Wow, Wuk Lamat is really single-handedly ruining the DT story...

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Originally Posted by EchoingPulse

I said this once before, and I will say it again.
If I had the option of killing Lamat or peacing out. I'd take it even if it locked me out of 90% of the story content. No takebacks. Only acceptance.

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Where's my Astarion stake option?

I created a forums account just to add my complaints. I've been playing this since Heavensward, but for the first time I've fallen asleep during cutscenes more than once. Even Moenbryda had more character development than this insufferable mary sue. People say Stormblood was bad, but my god Llama Tea makes this expansion unbearable. I'll happily play through Stormblood again if it will get this character off our backs. How does the character writing fall from Emet Selch to this abomination?

Yeah i dont even know wtf is going on in 7.1 i skip the cutscenes now when wuk talks my god wuks english voice is sounding way more manly vs jap version. Dear square if wuk is suppose to be a man just let wuk be a guy.

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Originally Posted by Trentor

I created a forums account just to add my complaints. I've been playing this since Heavensward, but for the first time I've fallen asleep during cutscenes more than once. Even Moenbryda had more character development than this insufferable mary sue. People say Stormblood was bad, but my god Llama Tea makes this expansion unbearable. I'll happily play through Stormblood again if it will get this character off our backs. How does the character writing fall from Emet Selch to this abomination?

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I'd happily play through stormblood just in general. And A realm reborn. I had a lot of fun in them. Not Dawntrail though. When misshapen chair makes his story recap I'll just watch that for alts, and mash skip every dialogue.
I'm not even sure he'll make one for Dawntrail though. the one for the Endwalker patches basically said everything he was worried about for Dawntrail, and every one of his fears happened about ten times as hard.

Moenbryda was a strange and quirky character whose purpose was most unclear....
but her death at the very least achieved something by adding some tragic salt to the story that arguably didn't even need that.

Emet is great in ShB and extremely flanderized in EW, as are actually each and every one of the ancient Etheyrians.
EW played all emotion and no to little logic and honestly it did a decent job of it, even in retrospect. Because emotions do matter.

But when you analyze Emet's character more closely, it stops working entirely if you do not believe the fellow capable of fighting his own tempering, even as he was unable to overcome it.

The point here is probably that there is something to be analyzed and inferred about Emet and the other Amaurotines.
The characters of DT are just... childish, even if the overall arch works on paper. You can basically analyze Galool Ja Ja - or rather you could have, had he not revealed righ about everything about himself, and even that was a chop-job that seemed to have been born in a harsher setting.

Catboy lusting after the lioness - check.
Hardened warrior with inscrutable ambition who wants more war - check. A bit of a suikoden villain, if you ask me, but hey, we've had worse.
An unsuccessful eugenics-derived biological weapon who was mis-educated because he was raised by morons - check.
A murderous AI who could not ignore its prime directive because reasons - check.
A pacifist who, against all odds, did not pick up a weapon, much less grow a spine - check.
A dead milf who runs on prior imperatives and hates her own existence - check.
A supporting character who was kinda hoping for a dramatic plot reveal and instead got no real answers except that she was dropped in a parallel universe and her parents left her for no real reason at all - check. And she doesn't even get to understand how to feel about it.



But ironically if you send out a twenty-something boysterous brazilian axe-swinging girl who wanted to enter politics for all the wrong reasons and lead her through the events of DT instead of, you know, actual instruction in personal growth, it's going to play out exactly as it did play out. And people of the land won't actually care as long as taxes don't rise and bridges get maintained and maybe there's going to be some free metzcal tomorrow.

sweet alphinaud and alisaie, why is this thread still active

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Originally Posted by Lizvette

sweet alphinaud and alisaie, why is this thread still active

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Why is Wuk Lamat still in the game when she ruined it?

Moenbryda's death served more than just attempt at hitting emotional players in the feels. And I say this because if you played after 3.0 was out she barely gets that much screentime for that level of attachment.

