BLU for Duty Finder and Raids! Show your support!

i just find it somewhat uninspiring of them just reusing skills enemies already have
i understand the point of Blue is to farm monster skills

but it would have been a good opportunity to reference other monster attacks that are not in this game for blue like Goblin punch so people who did play use Blue in FF5,11 etc etc can be like "i get this reference"

BLU for duty finders and raids.
Anything else is unacceptable in an MMO
We asked for a BLU job, not a BLU feature.

Anything less than level 80 cap in 5.0 is ridiculous no matter how fun the BLU content is

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Originally Posted by Zafran

Anything less than level 80 cap in 5.0 is ridiculous no matter how fun the BLU content is

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The sad truth of the matter is that this is unlikely the happen even if SE were to change their stance on Blue Mage.

Let's be honest. When you consider how side content such as this is usually released, SE probably doesn't have level 60 content for Blue Mage scheduled for release until 5.1 at the earliest. There's no way that Blue Mage will be ready to participate in level 80 content alongside every other job by the time 5.0 launches.

In addition to the content that must be created, a balance overhaul will also be required since the job wasn't created with balance in mind. And when you consider how long it takes for SE to properly address issues like Lilies for White Mage, realistically speaking, we probably won't see the Limited titled removed from Blue Mage until 6.0 since SE likes to pair up significant overhauls with the release of an expansion. And that's if SE changes their stance.

For those hoping to see Blue Mage become a full-fledged job, be prepared to keep this going for a long time.

It's dangerous to go alone, here taaaaake this Ala Mhigan Earrings~

https://serving.photos.photobox.com/...52f8a17f3a.jpg

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Originally Posted by xbahax92

This is sadly not the case. During liveletter you were able to see that you can pick 20 of 49 skills.
Meaning, even with level cap increase and skill increase to lets guess 100 different blue mage skills, you would still be capped. That term hence is not right.

Ps: i still dont get people going this far and cancel their sub, show off in the OF, to 'influence' the dev team. Its kinda a childish act but whatever, 5.0 story looks amazing!

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Childish? Choosing not to do business with a company due to displeasure is one of the very few powers a customer has. There's nothing childish about that. That's literally capitalism.

Pictured: Typical gamer boycott

https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media...eujcgewjpg.jpg

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Originally Posted by xbahax92

Ps: i still dont get people going this far and cancel their sub, show off in the OF, to 'influence' the dev team. Its kinda a childish act but whatever, 5.0 story looks amazing!

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Well, taking your business elsewhere if you are displeased with the direction the game is going in is not something I would consider to really be childish. The childish way would be to complain on the forums without acting on your complains.

I kind of doubt any change will happen to blue mage, but if there's enough negative feedback they might not do another Limited Job again... It's not like they haven't dropped ideas in the past, certainly not ones like caster/healer shields.


Edit: Also, if anyone can read them moonrunes, what's the Japanese side of the community saying about Blue Mage, since Square probably listens to them more than the English side...

From what I've seen from someone translating some comments on reddit, the reaction is pretty similar. Split almost down the middle between excitement for new content and disappointment at BLU being relegated to side activities. (Apparently, quite a few call it a minigame on the Japanese forums too).

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In addition to the content that must be created, a balance overhaul will also be required since the job wasn't created with balance in mind.

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So basically, now it is ok for a game developer to sell a game and content in which jobs aren't created with balance in mind ?

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Originally Posted by Stanelis

So basically, now it is ok for a game developer to sell a game and content in which jobs aren't created with balance in mind ?

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Final fantasy XI seemed to be ok with that.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

Final fantasy XI seemed to be ok with that.

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Having played FF11, I assure you that it was not ok.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

Final fantasy XI seemed to be ok with that.

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FFXI's battle system was way more complex than FFXIV and was actually balanced, even though it may not have been your definition of "balanced". Also, I fail to see how it is relevant to the discussion at hand.

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Originally Posted by Stanelis

FFXI's battle system was way more complex than FFXIV and was actually balanced, even though it may not have been your definition of "balanced". Also, I fail to see how it is relevant to the discussion at hand.

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What is XI's definition of balance?

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

Final fantasy XI seemed to be ok with that.

