Content should be challenging to execute... Not challenging to learn

I don't want to have to read an entire textbook to figure out how to kill a boss.

I don't want to spend 30minutes watching a video learning how to kill a boss.

I'm not interested in a massive learning curve to kill a boss.

Content can be challenging without being overly complex and massively overloaded with mechanics.

Bismark Ex for example isn't a mechanically complex boss. Shoot dragonkillers when they're ready. Kick his ass when he docks. Kill serpent opposite of your debuff. Ready dragonkillers and kick his ass again.

He was interesting content without requiring your to study for a good hour to clear him. Bismark Ex tested how good you are at your job and how good you are at dodging, not how much time you spent reading a book on bismark ex.

T9 on the other hand was full of ridiculous and unintuitive mechanics. Writing out your name with meteors, doing the hokey pokey with fire, ice and lightning, feeding your neopets on meteors.... I mean seriously, how would I know that golems like eating meteors? And why on Earth would I want to feed a golem a meteor when he just gets bigger and stronger?

Come on Square, you can create unique and interesting mechanics without requiring a massively steep learning curve that requires players countless hours to memorize everything that's happening.

I like how u mention bismarck EX.....
Which is probably the easiest EX primal to date. A complete faceroll.

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Originally Posted by Outfoxed

T9 on the other hand was full of ridiculous and unintuitive mechanics. Writing out your name with meteors, doing the hokey pokey with fire, ice and lightning, feeding your neopets on meteors.... I mean seriously, how would I know that golems like eating meteors? And why on Earth would I want to feed a golem a meteor when he just gets bigger and stronger?

Come on Square, you can create unique and interesting mechanics without requiring a massively steep learning curve that requires players countless hours to memorize everything that's happening.

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Get good Dude

Well... MMOs have this odd little thing that no other game genre does (to my knowledge). Their raid mechanics are often completely counterintuitive. Like you get a mark, or a tether, or who knows -- if you haven't watched/read a guide, you have no idea what to do with it and whatever you try is most likely wrong.

That said, once you know the strategy, is IS all execution. Lucrezia, Blue gartr, etc get world firsts not only because they can puzzle out the mechanics, but also because they can execute with a degree of perfection not attainable even by those clearing a few weeks later.

And all of that said, I'd welcome more fights that resemble MH and such.

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Originally Posted by ValkyrieL

I like how u mention bismarck EX.....
Which is probably the easiest EX primal to date. A complete faceroll.

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I would think it would be easy, but the steep DPS check and missing even once on the DK in Phase 3 which summons more adds... I've been getting wipes on that mostly on Phase 2 and Phase 3 a few times. We did manage to get it to 14% but the island got destroyed before we could finish the boss.

Even with a PF for ilvl170+ players and no MCH & BRD before 3.01 I would think we would've licked it by now. It seems Malboro has its shares of players having a rough time with endgame content... a lot.

how on earth is anything challenging to execute without having to learn anything new to actually make it a challenge? Especially in a game like this?

This isn't an action game, and they can't just make AoEs detonate faster or throw more of them at the screen, that's a faker difficulty than one that makes you fight blind.

And TBH, there aren't TOO many fights in this game where the mechanics just come out of absolutely nowhere. There are some like t5 or t9 that are unforgiving to learn, but most of them are lightly touched upon in the HM fight before they blow up in your face in EX.

The issue is that your magical fight that has few mechanics but is still difficult doesn't exist. Bismarck was not hard, he was a Patchwerk with some simple "dodge this" mechanics thrown in. That's not difficult nor is it even remotely intuitive.

Real difficulty in a boss encounter comes from being able to master various difficult mechanics while also performing your role perfectly. You take the various difficult mechanics out and all you have left is a boss that only requires you to play your class properly and then hands you loot... like Bismarck.

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Originally Posted by Edellis

how on earth is anything challenging to execute without having to learn anything new to actually make it a challenge? Especially in a game like this?

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Go do coils using minimum ilvl sync and click off echo. And then note that the world first people completed them at ilvls below even that. If that's not a challenge for some people, they probably need to switch genres (but only some really niche games will be harder than that).

As others already stated. The difference between Bismarck EM and T9 is, that Bismarck EM is faceroll primal that has been already cleared by anyone who has 2 hands while T9 was and still can be pretty challenging and well thought fight.
And honestly if there were only fights at the same difficulty like Bismarck EM there would not be any raiders/statics etc anymore, because there would be no end game content for such people. By the way there werent so many mechanics in T9 and the guides had under 10 minutes.

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

Go do coils using minimum ilvl sync and click off echo. And then note that the world first people completed them at ilvls below even that. If that's not a challenge for some people, they probably need to switch genres (but only some really niche games will be harder than that).

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Is there a video of that fight? (where they beat it in less than min ilvl req) I really want to see it! I've had too many blms using freeze as an aoe skill today need to see some skilled players :D