Dear Healers who don't DPS

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Originally Posted by Astral145

And this is why i spend more time fishing than running dungeons.... Just play the game to have fun. If you enjoy speed runs and go all out then use PF or create groups with friends. DF is DF and will have all kinds of players, sometimes you will get players that enjoy going all out and there will be times where you will have players that enjoy "smelling the roses."

No reason to get upset over players that think and play differently than you....

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I'll get upset all I want over the players who think eating all the AoEs is a choice, thank you ;)

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Originally Posted by Kabooa

I'll get upset all I want over the players who think eating all the AoEs is a choice, thank you ;)

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Technically speaking it is a choice. A very bad choice but a choice none the less.

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Originally Posted by Xehmnus

Exactly. It's that kind of elitist douchebaggery that is putting potentially good healers off. "Be considerate" ... >_>

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What I don't seem to get is why people want to play with half of their toolkit and just go afk until someone needs a heal again. I won't complain if a healer does not DPS, not worth the hassle. But I cannot fathom why someone does not want to play at their best potential.

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Originally Posted by Kabooa

I'll get upset all I want over the players who think eating all the AoEs is a choice, thank you ;)

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But they're trying to be considerate by giving you more opportunities to heal! ;)

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Originally Posted by Gunnie

What I don't seem to get is why people want to play with half of their toolkit and just go afk until someone needs a heal again. I won't complain if a healer does not DPS, not worth the hassle. But I cannot fathom why someone does not want to play at their best potential.

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Hey man.

Sometimes you're just feeling lazy.

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Originally Posted by Kabooa

Hey man.

Sometimes you're just feeling lazy.

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And in no other job would anyone find this acceptable. Tank doesn't want to use every GCD available, terrible tank. DPS doesn't want to use every GCD available, terrible dps.

Healers shouldn't get a pass on this.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

And in no other job would anyone find this acceptable. Tank doesn't want to use every GCD available, terrible tank. DPS doesn't want to use every GCD available, terrible dps.

Healers shouldn't get a pass on this.

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While I agree, this happens all the time.... It's just easier to notice on a healer vs. others.

I still think that if the healer has too much idle time, you need to be pulling more things.

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Originally Posted by C-croft

While I agree, this happens all the time.... It's just easier to notice on a healer vs. others.

I still think that if the healer has too much idle time, you need to be pulling more things.

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Dungeons are gated to some extend. This is not always possible.

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Originally Posted by Gunnie

What I don't seem to get is why people want to play with half of their toolkit and just go afk until someone needs a heal again. I won't complain if a healer does not DPS, not worth the hassle. But I cannot fathom why someone does not want to play at their best potential.

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Thinking about it, I feel like some of these people, outside of being pure lazy, just don't care. Been seeing some people playing tanks who clearly don't know what they're doing, and when given advice say they don't really care cause they're only playing the tank for the queue. Doesn't happen too often, but it's a drag when it does. I wonder if some people are doing the same thing with healers.

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Originally Posted by C-croft

I still think that if the healer has too much idle time, you need to be pulling more things.

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It's simpler and more effective if the healer can be bothered to hit something.

Massive pulls are useful only if the tank and healer are up to it and if the DPS are putting out respectable AoE damage; some parties are weak enough on DPS and/or survivability that pulling more mobs actually slows things down.

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Originally Posted by Cynfael

It's simpler and more effective if the healer can be bothered to hit something.

Massive pulls are useful only if the tank and healer are up to it and if the DPS are putting out respectable AoE damage; some parties are weak enough on DPS and/or survivability that pulling more mobs actually slows things down.

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People often forget that. If you pull one or two packs, I'm tossing out AoE DPS. Pull so many packs that spam healing is required? 0 DPS. If the DPS classes can't do good enough AoE to make up the gap, it's a net loss and making things both slower AND more difficult.

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Originally Posted by Cynfael

It's simpler and more effective if the healer can be bothered to hit something.

Massive pulls are useful only if the tank and healer are up to it and if the DPS are putting out respectable AoE damage; some parties are weak enough on DPS and/or survivability that pulling more mobs actually slows things down.