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Because emulating FFXI is something this game has a good track record for isn't it

In my opinion, any blue mage has been modified in any Final Fantasy game. (FFVI) Whether Strago's blue magic being learned by "seeing" skills, (FFVII)enemy skill materia learning skills by getting hit, (FFVIII) Quistis Limitbreak learned by items used, (FFIX) eating monsters as Quina gains them through meal or (FFX) Kimahri draining/lancet skills from monsters..

It doesnt matter which skills were learned, it also doesnt matter if those are skills that are namely known as bad breath, white wind, etc (since a lot of new ones have been added through the entire series). FFXIV should do what it did the whole time already, keep FF14'ing their jobs based on their own Final Fantasy (XIV) game.

Its nice that they tried to keep blue magic original and traditional, but to be honest - there is no need for that, not in Final Fantasy 14. Even if skills were scripted by their respective chain quests, blue mage could simply learn his monster skills inside solo instances where you have to kill certain monsters to acquire them (it doesnt matter if rng or not). Wether it uses buffs to be more a supporter while also deal good damage as other casters (I would even say he should deal the lowest dps as he could provide a lot of useful buffs/debuffs). it would still be a functional job.

If they insist that masked carnival has to be done by learning skills and exploiting weaknesses, I would actually vote for having that blue magic book only usable and modifiable inside the masked carnival.

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Originally Posted by Dualgunner

What is XI's definition of balance?

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Jobs that were balanced with group play in mind, as well as the battle system as a whole, not solo play.

But, again, I fail to see how it is relevant to the discussion at hand. Especially when in FFXI you never saw jobs that were designed with the idea that they won't be able to get into content.

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Originally Posted by Stanelis

Jobs that were balanced with group play in mind, as well as the battle system as a whole, not solo play.

But, again, I fail to see how it is relevant to the discussion at hand. Especially when in FFXI you never saw jobs that were designed with the idea that they won't be able to get into content.

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I feel like I'm missing some context, I apologize. I'd say XIV also strives for that same balance, with BLU fixing to be the black sheep.

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Originally Posted by Dualgunner

I feel like I'm missing some context, I apologize. I'd say XIV also strives for that same balance, with BLU fixing to be the black sheep.

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You're not because they are wildly incorrect depending on when they played ff11. FF11 did the exact opposite of what they say it did. Jobs had almost zero balance considerations paid to them in either solo or group contexts. They just did what they did for the entire time I played that game, which was from NA launch to a bit after Promathia and the playerbase just gravitated immediately to the easiest course of action. If you weren't a part of that easy course of action (drg, mnk, smn that didn't want to heal, bst, war, nin's that didn't want to tank, sam's, drk's), then you got to wait literal weeks for pity parties because you probably couldn't solo either. The literal only job that had any capacity to both solo and consistently get groups was red mage.

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Originally Posted by Arkdra

You're not because they are wildly incorrect depending on when they played ff11. FF11 did the exact opposite of what they say it did. Jobs had almost zero balance considerations paid to them in either solo or group contexts. They just did what they did for the entire time I played that game, which was from NA launch to a bit after Promathia and the playerbase just gravitated immediately to the easiest course of action. If you weren't a part of that easy course of action (drg, mnk, smn that didn't want to heal, bst, war, nin's that didn't want to tank, sam's, drk's), then you got to wait literal weeks for pity parties because you probably couldn't solo either. The literal only job that had any capacity to both solo and consistently get groups was red mage.

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Hence why I remarked with some sarcasm that people seemed to be "ok" with XI's lack of balance.

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Originally Posted by Dualgunner

I feel like I'm missing some context, I apologize. I'd say XIV also strives for that same balance, with BLU fixing to be the black sheep.

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FFXIV's jobs are designed with solo play in mind, group play being an afterthought. FFXIV's job are mostly homogenized, where in FFXI two classes had very different purposes and usages. That's 2 different design.

Also, FFXI had issues not with balance but with the design of some jobs (that's 2 different problems). As an example, FFXI DRG lacked purpose (some relevant abilities were missing), but it was balanced, as its damage was on par with other melee jobs. Puppetmaster suffered the same problem (the class didn't have anything specific to bring to the table).

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Hence why I remarked with some sarcasm that people seemed to be "ok" with XI's lack of balance.

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I think nobody said that FFXI design shortcomings (but balance wasn't one of these issue, FFXI's battle system was actually incredibly well balanced at 75, especially considering the complexity of the batttle system, the amount of jobs and possible strategies) were ok though. Also, blu used to actually be a very well designed class in FFXI.

