Is it time to remove dots from the game?

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Originally Posted by ItMe

Umm...
You know that you can go into the settings and TURN OFF other players dots and debuffs, right?
You can set it to only display yours and the enemys.

https://i.postimg.cc/XrHmdjVF/ffxiv-...094929-852.png

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That doesn't actually prevent the issue with the debuff cap FYI.

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Originally Posted by Roda

That's an issue with UI design not class design.

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It was a UI compromise that was only a problem due to class design. A limit of 48 visible debuffs isn't a problem when each player can only apply 1 or 2 stacking debuffs/dots. It becomes a problem when each class applies 3 or more.

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Originally Posted by ItMe

Umm...
You know that you can go into the settings and TURN OFF other players dots and debuffs, right?
You can set it to only display yours and the enemys.

https://i.postimg.cc/XrHmdjVF/ffxiv-...094929-852.png

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That didn't actually do anything (as that option is a client side culling) when the server was not sending you the info on your debuffs/dots. The server only sent out the info on about 48 buffs/debuffs/dots per target (to save on memory use/packet size) while only tracking up to about 100.

Most dots (Save SMN) are just a single DoT at this point so I say yes.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

Most dots (Save SMN) are just a single DoT at this point so I say yes.

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BRD has two dots too you know,and conversely SMN has Tri-disaster which is the same effect as having a single dot most of the time (then again there is Titan and Garuda's puddles)

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Originally Posted by Ultimatecalibur

It was a UI compromise that was only a problem due to class design. A limit of 48 visible debuffs isn't a problem when each player can only apply 1 or 2 stacking debuffs/dots. It becomes a problem when each class applies 3 or more.

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And the solution to that should be to give a clientside priority to show your dots before even trying to show the rest of the raid's. User's dots = Boss's buffs > trick attack = chain strategium = feint = addle = slow = blind = bind = stun = paralysis > other player's dots. The fact that the game puts every status effect into a bucket and just splashes whatever gets applied first onto those two rows is definitely a ui issue.

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Originally Posted by Ilenya

That doesn't actually prevent the issue with the debuff cap FYI.

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Originally Posted by Ultimatecalibur

That didn't actually do anything (as that option is a client side culling) when the server was not sending you the info on your debuffs/dots. The server only sent out the info on about 48 buffs/debuffs/dots per target (to save on memory use/packet size) while only tracking up to about 100.

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Huh... I didn't know that.
Thanks for the information

I agree some dots are just skill fodder (looking at you Sonic Break) but I disagree to remove all of them. SMN and BRD are dot management most notable BRD since I can’t imagine then reworking jobs to remove features.

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Originally Posted by Roda

And the solution to that should be to give a clientside priority to show your dots before even trying to show the rest of the raid's. User's dots = Boss's buffs > trick attack = chain strategium = feint = addle = slow = blind = bind = stun = paralysis > other player's dots. The fact that the game puts every status effect into a bucket and just splashes whatever gets applied first onto those two rows is definitely a ui issue.

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The UI pretty much does that as the client parses your debuff/dots and the target's buffs/debuffs to take priority to visualize. The client can not display any info that it doesn't receive. The problem was that the server wasn't and doesn't send the full list of all buffs/debuffs/dots if it exceeds a certain limit. The server only sends you something like the first 48 buffs/debuffs/dots on the target even when it actually has 49+ buffs/debuffs/dots on it. If your debuff/dot ends up in position 49+ on the list no one is seeing it.

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Originally Posted by ItMe

Huh... I didn't know that.
Thanks for the information

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It's a lot less likely to happen, to be fair. I only ran into it recently because I happened to catch a hunt train and tried to DoT the hunt. For most jobs it's a non-issue, but I feel bad for any SMN/BRD that gets caught in that.

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Originally Posted by Ultimatecalibur

The UI pretty much does that as the client parses your debuff/dots and the target's buffs/debuffs to take priority to visualize. The client can not display any info that it doesn't receive. The problem was that the server wasn't and doesn't send the full list of all buffs/debuffs/dots if it exceeds a certain limit. The server only sends you something like the first 48 buffs/debuffs/dots on the target even when it actually has 49+ buffs/debuffs/dots on it. If your debuff/dot ends up in position 49+ on the list no one is seeing it.

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Idk how to tell you this, but how the UI interacts with the server is still a UI issue.

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Originally Posted by Ilenya

It's a lot less likely to happen, to be fair. I only ran into it recently because I happened to catch a hunt train and tried to DoT the hunt. For most jobs it's a non-issue, but I feel bad for any SMN/BRD that gets caught in that.

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I know my timers well enough so that it doesn't affect me too badly.