In the many MMOs Ive played over the years FFXIV is the first to lock in a certain character class to a specific role. Every class is a cookie cutter copy of the next guy's. For example, I love the whole Paladin theme , concept, general defensive Sword/Shield combat style. But I do not like tanking. In my previous MMO, DDO I played a Paladin and in DDO there are many ways to build characters. A Paladin can be anything from a DPS to a Tank (Or as we call them Intimitanks) to a DPS to a backup healer. It worked out, well and personally i liked it. I am the kind of player that likes to DPS, but I do so in a defensive manner. By reducing the damage dealt to me with Armor and a Sheild but maximizing my DPS potential with a sword in hand and very high strenght stats. Sadly, in FFXIV I am obligated everytime I party as a Paladin to be a tank. I just think that classes should have multiple build types to make a guy who just wants to DPS with a sword can do so if he chooses.
Class Role-locking
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10-05-2013, 01:24 PMEx-SOLDIERClass Role-locking
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10-05-2013, 01:34 PMrabbitzero
I believe when you make your own party, you can play it how ever you want, but in the DF, you are set to not gimp the party.
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10-05-2013, 07:39 PMEx-SOLDIER
Oh rly, I wasn't aware of that. I thought it was required to have 2 DPS, 1 Tank and 1 Healer. :D this gives me renewed hope
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10-06-2013, 08:03 PMEnkidoh
The thing is, throughout the FF series, PLD has always been about high defense, low attack and defending the rest of the party (Cecil Harvey in FFIV is the archetype for the Job in the series), in other words, a tank.
So hence why it's role locked in FFXIV - it's always been a tank and always will be. The DD opposite to PLD in the FF series is the Dark Knight, or DRK as it was known in FFXI. High damage, low defense (and even some mastery of black magic). Both Paladin and Dark Knight traditionally wield swords so they're effectively two sides of the same coin.
Unfortunately, Dark Knight isn't in the game yet so basically you're out of luck if you want to play a DD swordsman role. You could always try DDing in a party, but your other party members will expect you to tank as that's what you're there for. -
10-07-2013, 03:16 AMFyrebrand
The "holy trinity" of Tank, Healer, and DPS is a very restrictive and rigid model that is unforgiving to those who wish to deviate from it. It may have been a necessary evil in the early days of MMOs, but in my opinion it has become stifling, and is more of a burden than it's worth. Most current MMO developers still rely on it like a crutch, for lack of imagination -- but it can directly contradict the introduction of new battle mechanics and creative reworkings of what traditional "classes" mean.
For example, cross-class skills in FFXIV have tremendous potential and are tons of fun to experiment with in the early game. Arcanist's "Physick" is a healing spell that is exactly as potent as the Conjurer's "Cure," and when you cross-train Protect and Raise as well, there's little reason they can't be a main healer. Once Topaz Carbuncle becomes available, they can tank as well. It's a lot like the skill systems people enjoyed in such games as FFV and FF Tactics, where you can borrow heavily from multiple classes you've trained in, and experiment to create your own effective class combinations.
But because such possibilities clash with the role-based structure that Duty Finder depends on, these features get phased out quickly. Once Jobs become available, you can pretty much kiss cross-class skills goodbye entirely, for all intents and purposes. I consider it an awkward and "un-FF" direction to take the Job system.
As a Summoner, I have like 6 skills I can use from other classes. Half of them are from Thaumaturge, which I need to level to become a SMN in the first place. The other 3 are (quite arbitrarily) from Archer, and one of them is an ability that increases dexterity and physical accuracy for some reason. It's absurd. Why not let me take something I want, rather than make up some rule that "Summoners get Archer skills, and that's that"?
For the sake of argument, Cecil deals insane damage as a paladin in FFIV, and the usefulness of his Cover ability is limited at best (I don't think I ever used it). I believe paladins in Final Fantasy Tactics Advance are quite strong attackers as well. Besides that, most main-series FFs don't even have true "paladins," and most single-player JRPGs have no concept of "aggro" whatsoever, and thus no concept of actively "tanking."Quote:
Originally Posted by Enkidoh
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10-07-2013, 10:02 AMSamurninsai
You know, this game would be 100% better, if they had used Final Fantasy: Tactics character system. Get items, master abilities, use abilities on any class. They have spirit binding, which is the same concept without the ability. Bummer HUH!
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10-07-2013, 10:10 AMSamurninsai
Quote Originally Posted by Enkidoh View Post
The thing is, throughout the FF series, PLD has always been about high defense, low attack and defending the rest of the party (Cecil Harvey in FFIV is the archetype for the Job in the series), in other words, a tank.
For the sake of argument, Cecil deals insane damage as a paladin in FFIV, and the usefulness of his Cover ability is limited at best (I don't think I ever used it). I believe paladins in Final Fantasy Tactics Advance are quite strong attackers as well. Besides that, most main-series FFs don't even have true "paladins," and most single-player JRPGs have no concept of "aggro" whatsoever, and thus no concept of actively "tanking."[/QUOTE]
Cecil starts as a Dragoon, then becomes a Paladin. I remember this well, but I thought he was more a caster. Not so much a tank, as a NUKE caster. He was tanky, still DD in the end. -
10-12-2013, 04:34 AMEx-SOLDIER
I think one of the paramounts of the FF Series are greatswords as well. FF7's cloud did it best. And though he could endure a stupid amount of damage he was a heavy damage dealer. Something like what cloud , squall or heck Auron would be a nice DPS swordsman role.
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10-13-2013, 03:33 AMFyrebrandhttp://cdn.memegenerator.net/instanc...x/36049371.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by Samurninsai
Cecil was never a dragoon. The fact that you say "I remember this well" makes it even more absurd.
He was also not a "nuke caster," whatever that means, as he had no offensive magic. I don't even understand what you're saying...