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If you weren't a part of that easy course of action (drg, mnk, smn that didn't want to heal, bst, war, nin's that didn't want to tank, sam's, drk's)

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I assume you're referring to XP parties, but even so your comment reveals your lack of knowledge regarding FFXI. DRG, MNK found Xp parties without any issues (they had to compete with other melees though and be well geared), SAM and DRK were actually very though melee jobs both in XP parties and endgame (they were skillchains initiator, and DRK could do some very high WS), BST could find spot in melee groups but it was generally more efficient to solo for xp (because soloing awarded a lot of XP as BST). NIN weren't competitive DPS before TOAU but were amazing and fun to play tanks, so everybody did play NIN as tank (after TOAU they could very well DPS). SMN was used as a Damage dealer in endgame but did have to XP in parties healing because the mana cost of abilities was very high, so DPSing wasn't very effective in a party, but that was ok (and I was a summoner) because nobody said SMN was meant to be only a DPS.

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Originally Posted by Stanelis

FFXIV's jobs are designed with solo play in mind, group play being an afterthought. FFXIV's job are mostly homogenized, where in FFXI two classes had very different purposes and usages. That's 2 different design.

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Considering that ffxiv jobs are balanced around endgame raiding which is not only primarily but *solely* team based content, I'll have to disagree.

Conversely if they were balanced with solo play in mind, why is only one job able to reach the end of solo deep dungeon? If they were designed for solo play, wouldn't there be more than one able to place in solo content?

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Originally Posted by Dualgunner

Considering that ffxiv jobs are balanced around endgame raiding which is not only primarily but *solely* team based content, I'll have to disagree.

Conversely if they were balanced with solo play in mind, why is only one job able to reach the end of solo deep dungeon? If they were designed for solo play, wouldn't there be more than one able to place in solo content?

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Jobs in FFXIV both tank, DPS and heal themselves to some extent while playing solo. That's something very different from FFXI (in which most jobs couldn't solo). As for the deep dungeons, considering it is a DPS check while requiring you to survive, it is only natural that only a few classes can complete the content solo (namely the one that can DPS the most while healing themselves the most and mitigating the most damage). Furthermore, aren't tanks and healers in FFXIv supposed to DPS in endgame ? That simply wasn't the case in FFXI.

If you take one player in any of FFXIV's job and take a look at what they can do, you d find that you would actually be needing 6 players in FFXI with different jobs (and relevant jobs combination) to do the same thing. That's what I meant by talking about "designed with group play in mind" : you cannot do anything relevant solo and aren't complete outside a group. In FFXIV, even as a tank you can deal a reasonable amount of damage and heal yourself. In FFXIV, while there is group balance, you're only talking about optimization here, but mostly you ll be dealing your damage solo, in a group. That's also why SE's need to implement such a large amount of mechanics to induce difficulty in FFXIV : the bosses would be very boring without (that's what happened in WOTLK, in wow, when blizzard invented this sort of design in 3.0, Naxxramas became a joke and everybody cleared the raid in a few weeks).

I'm talking about the design of the battle system here, if you d compare FFXI's class and battle system design and FFXIV's one, you d find them to be very different. If you take two different caster in FFXI, you d find them to be very different at their core, while in FFXIv two caster DPS (like SMN, BLM and RDM) basically only DPS and have a small amount of utility. Where in FFXI the utility the classes had access to made them very different (hence, they had different purposes), and way beyond a simple matter of DPS.

As an example, the main point of SMN in FFXI's endgame was to provide enmity free damage on HNM. Where BLM's main goal was to burn adds quickly with fellow BLM, to provide crowd control and to stun the bosses. In FFXIV, both BLM and SMN goal is to deal damage, regardless of the encounter. If we go back to the poor DRG in FFXI, his issue wasn't that it wasn't balanced (because his DPS was on par with other jobs), it was because it didn't bring anything to the group beside his DPS (even though DRG were used in melee groups in FFXI, but these weren't very common by design in endgame because they required a lot of endgame gear to be functional).

That's also why the blu could easily be balanced in FFXIV : if you were to analyze each skill and spell in FFXIV you d find you can split them into 3 categories : healing, damage, and mitigation. If you take this into account you ll notice there are way less possible effects and way to interact with the mobs that you d think. A damaging weapon skill is a damaging weapon skill, no matter what its skin is : number aside, it is the same effect (damage, and possibly healing or mitigation depending on added effects on said WS).

