Change the structure of the 4-dungeons, maybe?

Good day.

Have you ever thought how clone-like all this 4-ppl dungeons are? Trash mobs, trash mobs, boss, trash mobs, trash mobs, boss, trash mobs, trash mobs, boss. Such a structure became ridiculous boring and not interesting in the previous age already!!! Why every patch we get 2 "new" dungeons, that dont differ from the previous at all? Is it really hard to create an original structure for each dungeon to make them different? Or we gonna chase through this "clones" forever?

It is a dangerous game to change the norm when many people don't like change and want to just mindlessly farm their tomes each week in experts. It may be possible if the community gave any ideas on the subject.

Do you have any original thought or is this just a whine?

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Originally Posted by Edewen

It is a dangerous game to change the norm when many people don't like change and want to just mindlessly farm their tomes each week in experts. It may be possible if the community gave any ideas on the subject.

Do you have any original thought or is this just a whine?

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At first- yes, it is some kind of a whine. It is not my duty to create something interesting, it is the duty of SE, that is why I pay my money. Still, the ideas. I think it is only a question of imagination. it can be a simple logical puzzles, it can be secret rooms and secret bosses, it can be the trial rooms for each of a party member, it also can be a time trials
or
if simple, it can be just another structure for each dungeon. For one dungeon- boss, mobs, mobs, boss. For another- mobs, mobs, boss, boss and so on

The main problem here is that different ideas must be realized through the difficulty too, but players in FF don't like anything difficult

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Originally Posted by Xyno

It is not my duty to create something interesting, it is the duty of SE, that is why I pay my money.

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Then vote with your wallet. Games such as this rely greatly on feedback of the community to generate something good. That feedback comes in the form of ideas which are followed up by community discussion that gets thier attention as something the majority might want and not just one persons whine. As I said, change is difficult. especially when you are trying to keep millions of people happy.

1. The community takes the path of least resistance when it comes to their farming. Secret bosses and rooms would be interesting day oen then no one would do them. I like the idea but implementation does really work out as secrets aren't a thing in mmos.
2. switching the order of mobs and boss doesn't really do anything. This is not change and is therefore uninteresting.
3. Difficulty. at this stage in the expansion, dungeons are catchup. Without that, people would be screwed. You cannot really complain it is easy when people are MANY ilvls about what drops.

The only real place to add innovation would be in the fights themselves. Unfortunately, dungeons need to be accessible to even the most casual audience. Personally, I think the lvl 60 and lvl 50 roulettes should be reworks. Sync to the ilvl on the dungeons and provide more tomes. Like 300 poetics for a 50, 300 lore for a 60. This would provide a reason to do them, justify the challenge of minimum ilvl, and not overpower and affect current content/tomes

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Originally Posted by Xyno

... It is not my duty to create something interesting...

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If you don't have any ideas to actually put forward, then your money alone isn't going to say much. Its absence can do as much to scare SE to further prioritize the things you find stale as scare SE into doing something new. And its presence doesn't connote any clear request except that servers stay online.

It might not be your job, but until you can throw some actual ideas out there, why would you expect that SE, who you've pretty well defined as cheap and unimaginative over your threads, would suddenly come up with something more, or, more specifically, to your liking?

Now, that's not to say that vague complaints haven't been reacted to. I can trace many a hated change in WoW to such complaints, for example, which in turn bring in more vague complaints and subsequent poorly realized changes.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

If you don't have any ideas to actually put forward, then your money alone isn't going to say much. Its absence can do as much to scare SE to further prioritize the things you find stale as scare SE into doing something new. And its presence doesn't connote any clear request except that servers stay online.

It might not be your job, but until you can throw some actual ideas out there, why would you expect that SE, who you've pretty well defined as cheap and unimaginative over your threads, would suddenly come up with something more, or, more specifically, to your liking?

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Do you really like the structure of all these 4-dungeons? I dont like. that is why I just say "SE, I dony like, because it is already totally not interesting and boring, make something new".

Main thing id like to see a change on is difficulty and sadly i don't see that going over well. I am not suggestion savage levels of difficulty, but a dungeon should always at least present a real possibility of "failure". As the game is currently there are actual examples even within some of the leveling dungeons such as Aurum Vale and Qarn. I am not asking for anything considerably harder than AV but it should at the very least offer as much as that does sync'd. I would like it if the Dungeon actually started the player "synced" and then added a bonus based on the ilvl the player entered the dungeon with resulting in less power overall, but still making a bit of difference based off of the equipped ilvl.

I would not mind alternate paths either (decided by the game not the player since it would just result in "best" path) For example a place like tam tara, that already has some paths that stray from linear, could be made to lead to different boss encounters as their "mid boss" On the topic of bosses, I would like to see more options in the way they attack and decide attacks, based on how they "perceive" the party is positioned (admittedly still artificially complex but it is something at least) An example (idk if this was an actual thing or just coincidence XD) in Brayflox's Longstop the dragon boss seems to react differently based on whether the tank dodged the poison/got esuna'd or the poison landed and stuck.

I could see even little changes, over time, adding flavor to the 4 man dungeon experience and alleviating the feeling of monotony while still being able to be kept to twenty or thirty minutes completion for the attentive party.

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Originally Posted by Gumbercules

Main thing id like to see a change on is difficulty and sadly i don't see that going over well. I am not suggestion savage levels of difficulty, but a dungeon should always at least present a real possibility of "failure".

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Amdapor keep with a Demon Wall was a great dungeon with a real wipe mechanic and DPS ckeck

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Originally Posted by Xyno

Amdapor keep with a Demon Wall was a great dungeon with a real wipe mechanic and DPS ckeck

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yeah the wall was a good example of a challenge without being extremely hard, if a grp was paying attention it was very doable while still penalizing blatant carelessness and not paying attention.

Overall the lowest overall difficulty in ff 14 needs to see a nudge to being more challenging. Can't say that HW at the start wasn't in a decent spot though (with questing and mob difficulty) The issue is namely with how do you go about addressing the unavoidable power creep that comes with not just physical levels but ilvl increases. the first zones for HW for example lead to actual use of cds if you picked a fight with more than 2 mobs for example and it carried well into the end of leveling. (some classes have it easier etc, I realize that is a thing)Come end game the world blatantly loses any semblance of challenge even with lvl synced beast quests and in most cases the hunts.

I would like dungeons that confuse you. Antitower could of been fantastic if they changed our camera so we were actually upside down.
Even changing the controls completely like a mirror dungeon up is down left is right. I would like to see mobs actually buff up each other, fine grab a big pull but they have put on AOE balance/protect/stoneskin.

I am not bothered how long a dungeon takes, as long as the rewards are worth it and it's actually fun. Only reason we speed run is because prior to the boss it's a snoozefest.