So BLM as AOE covered, MNK has single target... What does SMN bring?

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Originally Posted by Akiza

That is true the only thing SE can change without buffing the Summoner is pet potency/attack speed or Enkindle/Fester. But none of these options are desirable because Summoner's will out class every other dps.

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So this is a question actually for me to gain knowledge, I'm not being clever or trying to suggest something I "know" will fix everything. I don't know and I'm pretty sure it probably won't. It also isn't being posed directly to Akiza, her comment is just a good segue.

Would increasing the Cooldown on fester enough that you can't get three Festers in an aetherflow, meaning ideally you'd use that third stack for Energy drain, and Decreasing the cooldown on Enkindle a whole bunch to make up for the loss in DPS be a bad thing? Beyond some people's dislike of issuing the Pet Commands. I suppose also that I like a longish cooldown on Enkindle because it makes it special. ((though five minutes IS too long.))

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Originally Posted by ChazNatlo

So this is a question actually for me to gain knowledge, I'm not being clever or trying to suggest something I "know" will fix everything. I don't know and I'm pretty sure it probably won't. It also isn't being posed directly to Akiza, her comment is just a good segue.

Would increasing the Cooldown on fester enough that you can't get three Festers in an aetherflow, meaning ideally you'd use that third stack for Energy drain, and Decreasing the cooldown on Enkindle a whole bunch to make up for the loss in DPS be a bad thing? Beyond some people's dislike of issuing the Pet Commands. I suppose also that I like a longish cooldown on Enkindle because it makes it special. ((though five minutes IS too long.))

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Hmm. Well if you increase the Fester to 30s cooldowns I would say you would need to drop enkindle down to 120s or even 60s. Yea signature moves are special but the damage output doesn't justify a 5 min wait, more so if not paired with rouse and spur.

So how would a 30s Fester with a 90s Enkindle affect SMN DPS assuming the third Aetherflow stack was used for ED all the time? Would that be enough to slow the MP drain to WHM rates?

All that's needed to make the Summoner on par with other jobs is to reduce the cool down on Enkindle to 60s so we can climb out of our plateau.

I think increasing the cooldown would nerf the DPS (even if we'd save some MP but wouldn't people just wait for the last fester before Aetherflowing even if Aetherflow is ready?). We'd only get ONE fester during Raging Strikes (and even though we'd have more Enkindle to use, Raging Strikes doesn't affect Enkindle). When compared to a BLM they would have all their Fires in a raging strikes, whatever procs they get, and a flare. SMN would just have dots, and one fester and maybe an energy drain if we use second aetherflow on energy drain. So our opening burst would be lower and we would hit the DPS plateau faster. At least that's how I'm understanding it.

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Originally Posted by Ronove

I think increasing the cooldown would nerf the DPS (even if we'd save some MP but wouldn't people just wait for the last fester before Aetherflowing even if Aetherflow is ready?). We'd only get ONE fester during Raging Strikes (and even though we'd have more Enkindle to use, Raging Strikes doesn't affect Enkindle). When compared to a BLM they would have all their Fires in a raging strikes, whatever procs they get, and a flare. SMN would just have dots, and one fester and maybe an energy drain if we use second aetherflow on energy drain. So our opening burst would be lower and we would hit the DPS plateau faster. At least that's how I'm understanding it.

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Well it's all a balancing act really. The goal would be to add energy drain into the rotation without effecting dps. while raging strike doesn't effect pet, spur and rouse does. Honestly it's hard to say how it would effect unless we could actually play with it.

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Originally Posted by Ronove

I think increasing the cooldown would nerf the DPS (even if we'd save some MP but wouldn't people just wait for the last fester before Aetherflowing even if Aetherflow is ready?). We'd only get ONE fester during Raging Strikes (and even though we'd have more Enkindle to use, Raging Strikes doesn't affect Enkindle). When compared to a BLM they would have all their Fires in a raging strikes, whatever procs they get, and a flare. SMN would just have dots, and one fester and maybe an energy drain if we use second aetherflow on energy drain. So our opening burst would be lower and we would hit the DPS plateau faster. At least that's how I'm understanding it.

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Yeah, because DoT's don't do any dps.

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Originally Posted by HaroldSaxon

Yeah, because DoT's don't do any dps.

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Yeah, because they were talking about Fester, Energy Drain, and Enkindle. Their proposed change didn't include changing dots at all.

if Enkindle was gonna get any time nerf it would probably be kicked down to 2m to align with Spur.

If you essentially force someone to use Energy Drain, yeah it might keep us afloat longer but the DPS will undoubtedly be lower. Enkindle is not a very strong attack at all. It needs to have both Rouse and Spur to do just alil over a single Fester in damage.

A simple fix would be to leave fester out of aetherflow stack system, give it maybe a longer cd to balance it ( maybe 15 to 20 ) and then we would have free stacks for ED and Bane, increasing dps and mana sustain without touching SCH.


that being said a few fixes to our pets which are 20 -30% of our damage should be done like : pet accuracy alignment with caster, and pets actually being affected at least by our deter/ crit stats ( thus food) and maybe spell speed ? Would be cool since we have a bunch of it thanks to that great gear choice we have... but i guess it's too much asked lol.