You're going to need to find new terms to describe what you are trying to describe. In relevant FFXIV content, soloing isn't possible. You can make an argument XIV is very single minded with its endgame--dps is the name of the game, and the group synergizes to deal as much damage as possible.

Communicating burst windows with the party, discussing mitigation and healing strategies and positioning is all for increased damage output, but it's still very group-focused.

Perhaps you could say that they are balanced to accomplish different needed goals for a group compared to XIV which encourages high dps play.

While I won't say I'm, perfectly fine with the way BLU is, I want to stay optimistic. That being said if there was a chance that we could get BLU with a rotation and a GCD for raids it would make the slog of playing through 4.5 a lot better for me.

My hype for Shadowbringer is still there, and I can't wait to play the new jobs that we get (Hopefully 3) but again I can't say I'm not a little disappointed with how BLU's looking so far. So yes I'd rather it be duty ready, that or I'd rather they just cap it at 70 and completely make it so that we can't enter duties besides the carnival or primals etc etc.

I really just want BLU for the story aspect of it, I've dreamed of Thavnarian BLU's for so long.

Bumping up to show my support again for the day. Keep on keeping on.

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Originally Posted by Luxyn

Yes, and only being able to go in with preformed parties is EXTREMELY limiting. It's unacceptable.

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Why? Because you don't have many friends and can't be bothered enough to socialize and interact with other players longer than it takes to say "hello" and "gr"? Sit down, child.

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Originally Posted by Istaro

Why? Because you don't have many friends and can't be bothered enough to socialize and interact with other players longer than it takes to say "hello" and "gr"? Sit down, child.

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Think you're getting a bit too heated friend, i can understand where he's coming from. Preformed parties don't require a large amount of socializing in and of itself, the issue becomes if the content becomes dead (Similar to older Eureka's) grinding skills becomes more of a hassle than it's worth. That being said I don't really think anyone (I know I wouldn't) would get on one of their alt jobs that weren't already low leveled, to help out a BLU, and say a majority of people do end up doing what you say, forming groups to grind content what's the incentive for a high level BLU to help lower level ones to get their skills?

There's always incentive to go and do older hunts for various reasons, the issue is the finality of BLU as a whole in this state, you either spend eons grinding for skills or you get all of your skills and then have nothing to do. Again we don't have the job so we can't possibly know the benefit's that the masked carnival or BLU as a whole. Heck BLU could probably solo a bunch of instances once you have the right skills from the over world, negating pretty much everything I just said about needing others for progression.

Only time will tell, but we should speak openly and understandingly to each other, we all play the game and want to have fun together even if we disagree on the definition of fun. I'm sure the Devs, if they even look at these forums would appreciate clear discussion rather than needless name flinging.

The comparison with XI is unfair as it is a very different game with a different set of gameplay.

But even there, any job can reach max level and play the new content. NO EXCEPTIONS.

Yes. I understand that its too late to do anything for 5.0, but doesnt mean we have to like it and accept it.
I want to play the game like everyone else (as BLU) i want to do the NEW solo stuff there! Not in black shroud not in east la noscea! In the new areas and new stuff! Not in 5.4, not in 5.5 before next expansion, at Shadowbringers release!

I think that at least is an acceptable point of view by everyone. Those who want it to stay like this, and those that want to play in duties.

Not really, no. Blue mage is a lousy job. It's been a hodge podge mix of skills with no rhyme or reason, all but a handful of which are worse than the usual magic you can use and whose practitioners are, with like 1 exception, F tier characters in the series. I am fine with them making this werid thing with it because I have absolutely zero love for the job, so them going in this weird direction with it excites me more than another ranged caster dps, except this time it has no coherent theme because literally nothing ties blue mages together across the series other than learning monster skills.

If it were a bog standard job, then I would be pissed off about blue getting this fancy solo content. Because blue sucks. Where is the cool solo content for <insert pet job here>? And if it were a standard job, then the solo instances immediately become incapable of being anything more compelling than the usual solo instances. Which are fine, but not what I am (foolishly) optimistically hoping they turn out to be.

Gonna bump this before bed because unlike some people I don't actually despise the job.

Gonna have to hop on this train, as I sincerely hope BLU becomes a proper Job and isn't relegated to being meaningless side content.

