Frontlines: Leechers and Feeders

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Originally Posted by Mawlzy

Clearly a good game, well played, but I'll often get that kind of K/D/A on WAR doing ~350k damage. Point being damage is a job-dependent metric. And in the match I just played, which was one of the better ones with no obvious tourists, 47 of the players were sub-500k.

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Only in the extreme case of Machinist can you consider it being job-dependent, where they mostly play at executioner, and have to position perfectly.

Anyway, here's Warrior. Pretty rough game since red knew how to focus fire, and with warrior diving in twelve people while not griefing, well, it was difficult to pick and choose engagements. I can likely do better but it would require an uncoordinated team.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...13883a8ac69bc&

I probably have time for one more before queues die off and sleep is important. Onsal Hakair is pretty heavy into damage, so will see what happens.

Edit: Here's Black Mage. Ice is pretty rare to use lately just because of the nature of the mode, and pre-emptive Purify/Guard makes it difficult to use. If it was CC, it would be a different story, but it went back to situational since the buffs/nerfs to Fire and Ice respectively. Seal Rock is likely going to be the more difficult map, but I will try Sage.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...7dac9dc1c9a0c&

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Originally Posted by Enjuden

Only in the extreme case of Machinist can you consider it being job-dependent, where they mostly play at executioner, and have to position perfectly.

Anyway, here's Warrior. Pretty rough game since red knew how to focus fire, and with warrior diving in twelve people, well, it was difficult to pick and choose engagements. I can likely do better but it would require an uncoordinated team.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...13883a8ac69bc&

I probably have time for one more before queues die off and sleep is important. Onsal Hakair is pretty heavy into damage, so will see what happens.

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Yes of course every job is required to do damage, but doing damage in itself isn't the goal. You need to do effective damage. For example, as WAR on Onsal one can rack up high damage numbers by repeatedly rending on the top of an enemy ramp and if the enemy is clumped and slow, the orogeny/cyclone follow-up creates big numbers. But if you do that without team back-up you don't kill anything (outside of LB) and have low survivability. In fact the easiest method of getting high damage on WAR is to suicide, modulo the penalty for losing BH.

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Originally Posted by Mawlzy

Yes of course every job is required to do damage, but doing damage in itself isn't the goal. You need to do effective damage. For example, as WAR on Onsal one can rack up high damage numbers by repeatedly rending on the top of an enemy ramp and if the enemy is clumped and slow, the orogeny/cyclone follow-up creates big numbers. But if you do that without team back-up you don't kill anything (outside of LB) and have low survivability. In fact the easiest method of getting high damage on WAR is to suicide, modulo the penalty for losing BH.

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I mean if you want to argue that, sure, though K/D/A would make it blatantly obvious that you're just feeding Battle High. Whether that's intentional or not is another story because playing Warrior well is not easy.

Even with LB you likely just die anyway due to the long cast of Warrior, and LBing one target is likely a waste unless you're focusing a BH 4/5 down

For me personally, survival is key. I engage when it is safe to do so, and my MP is high enough to keep me alive, and I back out when I'm being targetted heavily, or MP starts going down. You gotta know the dance, and how to shake people off of you, like cutting their line of sight, or going out of range so they switch targets and you can return to the fight or pop elixir.

I have gotten BH V on pretty much ALL jobs in this game. I know for a fact that all of them are capable of doing big numbers. Personally I put GNB and DNC as the worst. They have bad LB's that lock them in place and get them killed, or prevent them from using other abilities while they're going off. Or I just personally suck at playing them. Either way, I think it largely comes down to the player in control at the end of the day, no offense intended.

If I ever figured out how to post pictures here I'd share my results as well with pretty much any job to demonstrate that not only 500k+ is possible, but 1m+ is possible on pretty much all of them assuming you're A: not playing with, or against premades for a fair shot.

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Originally Posted by Enjuden

Frankly, you just ban everyone who does less than X amount of damage from playing the mode.

Anything under 100k is an obvious leech. Under 500k you're basically trolling unless it's the crystal map or you just hard lost, where it likely still is griefing if it's the crystal map.

The mode is all about damage, and hitting over 100k is extremely braindead to do with how much aoe barf jobs have.

If they want to play so badly that they'll grief, they should just specifically lock out all pvp content from the account. They'll grief in other ways, but if they play like that in pve they'll get banned. Just the GMs do not care whatsoever about PvP, so they might as well just automate it and give out permanent content bans.

Before the 'smart' comments about how 100k is too easy, it's an arbitrary number. If it were me, it'd be 500k at minimum since it will force even the worst player to participate, but better to not tell the number.

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This is 100% a quick way to kill the entire game mode.

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Originally Posted by Bobby66

This is 100% a quick way to kill the entire game mode.

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Sure, if you went the possibly extreme route of what I do as a metric. If you lowballed with less than 100k, then you would get rid of everyone who is 'just there for the exp'/leechers

I played Sage maybe once when EW came out in PVP. I didn't use my LB very much in this match but didn't really know where to place it, so I left it alone outside of one use. This match is easily as bad as Frontline used to be when it was full premade or lose. The idea is to hit toxikon on your main target, then once that is down, hit as much of the group as you can. Sage is admittedly pretty hard to do without a second person, but it can be done so long as you don't recklessly use Icarus. What I mean by reckless uses is to always have two charges when you go in, so you can leave immediately after baiting damage onto you with guard. Still, even with the worst case scenario, you can still get over 500k if you play well.

Any other jobs? I do not play Sage at all in PvP, but it was pretty fun to figure it out during this match, and likely can be a bit more optimal with damage. Even in the worst case scenario, you still can contribute with the metric I had so long as you play smart.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...358c1d72f080d&

https://i.imgur.com/MHHWyXL.png

This is my go of Sage. I absolutely hate playing this job, definetely not one of my go-to's. Good performances are possible however

Oooo. Can I play? I have fun on SGE.

https://lds-img.finalfantasyxiv.com/...d589dd849b.png

I've never played SGE in FL, but based on those numbers, it looks like the biggest skill is positioning.