How to Dragoon per Second: A DPS Paradigm

More expensive? What? No, he means an NPC vendor. Just look around in the market at Ishgard.

Mega-potion of Strength is also an lv 45 alchemist leve turn-in, by the way. Because the shark oil being in short supply wasn't enough of a problem, apparently :P

With NQ mega-potions, it works out to 14250 gil / 117261 XP (before you hit 50 and leve XP gets capped). NQ PPPs will be equally cost-to-XP effective at ≤8397 gil per 3, or ≤16795 per 3 HQ PPPs.

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Originally Posted by JackFross

That was 30% critrate, though. I won't be seeing that again...

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Pls stop hacking the game and/or gib me that crit rate holy crap ;-;

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Originally Posted by siverstorm

Pls stop hacking the game and/or gib me that crit rate holy crap ;-;

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I wish I could hack the game and get that crit rate again;;; Parses from tonight where my friend the other drg subbed in for our missing MNK. 8 runs, 19-20% crit across all of them. Spoopy as heck!

http://imgur.com/a/F1aNt

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Originally Posted by JackFross

People are talking about the opening burst. Full-geared Dragoons can pretty regularly crest 2000. I'm max gear for having not cleared A3 yet and my opening burst is generally 1700-1850 without using a potion. That's with 200 weapon+head+chest+legs, a full like 35 strength below where I will be at 210. At maximum gear level you can see stuff like:

Phase 1
Phase 1+2

On a parse that finished over 1300.

Same guy ranks at having dealt 1681 dps strictly ST on Faust in A1S.

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Best I ever got was like 1520ish on Faust and like 1650 at the end of p1; 1400 once p2 ends (average about 1330). I have essentially the same strength as you (1048 I think). I've been obsessing over squeezing out more; but I can't seem to really find a spot (besides forking out for HQ Dracs). I'm not convinced double weaving would make that kind of difference either (but it does annoy me, cuz ping). I'm kind of praying it's gear, cause I want to do 1400 DPS on Pepsiman - without switching to MNK

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Originally Posted by RapBreon

Best I ever got was like 1520ish on Faust and like 1650 at the end of p1; 1400 once p2 ends (average about 1330). I have essentially the same strength as you (1048 I think). I've been obsessing over squeezing out more; but I can't seem to really find a spot (besides forking out for HQ Dracs). I'm not convinced double weaving would make that kind of difference either (but it does annoy me, cuz ping). I'm kind of praying it's gear, cause I want to do 1400 DPS on Pepsiman - without switching to MNK

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Depends on party comp, mostly. Tonight, I was hitting my stride and finding that sweet sweet 1440 spot, but I've come to a very important realization (that I realized before but proved to myself tonight.) Here's my parses from tonight. The important thing to look at is here:

Phase 1 dps - Phase 1+2

Phase 1 dps - Phase 1+2

Those were the only two runs where I did ~1430 through end of hand phase. Every other pull, my dps in Phase 1 was around 1500 or lower. It may not seem like much until you consider this:

If you do 100 more dps in phase 1 of the fight (which is 56 seconds long), you've just done 5600 extra damage. 5600 damage spread over 3:00 (the duration of p1+2) becomes a net boost of 31 dps. Hitting 1600 isn't automatic at our gear level. It happens with a little bit of luck and maybe can be chalked up to those hq x-pot I used in the second run I linked that I didn't use in the first run I linked. And that was 2 runs out of the 8 times we got past hand phase tonight. Every other run was lower.

These times we're looking at are tiny. Lucky crits do a LOT to the numbers. Consistently hitting 1400 at i206 isn't really easy. I mean, if you want an easier way to see - this is a link to snapshots of my raid dps at the end of hand phase every time we made it tonight. I've been stuck here for weeks. I don't think it's possible to be doing much better than I am, and I'm still doing what I did in those videos I've posted. Of note: the other dragoon in those parses has 210 spear.


tl;dr: Gear plays a big part - 210 weapons are +2 WD over 200. RNG plays a much bigger part. Lucky crits in the opener add a LOT to your dps at the end of hand phase. Party comp matters a lot, too. When I was partied with a bard, I averaged 1350. Tonight, I had one run below that in eight thanks to MCH boosts, most likely, and a single run where I flubbed a bunch.

