Dragoon is next

More than 5 buttons?! INCONCEIVABLE! IT'S BUTTON BLOAT FIX IT FIX IT!!

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Originally Posted by Haventale

I actually really, really hope that next expansion is the very last level cap increase. I really hope this game stops at level 99 or 100. I don’t play wow, but I remember hearing that they had to do a level squish because there was way too many levels for the number of skills, so you would just have big chunks of levels that were essentially a meaningless gameplay experience, nothing changed. In my opinion, FFXIV already got there by ShB. I don’t want this to continue on forever in this game.

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I suspect they'll definitely do a level squish. This is, honestly, one of the more perfect times for it, but judging by the amount of content they're planning on adding this expansion, I don't see it happening.

Personally, I would plan on 7.0 to be a new starting position. Make the max level 50; Anyone at level 90 today would be... level 45 or something. Otherwise, people starting today can start with the "Hydaelyn Arc" or "-Spoiler- Arc". Squish the Hydaelyn arc (basically halving the levels of quests, items, abilities, etc) and the new arc would start at level 1.

With "10 years" of planned content remaining, it would be somewhat difficult for people to be "ok" with not raising the level cap, unless they implement some other superficial progression system.

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Originally Posted by ThorneDynasty

And you realize all the high-end content happens between the couple year period between expansions, which is the bulk of the game's life cycle and during which job engagement is a much more important factor than the few weeks when everyone is playing MSQ? We aren't even 6.2 yet, there's literally no worse time to start taking parts out of the engine on a vague promise you'll get something working in 7.0.

And the right time to unveil that is when you actually have something to show for it, not incremental unfinished ideas you refuse to explain even out of the game. Right now we have seen nothing better.

Speaking of being willing to change design philosophies, maybe it's time to rethink the mandatory 2-extra button per expansion one? Not that every single job really had that many in 7.0 either. Dragoon for one. You can just update buttons to fancier animations and tune some quality of life stuff if there's actually nothing to fix about a job. Look at what 82-90 actually entails, "room for 5 new features" is a huge misdirect on your part - the only actual thing that even theoretically needed squeezing was Wyrmwind.

You could easily make the level 100 capstone ability just a combo move after Stardiver or Dragonfire, change fundamentally nothing about the rotation and no-one would complain. We didn't last time.

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1.) Except they didn't change anything, and they've been playing with the potency of abilities since the first patch.
2.) Again nothing has changed, and how brass of you to assume they don't have this all planned out. They didn't take one or two skills out and leave nothing, then 2 patches later add 1 new skill, then tweak that skill over the next several patches before going back to the drawing board and resetting everything. What you're getting at is paramount to hyperbole. They don't say anything about what they are looking to do because of how you're acting right now.
3.) I'm not even addressing this, talk to the Devs on Instagram if you want to have that conversation.

I get why people play a game that has been changing ever since 1.0 and think nothing will ever change for them? O_o?
Like literally what are you people even talking about? Dragoon has undergone several huge changes since its inception, and guess what it will continue to do so go going forward. More buttons, less buttons, longer strings, shorter strings, what you're arguing over is small in the larger scope of the job itself. Hypothetically if you know the burst window the entire rotation is 2 minutes, then you in theory already know how many skills can be used in a rotation right? They literally have to make changes in order to NOT cap themselves when doing further development and adding new things, unless you really want those burst windows to grow longer, which would slow down gameplay which is something some already criticize about.

Don't change you argument mid discussion on the sly, you were literally arguing for removing skills for no gameplay benefit until 7.0.

You can hit a dummy for a hour and still not learn the rotation. And going dummy to boss are two different things.
Can a dummy help, yes. Do they fix bloat, no.

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Originally Posted by Selvokaz

Again nothing has changed, and how brass of you to assume they don't have this all planned out.

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You actually think they plan things out for job changes? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

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Originally Posted by Selvokaz

Hypothetically if you know the burst window the entire rotation is 2 minutes, then you in theory already know how many skills can be used in a rotation right? They literally have to make changes in order to NOT cap themselves when doing further development and adding new things, unless you really want those burst windows to grow longer, which would slow down gameplay which is something some already criticize about.

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This alone tells me you have no idea what you're talking about

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Originally Posted by SilverSkyway

You can hit a dummy for a hour and still not learn the rotation. And going dummy to boss are two different things.
Can a dummy help, yes. Do they fix bloat, no.

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if you're unable to learn the basics of a rotation after hours of hitting the dummy, maybe you're the issue and not the job? At no point does the game force you to fully grasp any job, and almost all content (EVEN INCLUDING SAVAGE) can be cleared pressing nothing but 1 2 and 3. There is nothing to be gained from kneecapping jobs so you can feel better about yourself. It actively hurts the game for those willing to put in the time and effort to learn the jobs.

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Originally Posted by butchersblock

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Couldn't agree more

These people... So many rehash the same argument to defend Button Bloat... I'm almost convinced they're bots at this point. Compare their reused argument point and apply it to say...

• Chess removing a key piece like the Rooks and Bishops
• Basketball without traveling and prohibiting dunking
• Baseball making the ball twice as large
• Football prohibiting running and removing the Goalpost
• Soccer without goalkeepers and making the Goal twice as big
• FPS games and removing vulnerable target spots like head for headshots
• League of Legends and remove the R button and passives
• Fighting Games and removing projectiles/blocking/parrying/animation canceling
• Real-Time-Strategy games and removing the need to harvest resources
• PvP-MMO's with their Crowd-Control system removed
• Boxing and removing all left punches
• Chocolate Cake and remove all the... Chocolate?

( PS: I don't even know sports! )

Taking away key components of a Job or Gameplay purely to take stuff away? is a poor argument for gameplay improvement or tackling the so called Button Bloat issue, that's been reused more then the " 500 Gil hooker at Limsa-square ". These people need to Stop... just... just stop... with these horrible takes...

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Originally Posted by SilverSkyway

You can hit a dummy for a hour and still not learn the rotation. And going dummy to boss are two different things.
Can a dummy help, yes. Do they fix bloat, no.

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Sucks to suck.

tbh it would be fine by me if dragoon would just stay as it is now. its amazing. no new skills even if there are more lvl to it. otherwise we will lose skills and get new ones over lvl 90 which will stretch out the lvls between getting skills. if it stays as it is we would judt get more content we csn play with a great rotation without losing skills in downscaling.

yeah sure there will be people getting bored of it. but other people wont. and there will be new players in the future who otherwise never can enjoy this version of dragoon.