Her death still worked because it interrupted the player's sense that everything was going to be smooth sailing against the Ascians and that none of them would ever dare to directly attack us in our HQ. We're in the middle of preparing a plan we HOPE will work to eliminate ONE ascian for good, and then this Nabriales guy shows up and kills the person doing most of the work with us right in our would be safe base of operations. It showed us this antagonist force wasn't just dark edgy looking guys going teehee and letting us do whatever we felt like.

Some XIV fans are always saying the ascians were just generic bads before Shadowbringers, but the ARR patches showed otherwise. They were better written as serious threat than everyone since the emo bird.

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Originally Posted by Zakuyia

Yeah i dont even know wtf is going on in 7.1 i skip the cutscenes now when wuk talks my god wuks english voice is sounding way more manly vs jap version. Dear square if wuk is suppose to be a man just let wuk be a guy.

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The Japanese voice actress did voice a decent amount of tomboyish female character so it does work for Japanese wuk voice wise in my eyes. No clue why they didn’t do this for English and be done with that. Makes you wonder if it was a friendship/diversity hire, because the voice isn’t just working at all for wuk and it’s even worse with scenes were emotions are needed at all. Doesn’t change the character to anything interesting but maybe would made a number of people like here a bit more I assume.

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Originally Posted by Mortex

The Japanese voice actress did voice a decent amount of tomboyish female character so it does work for Japanese wuk voice wise in my eyes. No clue why they didn’t do this for English and be done with that. Makes you wonder if it was a friendship/diversity hire, because the voice isn’t just working at all for wuk and it’s even worse with scenes were emotions are needed at all. Doesn’t change the character to anything interesting but maybe would made a number of people like here a bit more I assume.

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It 100% was just Kate wanting to give the role to a friend. Sena herself even admitted she couldn't scream much because "it makes her sound like a man". She wasn't fit for the role. She still isn't. But Kate wanted it and so it shall be.

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Originally Posted by ReynTime

Sena herself even admitted she couldn't scream much because "it makes her sound like a man".

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Sure Sena, it's totally the screaming.

Emo bird?

I have to ask.

Because Garuda and Suzaku both fit the description, and possibly that Valigarmanda thing too (which was a humongous letdown, if I'm being perfectly honest).
Which one is it?

Also, yes, Scions being very much a kindergarten led by a schoolteacher is a very apt criticism and that point was the one I liked about the last two chapters of ARR (5 and 6).
But apart from Minfillia being a very, very toothless leader and a strategic incompetent (or so she seems in retrospect) the Scions worked.

Minfillia's indecision, however, has let Alphinaud take the scene and screw things up to such an extreme degree we had to to spend two whole expansions restoring a seblance of status quo.

Oh well.
I'm rambling again.

So back to the question, which bird?


UPD: 30 seconds after writing this I have found this to be Meteion. And honestly I made no connection.
And honestly yeah, EW works on emotions alone and little to no logic, and honestly it's a decent approach to wrapping up the whole thing, because an unstable construct is a very, very solid doomsday device.
It's the hatred her maker had for his own kind's callousness that feels underexplored somehow, and undervalued.

But if you look at it not from the PoV of a myth arc but of a story, actually delving into the depths of the final days, actually seeing what led to them, is a logical way to find roots in a world where you sort of kill the only two people who actually have a clue to what's happened prior to your investigation.
It's actually a more entertaining way of revealing the plot than just Hydaelin plot-dumping it, which would've made more sense.

Though now I think of it, I'd have probably used the Echo, which would've been vastly strengthened post-ShB for obvious reasons. Of course, this is retrospective - no idea what I'd actually have done in the writers' stead.

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Originally Posted by Mortex

The Japanese voice actress did voice a decent amount of tomboyish female character so it does work for Japanese wuk voice wise in my eyes. No clue why they didn’t do this for English and be done with that. Makes you wonder if it was a friendship/diversity hire, because the voice isn’t just working at all for wuk and it’s even worse with scenes were emotions are needed at all. Doesn’t change the character to anything interesting but maybe would made a number of people like here a bit more I assume.