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Originally Posted by JackFross

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I've been on Pepsiman for about 6-7 weeks now (had a 2 week break due static death; Pepsiman claims another). I've probs wiped over 300+ times to him (I've experienced worse to be fair) and most of them are early wipes as this boss punishes lapses in judgment brutally (but also hilariously). I have had this shit on lockdown in the first week as well. Worst part though is my DPS has actually dropped (no MCH) since my gear has reached its peak at 206 due to comp change. I used to push 1400 more often.

I guess the most frustrating part is that when I feel like I fucked up (or had a good parse) it often isn't reflected in the actual numbers because RNG typically has a greater impact on smaller parses. I'm like oh man, I played this attempt flawlessly - 1320; or, I fucked this so badly - 1360, man that annoys me. Especially that I feel like I've hit my peak with no way to improve (which is like 80% of the fun), compounding this matter is I do essentially the same DPS on my MNK with is only ilvl 200. I find MNK way easier to play though.

Also I have a theory, you're actually Dervy in disguise. You both have very similar looking dragons that are Dragoons, you both love large posts (not a jab) and you both love mathematical analyses :P. It's ok though you don't have to answer, your secret is safe with me!

Edit: you average higher than me with the same gear; I must try harder!

I'm not as cool as Dervy or anywhere near as good at manipulating these numbers as he is. I try my best, though. And honestly, you're only looking at a 3 minute parse. If you get a shit opener (which happens) and are sub 1500, your final dps at the end of hand phase is gonna be absolute garbage (compared to how you could have done), regardless how effective your dps was in that phase.

As a nice example, there was this run I did for P1+2. If you look at just P1, you'll see that I ended that phase at merely 1437. I do Phase 1 exactly the same every single run - exactly the same amount of hits and exactly the same skills used. The variance is *massive* - ranging from 1437 to 1600. Neither of those runs had a Potion used. That swing of 170 dps is a HUGE difference in the final parse, regardless how P2 is handled.

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Originally Posted by JackFross

I'm not as cool as Dervy or anywhere near as good at manipulating these numbers as he is. I try my best, though. And honestly, you're only looking at a 3 minute parse. If you get a shit opener (which happens) and are sub 1500, your final dps at the end of hand phase is gonna be absolute garbage (compared to how you could have done), regardless how effective your dps was in that phase.

As a nice example, there was this run I did for P1+2. If you look at just P1, you'll see that I ended that phase at merely 1437. I do Phase 1 exactly the same every single run - exactly the same amount of hits and exactly the same skills used. The variance is *massive* - ranging from 1437 to 1600. Neither of those runs had a Potion used. That swing of 170 dps is a HUGE difference in the final parse, regardless how P2 is handled.

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I really think you hit the nail on the head with this. Dragoon's being so bursty means an unlucky opener makes for sad Dragoons due to the 3 minutes. Possibly why I may be overvaluing MNK, which seems to be much more stable and opener independent.

Hopefully Jigglybutt will die soon - we've made it a full way through a p4 rotation. Then I can go to FFlogs and cry about how bad I am.

The important thing to notice about dragoon compared to Monk is Blood for Blood. On Monk, that's a 10% damage boost. For Dragoon, it's 30%.