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Originally Posted by Tridus

People often forget that. If you pull one or two packs, I'm tossing out AoE DPS. Pull so many packs that spam healing is required? 0 DPS. If the DPS classes can't do good enough AoE to make up the gap, it's a net loss and making things both slower AND more difficult.

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Devil's advocate: With that said, why as a healer should I be responsible for providing the missing DPS that the DPS can't put out. If they can't figure out the simple AoE rotations, how can I trust them to use their toolkits to do single target damage. Survivability should not be an issue since the least DPS can do is follow mechanics right? I have yet to see terrible DPS be kicked from expert for poor rotations, but a healer should be kicked for not doing DPS? Tanks should be using cooldowns to help me heal them also. Plus most tanks don't like going down to 30%-50% hp. As long as DPS and tank are doing their jobs properly, there shouldn't be any issue with AoE dmg.


I don't believe the above totally myself, because I can pump out between 15% and 20% dmg in a dungeon. However, some of the attitudes in this post alone only make the above excu... statements prevalent. All of the above are true, to an extent, but you really don't see multiple threads about it in the tank or dps forums. Also, it still stands that unless you are parsing, you won't notice the DPS failing as much. One thing of note, there is a DPS role thread right now on why DPS don't bother to AoE in the first place. DPS is a group effort and the tanks and DPS need to do their part before coming in here and complaining. I have run into more than a fair share of terribads as a healer. If I am hitting 20% or more, I know I am not the problem.

Trying to come into the healer forums and pressuring healers into dpsing isn't really solving anything and is just setting up for the next healer dps thread to come out. Just a huge back and forth. Rather than taking a tone, wouldn't it be more helpful to make a thread to help new healers to get accustomed to dpsing in dungeons? Like a nice FAQ and walkthrough? A lot of good ways have been posted in here, but then come in people who want to complain and rag on healers not dpsing. Some of you guys are real pieces of work too. Deny it all you want because, you know who you are, but elitists you are not. If you don't like running into these healers, get out of derp finder.

To my fellow healers, you really should be trying to do what you can. If I am running tank, I don't expect you to ABC or even dps at all. My commendation will go elsewhere though. But as a dpsing healer, it is way more entertaining to dps. Once you get used to dpsing, you won't be able to go back. I find myself falling asleep literally if I just stand there and heal. It makes being a healer more fun once you get used to the stress of juggling. Added bonus for those of you new to healing in SB, no more stance dance with cleric stance. Even if you just start out with a simple Swiftcast+Holy or Gravity, or a miasma II, you can build up from there. Get to know your limits and grow from there.

This is probably not how to do it, but as a SCH, I pre aldo the tank and let them charge through mobs, use a Swiftcast+aldo once their hp starts dropping as we go to the final destination. Give it a little time, because the slightest sliver is just overheal. Once there, I will usually drop a Miasma II and aldo once more. I will also drop Shadowflare once the pull has 'gathered' . Once Swiftcast is up, I usually Swiftcast Miasma+Bio and Bane, followed by a Miasma II. Then maintain dots or broil. If the DPS have been AoEing, I will also drop a couple extra Miasma II's. Throughout this, I also drop Energy Drains and an Aetherflow. You can use your faerie to heal the tank using your Aetherflow stacks to give you a little more leeway. You can start the faerie link before you finish building stacks since you will also be adding stacks during this whole time. Between Lucid, Aetherflow and energy drain, you shouldn't be anywhere close to OOM. Another note, if you find that you have too much MP, dropping a Miasma II isn't a bad thing, even if the dot is still up or the mob is close to dying.

The best part, even if what I said is all wrong, no one can complain becuase something is better than nothing right? :P

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Originally Posted by C-croft

Devil's advocate: With that said, why as a healer should I be responsible for providing the missing DPS that the DPS can't put out.

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I see this a lot, but I rarely ever see anyone suggest that healers are responsible for picking up the slack for poor DPS players. The only responsibility being discussed is the healer's basic responsibility to actually do something in moments while they are not needing to cast heals, which has nothing to do with making up for other party members' poor performance.

