#FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

So basically you just want the tank to do your job for you when you play a healer and do the healers job for them when you play a tank and saying that’s fine because you find it fun.

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Either the game starts to have requirements on how well people play or yes, the healer has to be a tank backup, and tank / some DPS have to be a healer backup.

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Regardless That doesn’t remotely answer my question since this mythical “everything blows up the tanks quit the healers get kicked” you always seem to mention never materialised before the ridiculous self healing we have

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When people know what they have lost they will want it back and optimize for it. If an average daily roulette dungeon takes 30 min instead of 15 because of one bad person then people will try to move to vetted groups or do other shenanigans to once again have 15-minute runs.

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Originally Posted by sharknado

Either the game starts to have requirements on how well people play or yes, the healer has to be a tank backup, and tank / some DPS have to be a healer backup.


When people know what they have lost they will want it back and optimize for it. If an average daily roulette dungeon takes 30 min instead of 15 because of one bad person then people will try to move to vetted groups or do other shenanigans to once again have 15-minute runs.

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The healer isn’t a tank backup though. The healer is just the worst role in every category. If the tank is playing badly enough they actually need the healer by your own logic they should be getting vetted by this mythical filter you seem to think will happen

Which leads into the next point, runs weren’t 30 minutes compared to 15 minutes when the tanks didn’t have ridiculous self healing, you are literally arguing against a situation that has never existed in the game outside of ARR. dungeons in ShB didn’t take 40 minutes with the party regularly wiping to an incompetent healer. What they did have though is actual skill checks for tanks rather than just inbuilt immortality and actual responsibility for the healer rather than being an enforced role burden

PLD (and maybe GNB) was the ‘worst’ to heal thru wall pulls over the course of ShB & there wasn’t any outcries lol.

It kind of makes me wonder if the healing redundancies were done on purpose for both the healers and tanks due to uncertainty on how many avoidable mechanics are actually avoided on average. It also may be due to some situations where either the healer or tank may not be using their kit fully so the other one can cover for it. Not trying to say it is good or bad, but the damage healed definitely has a great variance depending on if people get hit by avoidable mechs or not.

It may be time for Square to consider switching a few mechs to more consistent damage pulses that cannot be avoided to increase the healing needed. So far, the level 93 trial has a perma DoT on the raid when it reaches the half way mark as one example. Another could be to increase boss auto attack damage or speed for some certain moments too. An example of this would be the Festergut boss from Warcraft's ICC raid of Wrath of the Lich King. As the boss inhaled the room gas, the raid wide damage converged to more heavy tank damage with speedy and chunky auto attacks. This should help to increase the need to use more Cure 2, Benefic 2, Adloquium or Eukrasian Diagnosis casts. Whether it can lead to needing a Cure 1, Benefic 1, Physick or Diagnosis spam, not sure. If they are aiming for the latter, I can already tell them the Freecure trait won't be sufficient in its current form. That 30% ish chance would need to be more so 100% under a yellow border trait cooldown if they want to go this route.

I don't heal in this game cause it boring.
Actually this is a semi lie, I play healer in blue mage because its fun. I get a damage system and I also ironically heal way more than any true healer in this game, in dungeons I am needed or the tank will die and this is the same job that deletes trash in dungeons with 2 moves. So yeah there are good healers in this game but the only way to play them is through blue mage which is mainly designed around being solo, lol.

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Originally Posted by Kacho_Nacho

You're right. Self-healing makes healers redundant. So, Square Enix needs to severely curtail it.

It's much more reasonable than removing four jobs from the game.

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Reasonable maybe, I don't think I share your faith in SE though. When I look at the options they can A: Buff all the tanks to WAR level, thereby delighting all the tank players who love WAR, and remove healers entirely thus removing in one go the only group that has consistently complained about their role for years. Or B: They reduce tanks self healing such that healers are actually useful, probably make most healers happy, and spark outrage from the aforementioned tank players.

If I were a developer with SE's apparent track record, I'd happily choose option A.

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Originally Posted by Alice_Rivers

Reasonable maybe, I don't think I share your faith in SE though. When I look at the options they can A: Buff all the tanks to WAR level, thereby delighting all the tank players who love WAR, and remove healers entirely thus removing in one go the only group that has consistently complained about their role for years. Or B: They reduce tanks self healing such that healers are actually useful, probably make most healers happy, and spark outrage from the aforementioned tank players.

If I were a developer with SE's apparent track record, I'd happily choose option A.

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Square Enix: “Sorry best we can do is Option C - do a complete 180 no-scope on random abilities for absolutely no reason then claim we were addressing feedback whilst either changing absolutely nothing or actively making things worse”.

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Originally Posted by sharknado

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

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There is the need to be a walling content, it is not okay for people to not be able to heal (or not be able to tank) a W2W pull at level 100, and if they refuse to improve, they can spend 40 minutes in a dungeon, at this point it's a choice.

Even back in EW you could do every 90 dungeons as GNB with 3 DPS.

SE can't have the cake and eat it, either they cater the whole game experience to laid back players who purposefully refuse to improve (countless examples in the thread of disabled/low playtime/beginner/etc. players who all have found ways to be efficient and are not to be used as an excuse) and they see high/middle end players leaving (I did, I know plenty did too and I regularly see "average" players discussing how bored they are, all anecdotal evidences yes).

Or they prevent lowest end players from some of the content (Expert dailies or fights, Savage and Ultimate), thus enriching the experience of everyone else, while still allowing them 98% of the game (between the amount of DoL & DoE jobs, blue and yellow quests, relics, and countless other things, they still have endless content to do).

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Originally Posted by Sharawiwi

SE can't have the cake and eat it, either they cater the whole game experience to laid back players who purposefully refuse to improve (countless examples in the thread of disabled/low playtime/beginner/etc. players who all have found ways to be efficient and are not to be used as an excuse) and they see high/middle end players leaving (I did, I know plenty did too and I regularly see "average" players discussing how bored they are, all anecdotal evidences

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Unfortunately all prior evidence suggests this is their exact intention and that there’s very little chance of them changing that overall.

Basically they couldn’t give any less of a shit about how the gameplay is for players at ‘endgame’ as long as they’re still able to rope in new ones who don’t know how shit things get. Then by the time they reach lv100 and leave because the game gradually becomes more and more mind-numbing, they’ve already been replaced by 10 new players who have yet to experience “Have fun for about a week then the content difficulty completely falls apart and go back to being bored for 6 months’

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Originally Posted by Connor

Unfortunately all prior evidence suggests this is their exact intention and that there’s very little chance of them changing that overall.

Basically they couldn’t give any less of a shit about how the gameplay is for players at ‘endgame’ as long as they’re still able to rope in new ones who don’t know how shit things get. Then by the time they reach lv100 and leave because the game gradually becomes more and more mind-numbing, they’ve already been replaced by 10 new players who have yet to experience “Have fun for about a week then the content difficulty completely falls apart and go back to being bored for 6 months’

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Well unfortunately for them, new players are finite. Also, if a lot of veteran players speak up and say the game is going in a bad direction, that further stifles growth.

Completely catering to new, fresh players and completely ignoring veterans will not end well for them because endless churn does not keep games alive, you do need a core happy playerbase so the new players see a healthy community.

The current XIV community is far from healthy, it's basically tearing itself apart at this point.