What this means is that every time we get a crit under B4B, that crit is an extra 30% stronger than if we got that same crit out of B4B, compared to the Monk's crit swing being just 10% different in and out. If you get super lucky and crit every hit under B4B (read: why we stack Battle Litany and Internal Release for our opener under B4B) it's a HUGE gain compared to getting that same luck just after B4B falls off. Since I'm curious, I'm actually gonna run the numbers to compare the difference between getting a crit on EVERY HIT under your initial B4B to getting a crit on the entire 24s rotation that follows, not including OGCDs or dot ticks.

http://puu.sh/kVx68/e341378da6.png

Of course, it's not perfect, but you can see that in a case where RNG haaaates you, you're gonna pull substantially lower than in a situation RNG loves you. I also chose to assume you flubbed and forgot to Life Surge your first Full Thrust for the sake of widening the gap, since this is intended mostly to show the huge disparity you get from crits in B4B compared to crits out of it. And to draw a comparison between how it shakes out with a 30% B4B compared to the 10% MNK has:

http://puu.sh/kVxbn/d8c1cb0f2d.png

That's the main reason DRG's numbers are less consistent (or, better put, more sporadic) in short bursts than a class like MNK that doesn't have nearly as strong burst out the gate. And looking at this, just imagine how Bards look, with their Hawk's Eye / Raging Strikes / Blood for Blood all active on the pull. Imagine how much they cry when RNG decides not to give them crits there...

I guarantee you though, if my monk only gets 2 crits out of his IR I'm gonna hear about it.

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Originally Posted by SunnyHirose

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When my opening Forbidden doesn't crit, I cry.

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Originally Posted by JackFross

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This is kind of the way most burst orientated classes have worked in experience throughout MMOs. It's just so noticeable because of how quick Jigglybutt likes to put a bad attempt out of its misery.

On a different note; is B4B on a MNK technically worth more than 10% (~15%ish) due to those kinds of buffs being multiplicative? Also, I presume B4B on DRG is actually worth 34.5% because of heavy thrust? Or am I wrongskis? This is independent of any conversational line, I'm just curious.

I don't think it's particularly helpful to think of them in those terms. We usually keep our important buffs up most of the time if we're any good at our jobs, so we experience the buff's effects relative to what buffs we'll have before and after. We are encouraged to eyeball mob HP bars and percentages rather than do mental arithmetic; after all, the official UI does not show mob HP values. I think this is the more helpful way for DPS to understand their pacing and throughput in this game. i push the buttons and the mans fall down

I actually get a poor impression of players who think how much damage they just crit for is interesting or has anything to do with DPS skill. It was predestined by the gear you brought to raid, pal! Damage is only half the equation. For the other half... that's you.

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Originally Posted by SunnyHirose

I don't think it's particularly helpful to think of them in those terms. We usually keep our important buffs up most of the time if we're any good at our jobs, so we experience the buff's effects relative to what buffs we'll have before and after. We are encouraged to eyeball mob HP bars and percentages rather than do mental arithmetic; after all, the official UI does not show mob HP values. I think this is the more helpful way for DPS to understand their pacing and throughput in this game. i push the buttons and the mans fall down

I actually get a poor impression of players who think how much damage they just crit for is interesting or has anything to do with DPS skill. It was predestined by the gear you brought to raid, pal! Damage is only half the equation. For the other half... that's you.

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Hahaha, it's not like I do maths on the fly - intuition guides the way. I mostly curious from a conceptual stand-point as I didn't pay much attention to math is high-school...

Next question; is all the multiplicative buffs the reason MNKs -appear- to scale so well?

I look at my initial Full Thrust crit every run so I can cry about the spread. Without potion, it's like 4900-5100 and with pot it has hit as low as 5000. I'm still not sure if it's a combination of Hypercharge falling off early sometimes and RNG or just RNG being the worst. Aside from that, I just enjoy my crit FT during Liberation cast on Ravana~ Up to 7.1k now! :D

I know no one cares, I just like to see big numbers.

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Originally Posted by RapBreon

Next question; is all the multiplicative buffs the reason MNKs -appear- to scale so well?

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I don't understand what it means for monks to scale. Are you sharding them across a massive number of raids? :P

Monks do get more damage out of lower potencies due to their multipliers, though, yes.

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Originally Posted by SunnyHirose

I actually get a poor impression of players who think how much damage they just crit for is interesting

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Idk about you man, but I love when I see big crits, I thrive on it actually. I for sure find it interesting, so if they puts off a poor impression to you, I'm not really sure what you are looking for in a dps. I don't think I would wanna raid with someone who doesn't get excited over big crits, sounds dull and boring and like they don't give a shit about the damage they are doing. Also any good player knows a big crit has nothing to do with dps skill and if they do well, they are not good lol, but crits should put gas on the fire for those good players aswell imo. Make them wanna dps even harder.

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Originally Posted by SunnyHirose

I don't understand what it means for monks to scale. Are you sharding them across a massive number of raids? :P

Monks do get more damage out of lower potencies due to their multipliers, though, yes.

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What I kind of meant was: Is one point of STR worth more to a MNK (for the above reason) than it is for a DRG. They may not scale better (to which being corrected on that point is also useful); it's just an impression I have. But at the same time I suspect the scaling is normalized - to a degree - by their difference in potencies. Or is it perfect?

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Originally Posted by Hakmatic

Idk about you man, but I love when I see big crits, I thrive on it actually. I for sure find it interesting, so if they puts off a poor impression to you, I'm not really sure what you are looking for in a dps. I don't think I would wanna raid with someone who doesn't get excited over big crits, sounds dull and boring and like they don't give a shit about the damage they are doing. Also any good player knows a big crit has nothing to do with dps skill and if they do well, they are not good lol, but crits should put gas on the fire for those good players aswell imo. Make them wanna dps even harder.

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Yeah but on the other hand you get people who won't shut up about it. I like big crits as well (because I can see tangibly how gear is affecting my damage in the best case scenario), but assholes that want to tell me about their Stone 3 crits all day are the worst. I'm happy your Wildfire crit for 8k but seriously this is the third time in as many minutes - I'm going to have R.K.O you if you don't shut up.

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Originally Posted by RapBreon

Yeah but on the other hand you get people who won't shut up about it. I like big crits as well (because I can see tangibly how gear is affecting my damage in the best case scenario), but assholes that want to tell me about their Stone 3 crits all day are the worst. I'm happy your Wildfire crit for 8k but seriously this is the third time in as many minutes - I'm going to have R.K.O you if you don't shut up.

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Firstly, I hit a 16.5k Fire IV on Tuesday. Secondly, RANDY ORTON OUT OF NOWHERE!!!

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Originally Posted by Hakmatic

Idk about you man, but I love when I see big crits, I thrive on it actually. I for sure find it interesting, so if they puts off a poor impression to you, I'm not really sure what you are looking for in a dps.

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I think it's funny that you phrase it that way, because you're not specifically saying it's the number itself that's interesting to you or an indicator of your skill. Big difference. People can buy runs till they have your gear, but they can't beat your FFLogs rank without being pretty good themselves.

Basically, there is no choice involved in it, so to me, it's just watching a computer program run, and specifically it's watching the RNG run. Slot machines don't excite me, either, for the same reason. What I value in a DPS player is a number of things like intellect, decision-making, risk-weighing, raid awareness, reaction speed, reliability. Not robotics. The simple mechanical portion of your role and gearing properly should be considered a bare minimum to serious raiding, ya? Whereas not just anyone can judge the right times to "stand in the fire", etc. Strategy game designer Sid Meier has often contended that a decent game is "a series of interesting choices". I'm inclined to agree. If there is no meaningful choice involved whatsoever, there is no problem to solve, so from a gameplay perspective it involves no skill and is therefore not interesting. To what extent interest can be generated by spectacle or for the celebration of fortune (or bemoaning of misfortune), I'd say the novelty of an extrinsic reward wears off pretty quickly and that's what a crit is, same as a flashing light saying "winner" while coins fall out. Besides, I used to play a crit sin in RO, so in this game... not so many crits (melee is love, melee is life).

To say that it "sounds dull and boring and like they don't give a shit about the damage they are doing", well, I consider watching the numbers to be dull and boring, missing the forest for the trees. The sound that crits make and knowing you made a dent in the HP bar is viscerally exciting for sure, and that does it for me. But attention is a limited resource and I try to spend it on actionable things that will make a difference; positioning, how soon to the next phase, oh no a lag spike wat do. To put it another way, when people recount tabletop game sessions, they tell you what the rolls created. Just listing the rolls devoid of a narrative makes people want to leave the room.

tl;dr It's not the size of the Lalafell in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the Lalafell.

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Originally Posted by RapBreon

What I kind of meant was: Is one point of STR worth more to a MNK (for the above reason) than it is for a DRG. They may not scale better (to which being corrected on that point is also useful); it's just an impression I have. But at the same time I suspect the scaling is normalized - to a degree - by their difference in potencies. Or is it perfect?

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At i210, MNK gets very very slightly more DPS out of 1 STR than DRG does, yes. MNKs also have less STR.

As far as the whole crit thing goes, I agree with Hak, honestly. Whenever my white mage freaks out and talks about a BIG CRIT stone III, I laugh a bit. It makes things more fun, for me, to hear people excited about things like that, and honestly, those big crits are the only side of the numbers you can see in the fight (without having a parse overlay running) that have any sort of real, immediate meaning.

That said, a LOT of less-good players have a huge disconnect between being good and making big numbers happen. It comes down to something I said before (maybe in this thread?) about how ANYONE can do the opener, but very few can maintain the sustained DPS required of those upper echelon DPS. I ran with a Bard once who was saying how he thinks he's pretty good because he sees such and such from Empyreal Arrow on his opener and such and such with Sidewinder as if that means he was great. And then he ended up being one part of a group who couldn't kill Faust on a day my parser stopped working.

So yeah. People who use their high single hits to say they're good piss me off, but I wouldn't go off and qualify anyone who loves to see big numbers as being fundamentally flawed in their thought process. When you've done content enough times, you get to stop paying attention and auto-pilot. When running on auto-pilot, you can take your time to stop and enjoy the string of crits you shit out in your opener.

I dunno. This is likely incoherent since I'm really tired, but that's my general thoughts on the matter. DPS is certainly about all those things you mentioned, but I feel any good DPS needs to have that lust for big numbers that makes them SUPER GIDDY when they see a record-breaking hit that they've never done before.

I dunno. If I could have my damage numbers halved, triple the frequency of attacks, and no TP problems along the way, I'd take it in a heartbeat even though I would no longer have big numbers. :P The only number I care about is the overall rate my attacks burn the boss at over an extended period of time.

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Originally Posted by SunnyHirose

I think it's funny that you phrase it that way, because you're not specifically saying it's the number itself

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I agree with you with what you look for in a dps, I just think someone leaving a bad impression on you because they like crits was a poor choice of words. Just because they do that doesn't mean they don't have all the other attriubutes you are looking for.

I like seeing crits because it motivates me to go extra try-hard that run, increase my focus, if I get a few crits in my opener, or just a few in general in a row. I know my score's gonna be higher, due to Lady Luck of course but still, so I try to do what I can as a player to do better. That's a BLM perspective though, where you can literally crit for 12k in the opener and multiple crits will make a realistic difference on your end parse.

Speaking from a farm perspective, of course.

Also speaking of fflogs I need to play Dragoon this week , I've fallen too far lol.

got it hoho

Quick probe for other DRGs regarding certain things~

I ran calculations and found that the rotation without Phlebotomize is a loss of ~3-4 pps (using H-IDC4-TTT4-H-TTT4-IDC4-H-TTT4-TTT4) due to +1 gsk per minute-ish and such, but it significantly slows your TP consumption from 7.5 TP per second to ~6.3 TP per second (including +60/3s natural regen). It extends the 500 TP gain from Invigorate to last ~78s instead of ~66s of sustained dps, which can make all the difference in a fight in which you're gonna use 5 or 6 Invigorates and really need to make your TP last.

This becomes a (rather) moot point if you're packing a pocket Ninja to throw you a Goad here and there (assuming your MT doesn't need it), I guess, or your Bard/Machinist feed you Paeon/Muscle Activator or whatever, but just out of curiosity - does anyone drop Phlebotomize from their rotation during extended DPS moments (like final phase A3S) for TP conservation? Is it worth doing, or should I just call for TP from my Machinist in cases where I need a band-aid to get to my next Invigorate cast?

Ignoring the fact that my Machinist is relatively below-average and I've been more-or-less above average, I'm just wondering if anyone thinks it'd be worthwhile to make that swap if my TP falls below 400 with over 1m on my Invigorate.

I mean - these numbers I looked at imply that 400 TP lasts for 62s without Phlebotomize and 53s with it, and that's when I'd exactly hit 0, not counting the fact that the moment my TP dips below 70, I'll see delays (which would be closer to 51s / 44s).

And I mean that's 3-4 pps loss when the base rotation alone is over 150, not including jumps, geirskogul, etc.


My group has been consistently hitting final phase (finally, thanks to schedules settling down and connection issues clearing up) and we've been making progress again. I've been seeing TP issues (partially because I keep forgetting to basically open the phase with Invig) and have been trying to figure ways to ease up. I remember back in T8 progression, I just ran H-IDC-TTT-H-TTT-TTT in T8 to conserve TP, and was still doing damage that good monks in my FC were just barely beating, so I figured I could maybe do something similar here, and potentially A4, too.

Good to see you're making progress Jack. I haven't stepped in a3s in a month ; ; I don't know about that far into the fight specifically but there have been times in previous raids where I dropped Phleb due to TP strain towards the end of the fight. None of those were quite as demanding on dps, though.

@JackFross: I just tried it, it's dropping Disembowel pretty frequently. Did your calculations include that factor?

In optimal situations, with the SS that I have, Disembowel only has a like 1.5s window where it falls between Disembowel and Chaos Thrust, with every cast of Disembowel having Disembowel applied. Tested it in-game to confirm. Even with Disembowel down for the Disembowel cast itself, it only adds +1 additional pps loss, as per my calculations. There's a similar window of ~1.5s between CT dropping and re-applying which is a little shitty, as well, but the shorter rotation was a massive hit comparatively, so it made more sense to extend it.

And yeah, we're progressing, but I'm still feeling pretty heavily like I'm carrying the other dps in my group. I've been averaging 1370-1410 without potions in p1+2 with drg/mnk/mch/smn dps, and I'm the only dps regularly over 1300, despite us all having equivalent gear. It's getting really frustrating, truth be told.

I think it might be possible with high skill speed sets only. Let me run some calculations, I'll get back to you. But the Disembowel dropping for a second can imply another DPS loss, since it means the BRD has, say, a 60% chance of losing out on the 10% increase every 30 seconds. Since Disembowel currently contributes about 90 dps to top tier BRDs, it would mean that if instead of 100% uptime we have 95% uptime then it's maybe 85 dps instead. 5 dps isn't a lot, but it's another small factor to consider.

Turns out skill speed doesn't change the impact of removing Phlebotomize one way or another significantly.

Best 3 minute sequence I can come up with for no Phlebotomize is 1529 dps versus using Phlebotomize at 1549 dps. Subtract 5 from the Disembowel effect for BRD, and you're looking at losing 25 raid DPS in exchange for extra TP, I guess. But, TP is not really a problem in the current raid tier. There's so many breaks that if you use Invigorate at correct timings, you'll probably never run out of TP, even without a NIN.

I suppose if you're TP starved for a significant amount of time then it's worth it, but by my estimation you'd probably have to be TP starved for at least 20 full seconds during the fight. I would say you just need better TP management then.

This is, however, significantly better for AS2, due to the extra Geirskogul/min hitting multiple targets. If each Geirskogul hits just 2 targets, it's superior DPS on top of saving TP.

Keep in mind that the reduction of 25 dps would make dps checks ever slightly harder.

In conclusion, any raid that you can consistently hit 2 or more targets with Geirskogul would benefit from dropping Phlebotomize. Otherwise, TP management is probably the answer.

That confirms something else I was gonna ask about. I had stopped using Phlebotomize during double hands in p2, since I was getting a full less gsk on double hands - 3 instead of 4 (iirc; would have to pay attention to exact amounts next time) and noticed my average dps hopping up by ~20. I stopped seeing 1350's (1370 became my lowest outside of massive fuckups) and saw more 1400's.

Toughts on the new DRG weapon from Thordan Extreme ?

According to this:
https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...mining/cwur89c

Halberd of the Heavens - 105 Strength , 110 Vitality , 97 crit, 65 determination (75 Damage, 2.88 Delay).

+ 1 WD, +4 Strength +5 Crit but -64 SKS compared to the 200 ESO one, which Im using atm.

I'm not sure I can even reach the minimum SKS of 590 with this...

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Originally Posted by RexMax

Toughts on the new DRG weapon from Thordan Extreme ?

According to this:
https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...mining/cwur89c

Halberd of the Heavens - 105 Strength , 110 Vitality , 97 crit, 65 determination (75 Damage, 2.88 Delay).

+ 1 WD, +4 Strength +5 Crit +65 Det but -64 SKS compared to the 200 ESO one, which Im using atm.

I'm not sure I can even reach the minimum SKS of 590 with this...

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It's pretty much a strict upgrade. Hitting the minimum is a tiny bit tricky, yeah, looking at what you have to work with. If you pick up the belt from Void Ark, you'll hit 601 sks with Thordan weapon and still see a significant overall gain in damage. That looks like it'd be the quickest fix, requiring the least amount of work.

That said, the 590 isn't absolutely necessary to maintain the rotation, it just gives a lot more wiggle room than lower skill speeds do and give you less downtime on Heavy Thrust and Phlebotomize, which both start dropping at lower sks values.

Here are some random pieces of Mistbreak gear I've obtained if anyone was curious:

Ignoring main stats since they're the same as other 210 gear,
Belt: +37 ACC / +14 DET
Legs: +37 ACC / +34 CRIT / +49 DET / +78 SKL SPD
Earrings: +15 CRIT / +16 DET / +32 SKL SPD
Bracelet: +14 SKL SPD :(

I haven't been raiding Savage since my static fell apart almost a week or two after it came out, so I haven't had any options for upgrades until now.

Now I just need to figure out how to incorporate them or not.

Has our BiS changed since void ark and diadem have been released?

There is no such thing as bis anymore. Its all just luck.

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Originally Posted by Yesui

Has our BiS changed since void ark and diadem have been released?

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Going by some of the other Diadem gear I've seen people post (the not fake ones), the BiS gearset would be full Diadem I imagine since the stat combinations can be outrageous. At least if all the slots can have absurd totals relative to the slots themselves.

Here is the person with the WHM pants that's been posted around:
http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...acter/3112429/
+54, +91, +43, +45. Now part of the argument against it is that they aren't all "useful" stats, but if DRG gear can get anywhere near those numbers in the melee stats then they would be amazing.

The pants I got had 198 total stats, the WHM pants have 233. Savage pants have 157, and upgraded ESO have 160. So it would just be a matter of having the best possible combination of stats across all the slots that make up for whatever difference from Savage and upgraded ESO gear.

(Un)fortunately the Diadem gear is random, so the grind to get a full set of insane stat Mistbreak gear would be tedious.

Interesting topic, as I'm levelling up my DRG right now...
Hey Thendiel, is it ok for me to translate your first four posts into French ? Could be a good idea, as it's a bit hard sometimes, even for me...