o.O Overkill on the crafting Dumb down?

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

it wont, but itl kill the price on them

when everyone can make them, no one will basicaly cuz there would be no profit in it

why spend 10k to make an item that only sells for 2-3k?

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10K gil for a 3K gil item would be be illogical, I agree.

But as I noted in previous posts, you and I have a disagreement on how much of a price drop will occur because Parts are replaced with more common Refined Materials in recipes.

Right now, the median price for a [item=4040101]Bronze Labrys[/item] is 25,000 gil. You seem to believe that price will drop 90% to about 2,500 gil. I just don't see that happening.

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Originally Posted by AreeyaJaidee

It should be an HQ market anyway.

I say pricing is moot and it is because the over saturation occurs regardless. Everyone in FFXIV can craft just about anything with enough time and dedication.

Crafters

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thats how it is right now too
the people who dedicate to making stuff, make it
alot of the unmade recipes, its cuz the materials take a long time to make so only those with the willingness to put time into it do so
the hq market will end up being the same down the road, most people wont bother, but then youll have those who go out of their way for hq mats to make a good profit(and itl still take the extra time to do)

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Originally Posted by Sorel

10K gil for a 3K gil item would be be illogical, I agree.

But as I noted in previous posts, you and I have a disagreement on how much of a price drop will occur because Parts are replaced with more common Refined Materials in recipes.

Right now, the median price for a [item=4040101]Bronze Labrys[/item] is 25,000 gil. You seem to believe that price will drop 90% to about 2,500 gil. I just don't see that happening.

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ive been in the crafting vs market game for a year...ive seen it happen on EVERY item that gets oversaturated in the market
ive been personaly responsible for making items go down 400% in value cuz i make too many of them vs the competition

now imagine the market where its easier to make all these items? thats exactly whats gonna happen
when no one has to make parts and can buy the easy to make materials everyone else is already making.

if your labrys goes for 25k now i can easily see it going for 5k or less post patch. and then it will just flat out disappear from the market as no one will make them(until someone sees this and the cycle starts all over again)

Sorry hit post by accident lol. I'm on iPhone >_>

Crafters currently face the same issue as DoW: Specialisation

ALOT of crafters complain that they don't feel important due to any regular Joe being able to craft. I think were missing the point that the craft system is still being restructured by SE because they know this is a issue.

On the same hand: even when crafting gets advanced enough to
Be a specialization, there will still be other specialists. I think a lot of players just need to drop the "I'm the only 50 WVR" mentality and focus on the excitement of what the future offers.

If you're a crafter that is bored of loosing sales and making lame gear then step it up a notch and start working on HQ mats and NM gear.

the new system also puts more favor on gatherers which is a good thing. Game needs more balancing like this

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

ive been in the crafting vs market game for a year...ive seen it happen on EVERY item that gets oversaturated in the market
ive been personaly responsible for making items go down 400% in value cuz i make too many of them vs the competition

now imagine the market where its easier to make all these items? thats exactly whats gonna happen
when no one has to make parts and can buy the easy to make materials everyone else is already making.

if your labrys goes for 25k now i can easily see it going for 5k or less post patch. and then it will just flat out disappear from the market as no one will make them(until someone sees this and the cycle starts all over again)

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Having been a market player from time to time over the past...7? years on different mmos, i can confirm that's exactly what will happen..

It will either cause raw material prices to soar high or finished item prices to drop so low and that noone will bother to sell em.
But hey, atleast people who cant be bothered to consider crafters classes of their own can have their equipment that they dont really need anyway~

Also ive personally been the cause of items being sold at less of 10% of what they were selling at the day before, so yes it can happen. xD
Market cascade/competition ftw!

You guys are missing three important parts here:

- increased demand
- varied item sales
- archaic craft leveling

The current item:player ratio suffers due to lack of FFXIV subscriptions. Until the game becomes more popular this will remain an issue.

If you keep adding to the over saturation of course it will be a problem. Vary the items you sell.

