. This applies a debuff called Incurable that has something like...

- A 5 second incurable debuff if you are at max HP when Heartless Archangel lands.
- A 12 second incurable debuff if you are not at max HP when Heartless Archangel lands.

(Numbers could be wrong it's been like 7 years since I did that fight)

Incurable means any form of healing and shielding will not apply while you have the debuff.

Now Heartless Archangel also drops everyone down to 1 HP. So you're at 1 HP *and* you also cannot receive any heal? And right after HA the DPS also needs to soak damage immediately?

The solution was elegant: you have to pre-shield them enough so that they can survive some hits during Incurable. And 3 seconds after Incurable drops off, they also need to soak damage from the Kefka heads. That requires them to be healed right after Incurable. So timing is important here, where the healers have to let the heal land right as Incurable falls off, and heal enough in a short time so that the DPS can do their job. The DPS also has to pay attention to their health and pop the Kefka heads only when they are ready to soak a hit. The tankbusters will then happen, so after taking care of the DPS, the healers need to take care of healing the tank. Back then we didn't have OP heals like Macrocosmos, so it actually required multiple abilities and GCD healing. Knowing to choose the right heal - AoE or single target actually mattered for this mechanic.

And Heartless Archangel is then casted again in like 40 seconds or something, after a gauntlet of damage, tankbusters, and heavy-hitting raidwides. In fact I think it happened like 7 seconds after an Ultima, so you have to get everyone to max HP right after a very heavy-hitting raidwide.

Back then healers actually had to use Helios and Medica. The world top logs had 20+ casts of Aspected Benefic, Aspected Helios, and Helios.

There are several more examples like the CC in A6S (which had an encore in E8S), the kiting in T7S, etc....

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A6S CC phase: https://youtu.be/04yIFeihEv0?si=XIW5Ee0BGXatP4sb&t=166

E8S add phase: https://youtu.be/ON7D3uqnjSw?si=Iavbm9sSshF2pgRB&t=246

T7: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_uFmPaPedE

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Fagotura

O8S Forsaken 1

https://youtu.be/obJEyZpb1Vg?si=l2szDJcmvL6E3Iwg&t=70

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Im really surprised that Oppa didnt cover the Bard a single time to take the Far-Wing of Destruction lmao. My greedy a*s would have done it. F them healers.

But yes, Kefka was really good. Not only Kefka. Even o5s with the unique solo add rooms and o6s with the painting stuff made sigmascape really stand out compared to current raids. Sad the playerbase complained about dutyactions and addphases back in stormblood. I would rather have this than what we have now.

Also wanted to add some of the ARR dungeons

The trash actually felt interesting back then in some of them. For example in Wanderers Palace you're chased by a huge Tonberry. In WP hard mode you have to drag adds out of totems.

Little quirks like those made the dungeons feel different from each other and spice up the gameplay.

I honestly have no idea why dungeons are so much blander than ARR ones. The dungeons were so fun and they also pumped out 2 to 3 per patch. We've really fell off lol.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by YukioKobayashi

Failing a mechanic today ends up in a Vulnerability-Up/DMG-Down for the entire party.
It used to be only for yourself/the player that failed the mechanic. (In most raids)
The partywide DMG-Downs/Vuln-Ups are making PF'ing quite annoying. Getting punished this way is not fun. Especially as a "Helper" (Parser in disguise) in clear and kff's.

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I think it's a lot more fair like that. As long as it involves a group, the penalty should be group-wide.

What you are basically suggesting is: "Let me be awful have 0 contribution and yet get carried" No thanks, there is enough of that even the way fights are designed now (basically not enough body checks).

I think the damage downs should like FRU, where they give you a 90% dmg penalty. You don't wipe and you can continue practicing but you def aren't seeing the next phase/clear the fight. Do you want to clear the fight? Sure, but you have to earn it.

PS: I am currently doing A8s Blind MINE (min ilvl, no echo, no guides) and I don't think it's all that special. Not one single mechanic in that fight is wow, that different or all that difficult or complex compared to current stuff. It still requires coordination and the group to perform well but that's to be expected.
The only major difference is that shared/solo tank busters are not marked and some of the snapshots are wonky as fuck.