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I agree with what your saying. I believe this was all a diversity play just look at ff7 whats going on. It was bound to happen to ff14.

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Originally Posted by lolnotacat

Sure Sena, it's totally the screaming.

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Bruh makes u wonder if they planning to hire megan fox next lol

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Originally Posted by Zakuyia

Bruh makes u wonder if they planning to hire megan fox next lol

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Megan Fox can be Wuk Lamat in the next live commercial.

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Originally Posted by Lizvette

sweet alphinaud and alisaie, why is this thread still active

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why it wouldn't be? people are just talking their mind, their opinions in here.

Yoshi-P has made it clear that he's not caving to the people calling for Wuk Lamat to be removed from the story or for Sena Bryer to be replaced. You guys should give the hate train a rest. It's embarrassing.

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Originally Posted by MediocreIndigo

Yoshi-P has made it clear that he's not caving to the people calling for Wuk Lamat to be removed from the story or for Sena Bryer to be replaced. You guys should give the hate train a rest. It's embarrassing.

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No what's embarrassing, is people like you defending trash.

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Originally Posted by LibitIncarne

jsyk wuk lamat's VA has an account on this forum and hasn't bothered to read this thread

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Why would she? Most people don't engage in a battle of witts against the unarmed.

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Originally Posted by Godzillaxpowerrangers

Megan Fox can be Wuk Lamat in the next live commercial.

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Why you gotta do wuk that dirty XD thats funny if you understand how terrible an actress megan fox is.

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Originally Posted by MediocreIndigo

Yoshi-P has made it clear that he's not caving to the people calling for Wuk Lamat to be removed from the story or for Sena Bryer to be replaced. You guys should give the hate train a rest. It's embarrassing.

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I mean sens bryer voice is terrible, their behavior is crap, and they are overall terrible person....i gots no respect for a twatt like that. Ill keep skipping the story as long as that twat on screen.

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Originally Posted by Zakuyia

I mean sens bryer voice is terrible, their behavior is crap, and they are overall terrible person....i gots no respect for a twatt like that. Ill keep skipping the story as long as that twat on screen.

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Not liking her voice is one thing, but you can't seriously be painting her as a bad person for not being courteous toward the people harassing her.

https://media1.tenor.com/m/QcuSMCNRu...on-balloon.gif

i guess someone wants this topic to be closed

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Originally Posted by Asari5

i guess someone wants this topic to be closed

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I know it won't be closed, I'm just trying to shift the topic to something more intelligent.

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Originally Posted by Zakuyia

I mean sens bryer voice is terrible, their behavior is crap, and they are overall terrible person....i gots no respect for a twatt like that. Ill keep skipping the story as long as that twat on screen.

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The irony of writing this

dawntrail really was just a wow expac in disguise

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Originally Posted by MediocreIndigo

Not liking her voice is one thing, but you can't seriously be painting her as a bad person for not being courteous toward the people harassing her.

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There are always two sides to the coin. The fact is that Sena has incited hatred against other people on X (Twitter) and not just once, but several times, and has even demanded that people lose their jobs because they are not trans. She claimed to have received death threats after a player on X wrote "Your voice is not good and Wuk Lamat is not good either" under one of her posts. Yoshi P. should have fired Sena for these transgressions on X, because in any other job this is exactly what would have happened. Instead, SE is now trying to sweep everything under the carpet, as if nothing had happened.

Oh they know it, they just don't dare because they know perfectly well that x(twitter) is full of sick people who are capable of harassing and doxing them.