The quotes you cited by me and Tridus have nothing to do with providing "missing DPS." Those comments were in response to another poster suggesting that pulling more mobs was the solution to giving idle healers something to do, while it is actually inefficient depending on your group comp.

Mana not used it mana wasted. So either waste it on overheals or waste it on some DPS. Your choice. I understand trepidation with trying to DPS, but there are spells that are instant casts so start with those. Then when you get more comfortable doing what you can.

Eh, I'd recommend starting with a simple but effective same-as-GCD cast time spell. If things go south during the cast you can at least stop it, get your GCD back, and start a heal.

As an example - White Mage: Aero 3 is a great spell to get used to timings on when you can / can't do stuff. It is literally your most efficient / strongest AoE spell for the GCD.

Scholars get a lot of buffer zone through Adlo, Excog, and the Faerie, and generally don't have any issues doing Miasma -> Bio -> Bane / Shadow Flare.

Can't speak for Astro, haven't played.

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Originally Posted by C-croft

Rather than taking a tone, wouldn't it be more helpful to make a thread to help new healers to get accustomed to dpsing in dungeons? Like a nice FAQ and walkthrough?

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Fun fact, I posted some video guides here at the release of HW showing how to do 1000 DPS as a SCH in the expert dungeons (This was in full Asuran gear pre Gordias normal mode). I got a temp ban for my efforts.

I'd love to do the same showing how I push 2.5-3k+ across the current dungeons *cough* but ya, I don't know if it'd be allowed now or what since the rules here are kind of vague in some regards =(

Good times =/

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Originally Posted by C-croft

While I agree, this happens all the time.... It's just easier to notice on a healer vs. others.

I still think that if the healer has too much idle time, you need to be pulling more things.

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Many of the pure healer crowd can't actually handle the extra workload. Back in Heavensward, I had a general rule if my co-healer didn't start with Cleric on, I defaulted to DPS mode and only bounced in when necessary. Why? If they weren't going to DPS during the opening phase, where minimal damage goes out, I didn't expect they would period. I also wanted to experiment with just how many pure healers were actually good since that was often the go to defense around here. Turns out a good many weren't. Despite healing being their only responsibility, they couldn't adapt. Had one even try lecturing me on stance dancing after I left him to handle A12N just until adds came up and buckled quickly. Ironically, he was fully ACC melded and should have been the one DPSing, not me.

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Originally Posted by Sebazy

Fun fact, I posted some video guides here at the release of HW showing how to do 1000 DPS as a SCH in the expert dungeons (This was in full Asuran gear pre Gordias normal mode). I got a temp ban for my efforts.

I'd love to do the same showing how I push 2.5-3k+ across the current dungeons *cough* but ya, I don't know if it'd be allowed now or what since the rules here are kind of vague in some regards =(

Good times =/

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Wait, what? Temp ban?!

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Originally Posted by C-croft

Devil's advocate

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Because it takes teamwork to make the dream work. Why is this so controversial?

You are doing group content. You do what it takes to win. This is the problem with MMO communities. The first question that pops into our heads when something goes wrong (or even just may potentially go wrong) is, "whom can I blame?" instead of, "what can I do to resolve this?"

I was doing NM OV1 the other day. The off-tank d/c'd. Twin Bolt came and I wasn't sure the MT could survive. So I popped Benison on myself and waltzed my happy healer [buttocks] in front of the boss and took a bolt to the face. The next time, healer #2 was nice enough to give me a big, fat shield of her own accord, because she knew what I was going to do. But with the attitude you're advocating, I should have just let the tank die and the group wipe, because you know, tanking's "not my job"!

Ridiculous. It really is.

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Originally Posted by Trunks

Because it takes teamwork to make the dream work. Why is this so controversial?

You are doing group content. You do what it takes to win. This is the problem with MMO communities. The first question that pops into our heads when something goes wrong (or even just may potentially go wrong) is, "whom can I blame?" instead of, "what can I do to resolve this?"