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Originally Posted by xbahax92

In my opinion, any blue mage has been modified in any Final Fantasy game. (FFVI) Whether Strago's blue magic being learned by "seeing" skills, (FFVII)enemy skill materia learning skills by getting hit, (FFVIII) Quistis Limitbreak learned by items used, (FFIX) eating monsters as Quina gains them through meal or (FFX) Kimahri draining/lancet skills from monsters..

It doesnt matter which skills were learned, it also doesnt matter if those are skills that are namely known as bad breath, white wind, etc (since a lot of new ones have been added through the entire series). FFXIV should do what it did the whole time already, keep FF14'ing their jobs based on their own Final Fantasy (XIV) game.

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Except in those examples (VII and VIII especially, because IX and X work the same as V mechanically with the character identity being what changed) they still involve what BLU is all about, which is collecting skills. Blue magic in VII is learned by collecting the skills which can be used by the materia, VIII is about collecting items from monsters which will teach the blue magic, IX is about collecting enemy skills directly with eat, as is X with lancet. The key word there is collection, and that is what makes a BLU a BLU.

In this case, BLU has been 14'd. BLU isn't normally a "solo" job, and BLU has been adjusted to XIVs battle system in a way that best fits the collecting play style. BLUs identity is not combat related, and that's what separates it from other adjusted jobs like DRK, BRD, and RDM, where elements of their combat style can be adapted into an XIV playstyle. BLU literally cannot do that, because its gimmick isn't directly combat related, rather it is "quest" based, so it has been adapted into the "quest" system, rather than the combat system.

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Originally Posted by Arkdra

You're not because they are wildly incorrect depending on when they played ff11. FF11 did the exact opposite of what they say it did. Jobs had almost zero balance considerations paid to them in either solo or group contexts. They just did what they did for the entire time I played that game, which was from NA launch to a bit after Promathia and the playerbase just gravitated immediately to the easiest course of action. If you weren't a part of that easy course of action (drg, mnk, smn that didn't want to heal, bst, war, nin's that didn't want to tank, sam's, drk's), then you got to wait literal weeks for pity parties because you probably couldn't solo either. The literal only job that had any capacity to both solo and consistently get groups was red mage.

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There were party job favorites depending on xp camps. Warriors and Thieves with squishy monsters, sams and black mages with high defense enemies, rdm always had a party slot due to their haste and refresh. If you waited for a party and did not form your own you could LFP quite a long time depending on the day and job you played.

Even though incredibly tough enemies gave more experience a kill, parties trended towards fighting tough-very tough enemies killing faster and making 200 multiplier experience chains.

Every job had an opportunity to party or solo to some extent, at least when I played.
Black Mage could solo incredibly tough enemies and even notorious monsters that required a full normal party.

• BLM/PUP/SCH/SMN/RDM/BLU- Camps with enemies weak to magic.
• MNK- Camps with enemies weak to blunt.
• WAR/DRK- Camps with enemies weak to slashing.
• DRG- Camps with enemies weak to piercing.
• BLU- Camps with enemies weak to blunt/piercing/slashing.
• TANKS- Joined standard parties or burn parties, ninja being best solo tank.

White Mage and Bard I would say pretty suck solo, but usually easy to get standard parties, WHM for having best heals and Bard for their party resource utility. Blue and Beast were not party favorites, but you could solo like a champ, grab a partner or two and lay waste to an entire zone.

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

Except in those examples (VII and VIII especially, because IX and X work the same as V mechanically with the character identity being what changed) they still involve what BLU is all about, which is collecting skills. Blue magic in VII is learned by collecting the skills which can be used by the materia, VIII is about collecting items from monsters which will teach the blue magic, IX is about collecting enemy skills directly with eat, as is X with lancet. The key word there is collection, and that is what makes a BLU a BLU.

In this case, BLU has been 14'd. BLU isn't normally a "solo" job, and BLU has been adjusted to XIVs battle system in a way that best fits the collecting play style. BLUs identity is not combat related, and that's what separates it from other adjusted jobs like DRK, BRD, and RDM, where elements of their combat style can be adapted into an XIV playstyle. BLU literally cannot do that, because its gimmick isn't directly combat related, rather it is "quest" based, so it has been adapted into the "quest" system, rather than the combat system.