Which brings up the next issue: the method of ranking DoH in FFXIV is archaic and needs to be expanded: this will lead to less over saturation of items since crafers won't be hard pressed to sell those 40 jackets they just wasted time on.

The future: the craft revision shows me two things.

- SE is placing more empasis on non stackables
- SE intends to expand ranking methods for DoH since there will no longer be a dependence on parts as a main ranking item.

Many crafters are avoiding saying the truth. Parts are how we rank fast. SE knows this. Every other aspect of leveling in ffxiv is planned for revision with good replacements.

SE knows what they're doing, I'm sure they're smart enough to crunch these numbers as it is their job. Don't go into referencing the old devs failures either :) this will all make sense soon I'm sure

Price drops also occur post patch because new gear drops make certain items obsolete.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

ive been in the crafting vs market game for a year...ive seen it happen on EVERY item that gets oversaturated in the market
ive been personaly responsible for making items go down 400% in value cuz i make too many of them vs the competition

now imagine the market where its easier to make all these items? thats exactly whats gonna happen
when no one has to make parts and can buy the easy to make materials everyone else is already making.

if your labrys goes for 25k now i can easily see it going for 5k or less post patch. and then it will just flat out disappear from the market as no one will make them(until someone sees this and the cycle starts all over again)

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Aeyis

Having been a market player from time to time over the past...7? years on different mmos, i can confirm that's exactly what will happen..

It will either cause raw material prices to soar high or finished item prices to drop so low and that noone will bother to sell em.
But hey, atleast people who cant be bothered to consider crafters classes of their own can have their equipment that they dont really need anyway~

Also ive personally been the cause of items being sold at less of 10% of what they were selling at the day before, so yes it can happen. xD
Market cascade/competition ftw!

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OK. Putting aside my opinion (because it is only just that) that you are both overestimating the price drop that will occur ...

... asking an honest question now. Do you all think the fact that a crafter is only able to put a maximum of 20 of any particular Finished Product on the market at one time will either speed up or slow down this extreme price drop that you predicted?

I would also welcome Ferth's opinion on this.

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Originally Posted by AreeyaJaidee

You guys are missing three important parts here:

- increased demand
- varied item sales
- archaic craft leveling

The current item:player ratio suffers due to lack of FFXIV subscriptions. Until the game becomes more popular this will remain an issue.

If you keep adding to the over saturation of course it will be a problem. Vary the items you sell.

Which brings up the next issue: the method of ranking DoH in FFXIV is archaic and needs to be expanded: this will lead to less over saturation of items since crafers won't be hard pressed to sell those 40 jackets they just wasted time on.

The future: the craft revision shows me two things.

- SE is placing more empasis on non stackables
- SE intends to expand ranking methods for DoH since there will no longer be a dependence on parts as a main ranking item.

Many crafters are avoiding saying the truth. Parts are how we rank fast. SE knows this. Every other aspect of leveling in ffxiv is planned for revision with good replacements.

SE knows what they're doing, I'm sure they're smart enough to crunch these numbers as it is their job. Don't go into referencing the old devs failures either :) this will all make sense soon I'm sure

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i really dont think you understand where a few of us crafters are coming from in this late thread right now
we arent saying the changes are bad, we arent arguing against them(least im not)

but there are several VERY ignorant posters, who have no grasp on the market, or crafting at all, who are preaching like things are gonna be all perfect and better now without even understanding a thing at all

also, we are varying the items we sell, we know how the market works, weve been playing it for a while now. those who craft seriously have been continuing to make a profit because we know how it works, those who tried to get in and make a few bucks not understanding gave up cuz they just made random items or mass produced too many that wouldnt sell cuz they didnt understand how the market worked at all

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sorel

OK. Putting aside my opinion (because it is only just that) that you are both overestimating the price drop that will occur ...

... asking an honest question now. Do you all think the fact that a crafter is only able to put a maximum of 20 of any particular Finished Product on the market at one time will either speed up or slow down this extreme price drop that you predicted?

I would also welcome Ferth's opinion on this.

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any crafter who puts up 20 of the same item at any given time is retarded
nuf said