I was doing NM OV1 the other day. The off-tank d/c'd. Twin Bolt came and I wasn't sure the MT could survive. So I popped Benison on myself and waltzed my happy healer [buttocks] in front of the boss and took a bolt to the face. The next time, healer #2 was nice enough to give me a big, fat shield of her own accord, because she knew what I was going to do. But with the attitude you're advocating, I should have just let the tank die and the group wipe, because you know, tanking's "not my job"!

Ridiculous. It really is.

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Do you know what devil's advocate means?

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Originally Posted by Trunks

But with the attitude you're advocating, I should have just let the tank die and the group wipe, because you know, tanking's "not my job"!

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This is simple... The healer's primary job is to heal. Doing damage is definitely very helpful and preferred, but their DPS means absolutely nothing if I'm dead. And that's something I see way too much. 0 heals while I needed literally every cooldown I have, but the healer is right up the DPS's ass in AOE damage.

If the healer isn't DPSing, just deal with it and move on. The tank not dying is kind of the top priority. Once that healer is more comfortable with keeping everyone alive, THEN worry about the damage they do. You have to build skill, it doesn't just come naturally.

Yeah, but not everyone will want to play the way you want them to. You dps on your healer?
Good for you, nobody asked. Throwing a stone or a malefic isn't groundbreaking. Or those aoes that eat up mp.
Personally, if the tank's hp is flying to China and back, dpsing won't even be in my immediate list of things that I should be focusing on. Tank not dying > getting cast interrupted because the mob you were targeting died anyways.
If the tank isn't laying on Death's doormat, then yeah, I'll dps a bit, but stop if it's draining my mp.
inb4"nobodyaskedwhatyoudoeitherhurr

Always this over the top crap by people. Nobody dies often because healers DPS too much, you're just a walking hyperbole. In my four years of playing this game of tanking a lot, I've maybe died twice due to a healer tunnelvisioning while DPSing. There is always room to DPS, even with garbage tanks. I've seen plenty of them if you know your class, your cooldowns, then you can DPS a lot. You seldom see tanks that are so terrible that you have to heal full time. More often than bad tanks, I probably see bad healers. It's no wonder you can barely DPS when your regen is not on 90% of the time and you don't use Tetra or Essential Dignity. It's no wonder at all.

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Originally Posted by rockint

This is simple... The tank not dying is kind of the top priority

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And killing enemies is priority two.

If the tank isn't dying, move to priority two.

Clearly, you've never had to heal a tank wearing half cloth, and a couple of lvl 1 accessories, in a mid-level instance, nearly getting two-three shot, while losing agro constantly.
If you do, tell me how that goes!

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Originally Posted by Astrololol

Clearly, you've never had to heal a tank wearing half cloth, and a couple of lvl 1 accessories, in a mid-level instance, nearly getting two-three shot, while losing agro constantly.
If you do, tell me how that goes!

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If by mid-level you mean 30-40, I would just let the tank die and have the DPS tank at that point. A DPS that has mildly relevant gear can take the hits, on single pack pulls, without too much heal spamming. Sometimes it's better to cut your losses and rely on your DPS to win the day. Plus you would probably have to babysit their HP less than the tank, giving you time to toss up dots at least. I wouldn't recommend it if it's your first time in the dungeon, but once you have a good grasp on it, it's not even hard.

As a side note, 3 dps 1 heal runs are super fun. Give 'em a try!

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Originally Posted by Astrololol

Clearly, you've never had to heal a tank wearing half cloth, and a couple of lvl 1 accessories, in a mid-level instance, nearly getting two-three shot, while losing agro constantly.
If you do, tell me how that goes!

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I know I won't have to heal a tank like that, because I've removed them from the party after explaining to them why it's important to wear appropriate gear for group content. :)

I treat DPS like alcohol, enjoy responsibly. That said like alcohol it's not for everyone.

The only thing I advocate for is that people try. If it doesn't go so well you can lay off and try again at another time. The barriers of your comfort zone are only as rigid as you make them and if you lean against them once and a while you might be surprised at how far they will stretch in the end!

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Originally Posted by Starflake

Always this over the top crap by people. Nobody dies often because healers DPS too much,.

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I've been in groups with healers who let me (as a tank) get down to 10% and then scramble to get a Tetra or Benediction on me when I'm ~1 hit from death. I HATE it when I get those kinds of healers. Ugh.

And yes, I HAVE been killed in dungeons where this has happened, both lowbie dungeons and Lv50+ stuff, and yes I was using my cooldowns. I had this one dungeon at Lv60+ where I almost died, I was at like 2k and I mashed my Hallowed Ground barely survived, and saw a Benediction a moment later. Well, HG wears off and I again go way down I'm looking at my HP meter, everything's on cooldown.... 50%... 30%... glance up at the party window, he's casting Stone IV. 10%.... he starts casting Cure II. haha. yeah right. I had already blown my MP on Clemency because the healer did not get the hint that I do NOT like being below 50% at all times.

Aaaaaaand, *SPLAT*. I'm dead. And the healer eats dirt about 3-5 seconds later.

This has happened more often than I would like. It shouldn't even happen once, to be quite honest.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

This has happened more often than I would like. It shouldn't even happen once, to be quite honest.

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I'm sorry for your terrible luck, but the behavior you describe is so awful that it has only a thin connection to this discussion.

Prior to 4.0, bad healers (and the actual handful who were either learning or suffering from some of the worst latency issues ever) would blame either their tank-murder or slacking off on Cleric Stance. Post 4.0, anyone who is letting their tank die while they DPS instead of heal is either just not good at the game or is falling asleep at the wheel.

Weaving DPS is now effortless and requires little-to-no-planning. If they do somehow overreach, all healers have a minimum of one oGCD tool to cover an "oops-the-tank-is-actually-going-to-die-in-the-next-GCD" moment. Healer DPS is definitely not the culprit here.

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Originally Posted by Cynfael

Weaving DPS is now effortless and requires little-to-no-planning. If they do somehow overreach, all healers have a minimum of one oGCD tool to cover an "oops-the-tank-is-actually-going-to-die-in-the-next-GCD" moment. Healer DPS is definitely not the culprit here.

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No, but yet the stigma behind not DPSing enough causes terrible healers to overreach more often.

A terrible healer who wasn't pressured to DPS past his limit of skill might still keep the tank alive, but when they try to weave in DPS spells when they are not skilled or geared enough to do so, you might end up with a wipe or three on your hands.

Same goes for multi-pulling for tanks -- all tanks are pressured, sometimes coerced into multipulling when impatient ranged DPS classes will run forward and grab more mobs if they think the tank is going too slow. However, if the tank is of lesser skill or undergeared, this usually leads to disaster when more mobs are pulled than what he can actually handle.

This is why I don't like the ridiculous pressure that is placed on both behaviors -- it simply isn't NECESSARY to the run to do it. It just isn't. In fact, I would posit that SE actually designed dungeons to NOT be multi-pulled. If SE expected tanks to pull those groups, they would have made the groups link to each other naturally. If SE expected healers to maintain a set DPS, they would have made more enrages, and existing enrages tighter.

As for enrages in Savage Omega... sorry, but that's more players running it at a lower Item-Level than was intended. They're entering the instance whilst undergeared. Plain and simple. Yoshi-P said something to this effect recently, that healer DPS is absolutely NOT taken into consideration when designing content, BUT if you want to run it whilst under-geared then you may be forced to have your healers DPS to avoid the enrage timers.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

As for enrages in Savage Omega... sorry, but that's more players running it at a lower Item-Level than was intended. They're entering the instance whilst undergeared. Plain and simple. Yoshi-P said something to this effect recently, that healer DPS is absolutely NOT taken into consideration when designing content, BUT if you want to run it whilst under-geared then you may be forced to have your healers DPS to avoid the enrage timers.

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The part before this I'm skipping because my in-game experience differs; I don't perceive any harmful, pervasive pressure that healers or tanks do X or Y in random duties.

As for the Savage part, I'm not sure if you're meaning to reply to me or not, because my only recent reference to Savage and enrage timers was in the other thread and not at all in reference to healers pushing DPS to clear while under expected ilvl.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

This is why I don't like the ridiculous pressure that is placed on both behaviors -- it simply isn't NECESSARY to the run to do it. It just isn't. In fact, I would posit that SE actually designed dungeons to NOT be multi-pulled. If SE expected tanks to pull those groups, they would have made the groups link to each other naturally. If SE expected healers to maintain a set DPS, they would have made more enrages, and existing enrages tighter.

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It also isn't necessary for dps to use their proper rotation, but does that make it okay for them to spam only a single button? I've had several expert roulettes where, as a tank, I was either first or second in dps. I even once had a mnk in temple of the fist that couldn't do more than 1.4k dps on a boss or 2k on trash pulls, which is much lower than what he should've been doing in HW. I would say the biggest reason you see them called out less than healers who don't dps is because you don't need a 3rd party tool to tell when a healer is overhealing like crazy or standing idle.

Pretty sure most healers can dps, they just wont lol myself included when ever im tired or feeling lazy i just don't bother to dps. I don't mind it either way since you really don't know if that healer is being just being lazy rather than bad.

You also can't argue that healers are (requiered) to use all their kit. The only kit that's (required) for a healer to use is their healing kit. As a DPS class you are (required) to use your entire offensive kit because damage is what your role is required to do.

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Originally Posted by RulerOfPotaoes

Pretty sure most healers can dps, they just wont lol myself included when ever im tired or feeling lazy i just don't bother to dps. I don't mind it either way since you really don't know if that healer is being just being lazy rather than bad.

You also can't argue that healers are (requiered) to use all their kit. The only kit that's (required) for a healer to use is their healing kit. As a DPS class you are (required) to use your entire offensive kit because damage is what your role is required to do.

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If a tank is lazy, he will get scolded. If DPS is lazy, he will get scolded. If a healer is lazy it's fine?

If only using your healing spells, you're not using the toolkit SE gave you. Selectively only using the healing part, you're not pulling your weight. if you're new to a dungeon and you actually speak up, I'm fine with a healer not doing much/any DPS until he or she feels confortable. If you're known to the dungeon, you should always be casting something. A heal when it's required, a DPS spell when healing is not required.

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Originally Posted by Gunnie

If a tank is lazy, he will get scolded. If DPS is lazy, he will get scolded. If a healer is lazy it's fine?

If only using your healing spells, you're not using the toolkit SE gave you. Selectively only using the healing part, you're not pulling your weight. if you're new to a dungeon and you actually speak up, I'm fine with a healer not doing much/any DPS until he or she feels confortable. If you're known to the dungeon, you should always be casting something. A heal when it's required, a DPS spell when healing is not required.

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I don't think you understand the concept that healers are only required i repeate required to use their healing kit. A healer only spaming regens should be called out but not a healer using their healing kit. Healer is the only job that Can do 2 roles and only 1 of those is Required.

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Originally Posted by Maeka

This has happened more often than I would like. It shouldn't even happen once, to be quite honest.

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Obviously it should. What's the point of the game if you're meant to have no chances of losing ? It's pointless.

It's because you have to keep hitting those armies of HP bags with no interesting interaction that players are playing like idiots. Who likes fighting trashmob for 10 minutes long anyway ? That's boring as fuck, no one does. Every one was skipping them until every single dungeon was gated every damn pull. It's the fault of healer healing to less, on DPSing to less, or tanks pulling too much or not enough, its a matter of borings dungeon that you have to repeat all day long.

All those pages of people blaming every one while it would be a non-issue if only entering a dungeon wouldn't be chore to begin with.

There's no reason for a healer to literally wait for the next heal. Hell, even tossing in an Aero or a Combust helps the party out, and a Swiftcasted Gravity or Holy really doesn't take long.

Keeping your health up is our top priority though,
and DPS should only be done when there's a window. But when there is, there really isn't a reason not to.

Healer dps is now a thing thanks to dev....

A healer who does zero to no dps is a enrage no question ask

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Originally Posted by Maeka

I've been in groups with healers who let me (as a tank) get down to 10% and then scramble to get a Tetra or Benediction on me when I'm ~1 hit from death. I HATE it when I get those kinds of healers. