Aymeric (SPOILERS)

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Originally Posted by Morningstar1337

Come to think of it, He didn't show up when we knocked on Sephirot's door (then again I;d imagine that be might be at greater risk than most being near primals/eikons after Flow)

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You forgot a 'h' there. It's Sephiroth, not 'Sephirot'. :)

(I am kidding, don't hurt me!)

Anyway! It's possible that Thancred recalls a lot of stuff from his time being possessed by an Ascian - so he may feel as though teaming up with them to save Minfilia is a 'wise' move on his part. Desperate people do desperate things after all - and he's prone to punishing himself severely/not talking out his problems and acting recklessly instead.

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Originally Posted by myahele

I am mostly interested if Ishgard will keep it's Theocracy or will it become something else ... like a republic?

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I feel like Ishgard will become a stratocracy, that is to say, a government controlled by the military, in this case it being the Temple Knights. It's not, strictly speaking, the same as a military dictatorship, here's the definition on wikipedia that sums it up pretty well.

"A stratocracy (from στρατός, stratos, "army" and κράτος, kratos, "dominion", "power") is a form of government headed by military chiefs. It is not the same as a military dictatorship or military junta where the military's political power is not enforced or even supported by other laws. Rather, stratocracy is a form of military government in which the state and the military are traditionally or constitutionally the same entity, and government positions are always occupied by commissioned officers and military leaders. Citizens with mandatory and/or voluntary military service, or who have been honorably discharged, have the right to elect and/or govern. The military's political power is supported by law, the constitution, and the society. A stratocracy therefore is more often a meritocracy and does not have to be autocratic by nature in order to preserve its right to rule."

Then again, it might not work if they make peace with the dragons, but given that Aymeric is the de facto leader of Ishgard right now, I don't feel that the above is unthinkable. He could easily delegate responsibilities to his most trusted officers since they could be the only one he could fully trust next to House Fortemps and given that the final battle of the Dragonsong War is likely to be coming very soon in the MSQ, they'll need every capable officer in charge preparing for the defense.

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Originally Posted by Fenral

I'm actually so cynical that it's rolled over into really stubborn optimism, like a reverse of the Nuclear Gandhi glitch in Civilization.

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Originally Posted by CyrilLucifer

I'm really in the same boat as Fenral. I'm so cynical it looped around into some sort of masochistic optimism.

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I know exactly what you guys mean lol.

As for the Thancred thing, I was under the assumption that it was a run on from the 2.3 (ish) days. They basically cock blocked Thancred from any kind of Primal utility based on him being somehow more susceptible to Primal influences than the rest of the group after his run in with Lahabreah. It was always kind of shotty lore, to be honest, because they don't actually explain how one can be more or less susceptible to influence (tempering always kind of came off as an all or nothing kind of deal), but that was the reasoning that they went with to keep Thancred out of the line of fire. I figured that his absence during the Sephirot ordeal was on account of this, and that they just didn't mention it because re-running the same lore points over and over makes for stale dialogue.

His heightened susceptibility is also why I tend to keep Thancred separate from any Ascian dealings as well. Thancred seems to be coming to terms with his loss of Minfilia, so I don't see him running off to charge into the Ascian hands anytime soon, but, even if he was that desperate, it stands to reason that he would avoid them simply because he knows how easy it would be for them to flip his switch (kinky...).

Now, if I were to take the cynical approach to this, on the flip side his heightened susceptibility to influences would, in theory, make it pretty easy for a smooth talker like Elidibus to get under his skin. So, IF, hypothetically, Thancred were to go off of the deep end in his pursuit of saving Minfilia, I don't think that it would be outside of the realm of possibility for him to be coaxed into doing something stupid by an Ascian.

That said, I find this unlikely. The current writing seems to be building up Thancred as the voice of matured enlightenment via the contrasted character dispositions between himself and Emmanellain. So it would be more likely for Thancred to be at his highest guard against such influences at the moment ... of course, that would make any lapses in judgement (or downright manipulations) to be all the more tragic and impactful....

Huh, I always assumed Thancred wasn't helping with Sephirot because he can't teleport to Azys Lla. Doubt everyone is going to travel to Ishgard and take the airship there when they can do that from the Rising Stones directly

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Originally Posted by PArcher

Huh, I always assumed Thancred wasn't helping with Sephirot because he can't teleport to Azys Lla. Doubt everyone is going to travel to Ishgard and take the airship there when they can do that from the Rising Stones directly

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Krile and Urianger haven't even been to Azys Lla prior to this questline, they couldn't teleport there, either. They would have had to take the airship. Thancred not being able to teleport isn't really an excuse in this case. And Mor Dhona isn't terribly far from Ishgard; after all, Thancred got to the Stones and back to Ishgard next patch once already!

That being said, looking at Unukalhai's dialogue, he says straight out that the Scions are aiding 'us' (referring to you, him, and Krile) against the Triad. Urianger actually getting some air from his hidey hole makes sense, considering he wants to see if Unukalhai can be trusted, but I don't really see a reason why Thancred didn't. The goal was never for them to be near the primals, they were always going to stay back and make sure no one interfered.

Maybe its a hint that, while not neccesarily JOINING the Ascians, Thancred might not be helping us for one reason or another starting next patch?

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Originally Posted by CyrilLucifer

Krile and Urianger haven't even been to Azys Lla prior to this questline, they couldn't teleport there, either. They would have had to take the airship. Thancred not being able to teleport isn't really an excuse in this case. And Mor Dhona isn't terribly far from Ishgard; after all, Thancred got to the Stones and back to Ishgard next patch once already!

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Well, we don't know that for sure. Time definitely passes between patches, how much we don't know. Somehow Urianger got to the Library and then back to the Waking Sands between then ending of 3.0 and the start of 3.1, after all; very possible that between 3.1 and 3.2 they both went to Azys Lla to see take a look at the Triad statues for themselves.

Perhaps Thancred and the WoD will hookup, eh?

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I wouldn't complain at all.

Just something I was thinking about...

It may just be my interpretation but to me it seemed Aymeric didn't shoot to kill the possessed Estinien but was aiming at one of the eyes. At least the arrow was in perfect position for the dragonified Estie to intercept it with his hand:
https://youtu.be/MzfqJ0aBhik?list=PL...Tq3e39xZ&t=934
Could destroying the eyes free Estie?

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Originally Posted by Februs

A downright morally reprehensible character would have orchestrated the whole thing with the intent of greasing the wheels with the dragons.

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This is exactly what I am sensing. I nevet fully states that Aymeric is evil but that I don't trust him. Exactly like Littlefinger in GoT. They are both masters of manipulation and are willing to sacrifice a few to achieve their long term goals. Peace with the dragons would put Aymeric in the top seat for Ishgard. Why not use a pawn to achieve that vision.