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Completely disagree that this announced blu has been "14'd". It's FFV blu dropped into 14 and then didn't want to make concessions to make it actually work within the full game so they slapped it with limits. People on my side would prefer that the devs actually got creative with the job and make their version. They used someone else's version and that's cool but we want the "XIV" version as well.

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Originally Posted by jon041065

Completely disagree that this announced blu has been "14'd". It's FFV blu dropped into 14 and then didn't want to make concessions to make it actually work within the full game so they slapped it with limits. People on my side would prefer that the devs actually got creative with the job and make their version. They used someone else's version and that's cool but we want the "XIV" version as well.

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I would argue that this is the most creative they have ever been with the job. They developed the collectable aspect of BLU, which is its most recognisable trait into a piece of content that XIV has never seen before

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

I would argue that this is the most creative they have ever been with the job. They developed the collectable aspect of BLU, which is its most recognisable trait into a piece of content that XIV has never seen before

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You forgot the other half to what makes blu actually blue mage. Being able to use enemy spells AND collecting them.

No one is really arguing against this mechanic. My side is saying it shouldn't be a "limited job" and we don't accept the given reasons for putting these restrictions on it.

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Originally Posted by jon041065

It's FFV blu dropped into 14 and then didn't want to make concessions to make it actually work within the full game so they slapped it with limits.

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Originally Posted by jon041065

They used someone else's version and THAT'S COOL but we want the "XIV" version as well.

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I would like a "XIV version" but did I say I would not accept this version if the restrictions were removed? I didn't because I would be happy I could main my favorite FF job in the FULL game.

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Originally Posted by jon041065

You forgot the other half to what makes blu actually blue mage. Being able to use enemy spells AND collecting them.

No one is really arguing against this mechanic. My side is saying it shouldn't be a "limited job" and we don't accept the given reasons for putting these restrictions on it.

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I agree that the job is too restricted, and I would love to see its current iteration have some sort of option to do raids in a premade party. I feel like its something that the devs are really paranoid about, and will be laxed over time. I don't think we will ever get BLU in matchmaking (which is completely fair), but I feel like content like PotD will be designed with an option for BLU in the future, and I really hope that they allow statics to experiment with BLUs in raid as well.

My stance however is that I would rather see BLU like this than a watered down BLM clone.

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Originally Posted by Lambdafish

I agree that the job is too restricted, and I would love to see its current iteration have some sort of option to do raids in a premade party. I feel like its something that the devs are really paranoid about, and will be laxed over time. I don't think we will ever get BLU in matchmaking (which is completely fair), but I feel like content like PotD will be designed with an option for BLU in the future, and I really hope that they allow statics to experiment with BLUs in raid as well.

My stance however is that I would rather see BLU like this than a watered down BLM clone.

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There are options to restrict access to matchmaking that would eliminate the issue they gave during the live letter. Yeah, be more restrictions but definitely a lot better than "NO MATCHMAKING FOR YOU!".

The spells are going to be reskinned rdm and blm spells already. There will be unique mechanics in the Carnival to give those spells other qualities but that's the only piece of content that will have that exception. Blu wouldn't have to be a watered down BLM clone. Just have different functions to the blue magic.

This is my idea for how it could be different that I've posted elsewhere.

Another way would be that they could do something similar from another game called Legend of Legaia 2. My idea would be that blu would have fire, wind, earth, and thunder aligned blue spells make up their core rotation. Yes, same as rdm but these could be "physical blue spells". They could function something closer to mudras in that you perform combos with them. Could work like a much expanded mudra system or have the job gauge track like the last 3 elements you have used. There could be 10+ combinations based on which elements and in which order they were used. Fire/earth/fire and earth/fire/earth could give you different results. Could go crazy and have 36 combinations if you made it that each element had its own cooldown so you wouldn't repeat the same element in a row. Have ocgds be things like bad breath and mighty guard and white wind as your group utility cooldowns.

As for how to make something like bad breath work I have an idea of my own then seen another that I really liked. Mine would be that bad breath applies the fire, water, poison, earth, miasma, and bleed DoTs that are already in the game. That would still give a pretty good feeling to the "bad breath applied a lot of status ailments" fantasy in my eyes. Someone else had the idea of bad breath being a DoT and applies the damage taken increase from trick attack. That would not only start to give some wiggle room in the meta and I think gives enough of the feeling of "using bad breath made my enemy weaker".

Good morning, fellow BLU lovers. Putting in my regular support for the day since I'll be gone for the night.