Here goes our opener:
Huton > Hide > Suiton > Spinning Edge > Dex Potion+Mug > Gust Slash > Trick Attack+Kassatsu > Shadow Fang > Raiton > Spinning Edge > Dream within a dream+Jugulate > Gust Slash > Duality > Aeolian Edge > Bhavacakra
Save Ten Chi Jin for the second Trick Attack unless there is somehow more than one mob at the start of a boss fight then use Ten Chi Jin with Katon and Doton.
Edit. This rotation is very outdated and it wasn't ever optimall! New rotation a couple pages up.
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06-07-2017, 09:59 PMAdelaide3
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06-07-2017, 11:01 PMArkenneYup, I tried that opener in TA with DwaD + Duality ahead of Ten Chi Jin on purpose and ended with those 3 seconds,Quote:
Originally Posted by Klarkus
I will try to get an opener the other way around, with Ten Chi Jin ahead of DwaD + Duality in TA.
I wonder how it all changes if some SkS is involved as SkS does not affect Auto Attacks but certainly can change the timing of GCDs...
I will try to emulate a 2~1.91GCD/s scenario. And another with Arrow up from the get go :v
Ten Chi Jin is waaaaaaaay more powerful than Bhavacakra, I would recommend against delaying it, even if you can't place it in the TA window.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adelaide3
Bhavacakra is 595 Potency with TA.
Ten Chi Jin(Shu Rai Sui) is 780 without TA, it gets doubled, and this isn't even considering Kassatsu (which we've yet to see if it only affects Shuriken).
Well, there is also the AoE Scenario... -
06-07-2017, 11:18 PMAdelaide3By using Ten Chi Jin right away you're losing more potencies slightly further down the rotation because you're going to clip the hell out of your GCD by using basic Suiton and suffer a potency blow by not being able to use Shuriken or Raiton. Also, by using Bhavacakra first, it'll be up again for your third Ninki gauge charge. Overall, it's going to be a Dps increase by delaying Ten Chi Jin. The trade offs to use it sooner aren't worth it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkenne
There can possibly be a different opener from mine that uses a Kassatsu buffed Ten Chi Jin but i'm not seeing it at the moment. Oh and Kassatsu would only buff the Shuriken if it were to even work. -
06-07-2017, 11:28 PMLaflama_Blanca
I was thinking something more like:
Huton - Hide - Shadewalker - Raiton on the pull - Spinning Edge - Mug - Gust Slash - Jugulate - Shadow Fang - Spinning Edge - Gust Slash - Aeolean Edge - Spinning Edge - Potion - Gust Slash - Duality - Aeolean Edge - Spinning Edge - Raiton + Kassatsu - Gust Slash - Ten Chi Jin - Fuma Shuriken - Raiton - Suiton - Trick Attack - Shadow Fang - Dream Within a Dream
Trick is not worth using prior to Ten Chi Jin compared to Raiton. By using Raiton on the pull and slightly delaying Ten Chi Jin we get in 2 Raitons prior to Ten Chi Jin without wasting any ninki. I think potion would still be up for DWaD in this opener; if not, it would need to be pushed back and paired with duality. I defintely think we want to use Ten Chi Jin before Bhavacakra in the standard opener. It's too powerful to delay and maximizes the guaranteed crit of kassatsu. Standard ninki rotation looks like TCJ - Bhava - Frog - Bhava repeat.
Edit: Mug and Jugulate could also be moved after the first shadow fang for a little extra potency. -
06-07-2017, 11:46 PMAdelaide3
There's just way too many steps in that rotation that greatly delays getting all of your big cooldowns on cooldown for the sake of some delayed up front burst. It'll only hurt your Dps a little further into your rotation. I'm not saying it can't work but Kassatsu into Ten Chi Jin into Trick Attack is going to have to come alot sooner than that. You also have to consider that Trick Attack doesn't belong to you alone and it needs to be on the boss as soon as possible.
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06-08-2017, 12:19 AMSigmakan
I'll probably do:
Suiton>Spinning>Gust>Jugulate>Aeolian>Kassatsu>Spinning>pot>Gust>Trick>Shadow Fang>Raiton>Spinning>DWD+Mug>Gust>Duality>Aeolian>TCJ>Fuma>Raiton (trick ends here)>Suiton
Its going to be really tight. Waiting 5 GCDs on trick will put suiton at <1 s, so if the pull is sloppy RIP TA. Im also not sure if raiton will fit in TA, itll be close. You need to fit a decent amount of GCD clipping into the TA window, but youre also doing 1 less GCD than normal so it -should- work. I'd feel really confident in pulling this off if servers were still on east coast, but now with 100ms ping I'm concerned I'll have too much clipping.
Also, delaying trick by 1 GCD will likely work out better for other jobs as it seems most jobs openers got pushed back 1-3 GCDs. -
06-08-2017, 12:38 AMLaflama_Blanca
Adelaide - Very true that other dps needs to be considered with trick timing. There seems to be more ramp up across other classes now as well though, so my proposed trick timing could work well with drg and sam for example. Will need to be tested to know for certain. I do not think the delays in cooldowns are a negative though. My opener delays kassatsu but makes up for it with the extra raiton, which is essentially what an extra kassatsu (dependent on encounter length) would get you at the end of the fight anyway. DWaD is indeed delayed to align with trick. It could be moved up if an encounter calls for it. I think that the overall benefits of my opener still maximize everything (potion, raiton damage, kassatsu crit, cooldown alignment) to the fullest potential. It's just on paper so far though, will be very fun to test.
Sigmakan - it looks like your opener has TCJ resetting the ninjutsu cooldown. I am going by the assumption that it does not. I haven't seen a video where they use TCJ while ninjutsu is already on cooldown, so it remains to be seen. TCJ would be even more powerful if it does in fact resets cooldown - probably overly so. -
06-08-2017, 01:07 AMArkenneMy plan is by the end of the day, just seeing if I can apply TenCJ inside a TA window within 30 seconds, managing to do so in 20~23 so I think its not that bad.Quote:
Originally Posted by Adelaide3
BTW, I reread your opener here so lemme point it out because I feel something is odd :/Quote:
Originally Posted by Adelaide3
Lets suppose you have a GCD of 2 seconds, and have no clipping outside of Dex pot for 1s delay.
SE+GS+SF+SE+GS+AE < 12 seconds
Pot < 1 second
thats 13 seconds, time for autoattacks to happen at least 6 times, this means 36 ninki, plus mug is 66, you may not have the ninki for Bhavacakra at the end of it... let alone it being inside TA.
Now if we consider the clippings of doubleweaving... it would be like... 2 seconds? that still means 72 ninki at best :/
Well, I get your point but I still think you should revise the Bhavacakra timing there if you have 0 Ninki.
I will try to emulate it a bit to see the loss you mention about tho...
Edit: oh btw, it seems like there is a little bug regarding Kassatsu, sometimes I use a Ninjutsu inside its window and yet Kassatsu isn't consumed out of my buff bar. It is possible that if the Ninjutsu crits by itself the buff isn't used so it remains. If that is the case, Shuriken could crit by itself and Raiton could be force crit by Kassatsu, its a nice bet for me. -
06-08-2017, 01:27 AMAdelaide3
Yeah, I kind of considered that I wouldn't have enough Ninki at the point where I put Bhavacakra at but I wasn't for certain as I didn't do all the inbetween math. I'd have to move it a little further down until the gauge fills up. Double weaving TA+Kass and DwaD+Jug doesn't clip much at all from what I tested.
I'll take another look at my rotation later today and see if I can change something. -
06-08-2017, 01:28 AMKlarkusBut you want to try get your highest damage in early to pair up with party buffs like balance, battle lit, hyper charge ectQuote:
Originally Posted by Adelaide3