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Originally Posted by Aneshda

There are always two sides to the coin. The fact is that Sena has incited hatred against other people on X (Twitter) and not just once, but several times, and has even demanded that people lose their jobs because they are not trans. She claimed to have received death threats after a player on X wrote "Your voice is not good and Wuk Lamat is not good either" under one of her posts. Yoshi P. should have fired Sena for these transgressions on X, because in any other job this is exactly what would have happened. Instead, SE is now trying to sweep everything under the carpet, as if nothing had happened.

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IDK how you haven't recognized this yet, but it's almost 2025 and it hasn't been possible to criticize a trans person or their actions in good faith for a while now. Everything that VA says and does is fully acceptable and above reproach, solely because they are trans. Criticizing them, their speech, or the quality of their work makes you a bigot by default, no matter how warranted said criticism would be if this person were not trans. Do better.

(just so we're clear, this post is sarcasm)

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Originally Posted by ArchlordPie

IDK how you haven't recognized this yet, but it's almost 2025 and it hasn't been possible to criticize a trans person or their actions in good faith for a while now. Everything that VA says and does is fully acceptable and above reproach, solely because they are trans. Criticizing them, their speech, or the quality of their work makes you a bigot by default, no matter how warranted said criticism would be if this person were not trans. Do better.

(just so we're clear, this post is sarcasm)

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I keep asking all of Sena's defenders for proof of said death threats. Always crickets. Always.

My favorite thing about Wuk Lamat is that shes making people retroactively appreciate Lyse.

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Originally Posted by Coratanni

I keep asking all of Sena's defenders for proof of said death threats. Always crickets. Always.

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The point of internet death threats isn't if they're real or not.

But they're super easy to invent out of thin air.
And then people you can expect to react to poor you with sympathy will shower you good vibes, and performative scorn towards the mean faceless threat maker.
It's good exchange, actually: take internet crap flinging seriously => receive endorsement and support. Alternatively: lie about receiving interwebs hate => receive endorsement and support.

This is not reflection on miss Bryer. She might be in real danger from serious internet hitmen, or then she is not.
I... couldn't care less, actually.

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Originally Posted by Aneshda

There are always two sides to the coin. The fact is that Sena has incited hatred against other people on X (Twitter) and not just once, but several times, and has even demanded that people lose their jobs because they are not trans. She claimed to have received death threats after a player on X wrote "Your voice is not good and Wuk Lamat is not good either" under one of her posts. Yoshi P. should have fired Sena for these transgressions on X, because in any other job this is exactly what would have happened. Instead, SE is now trying to sweep everything under the carpet, as if nothing had happened.

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I don't doubt the death threats because I know that it's very easy nowadays to receive them online. I once got told by a random person on Twitter to kill myself for something relatively minor. I would be surprised if a trans actress who voices a divisive character didn't receive worse.

Also, if by "demanded that people lose their jobs because they are not trans," you're referring to her saying she thinks trans characters should be voiced by trans actors, that's not her demanding that every cis actor currently voicing a trans character be fired, that's just voicing an opinion about casting practices.

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Originally Posted by Aneshda

There are always two sides to the coin. The fact is that Sena has incited hatred against other people on X (Twitter) and not just once, but several times, and has even demanded that people lose their jobs because they are not trans. She claimed to have received death threats after a player on X wrote "Your voice is not good and Wuk Lamat is not good either" under one of her posts. Yoshi P. should have fired Sena for these transgressions on X, because in any other job this is exactly what would have happened. Instead, SE is now trying to sweep everything under the carpet, as if nothing had happened.

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Love how cancel culture suddenly is alright for your people

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Originally Posted by Shialan

Love how cancel culture suddenly is alright for your people

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Oh come on. 'Your people', really? Are we suddenly divided in two kinds of people?

I'm a defender of equality. That means same treatment for everyone. If you behave like a bad person, you deserve to get called out for it.
Belonging to any kind of minority is not a shield that defends you of criticism if you f up. That goes for Sena aswell as for everybody. She called a bunch of people racists over a mere song and was very misogynistic in her tweets. People have a right to not like her. Even if you think she is allowed to do everything because of her 'status'.

Also, it's really tiring the topic always goes back to her. I wish we could just finally ignore this annoying person. That's the treatment she deserves.

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Originally Posted by Aniise

Also, it's really tiring the topic always goes back to her. I wish we could just finally ignore this annoying person. That's the treatment she deserves.

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You know that will never happen, since Sena Bryer lives rent free in some peoples head and they need someone to hate for whatever reason.

By the way, where was it confirmed that Kate and Sena were friends prior to DT? I've seen this mentioned once or twice but when I google it all I get is a post or two on the forums.

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Originally Posted by Shialan

Love how cancel culture suddenly is alright for your people

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You could've just said Bigot/Transphobe/Misogynist, but instead chose "your people" like you low-key want to say a slur to who you were quoting. I'm going to assume it's a typo and you actually wanted to say "you people", which changes nothing really because again you could've just said Bigot/Transphobe/Misogynist if you're going to try and subtly imply someone is one of those things anyway.

To the main point. To bring up what someone said earlier-

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Originally Posted by Aniise

...If you behave like a bad person, you deserve to get called out for it. Belonging to any kind of minority is not a shield that defends you of criticism if you f up...

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Like Aniise said, Sena being trans doesn't mean she suddenly gets a free pass. For example: Sena DID say in a tweet that she PERSONALLY saw Smile as a "Black Gospel" song back during Dawntrail's launch, and implied that only people in a certain group [aka racists] would dislike the song, and only made it worse by gaslighting everyone who called her out on it after it.

I hate Smile. Personally feel it doesn't fit FF14's "theme". It's used at absolutely baffling times, like building a fucking train bomb. And Akeno sounded like she really had to force herself to hit the required pitches that were expected along with the tempo being all over the place. I have given my own personal opinions on why I didn't like the song. But I guess the ACTUAL reason I hate Smile MUST be because I hate black people. That's the only reason I could've possibly disliked this song. Even though it's now known that Ishikawa commissioned Smile to sound like it was from a Musical, which throws the "Black Gospel" stuff into the trash, it still doesn't change that Sena's tweet happened along with what it was trying to push.

People can scream "CANCEL CULTURE" all they want. I don't like it myself because people are sometimes cancelled for the dumbest shit, but there have been genuine criticisms to things Sena has said on Twitter, along with genuine criticisms to her performance back during launch. Being Trans doesn't suddenly mean Sena becomes immune to any backlash she might receive as a result of things she might say/do. To me it feels pretty scummy to try and use whole groups of people as shields and go "Well you only have an issue with my tweets/my performance because you MUST be a bigot/transphobe/misogynist/racist" and then just expect people to defend you. Like with the Smile tweet: some could've seen it as Sena trying to use Black people as a "shield" to defend her "take" because she specifically mentioned Black Gospel along with saying people who didn't like it might just be racist, neither of which needed to be mentioned in the first place.

Unfortunately we just currently live in a time on the internet where gaslighting, buzzwords, and deflecting is easier to do then actually attempting to have a conversation.

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Originally Posted by Shialan

Love how cancel culture suddenly is alright for your people

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It's not cancel culture to want someone to face consequences for directly vilifying the playerbase of the game they work for out of nowhere and attacking them verbally. (and also doing poor voice work.) People are not asking for Sena to be sacked for completely unrelated tweets or anything like that, Sena is disrespecting the playerbase and delivering a bad product.

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Originally Posted by Jangles

It's not cancel culture to want someone to face consequences for directly vilifying the playerbase of the game they work for out of nowhere and attacking them verbally. (and also doing poor voice work.) People are not asking for Sena to be sacked for completely unrelated tweets or anything like that, Sena is disrespecting the playerbase and delivering a bad product.

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Accusing her of vilifying the playerbase of the game she works for "out of nowhere" is pretty ironic considering she's the one who was vilified first.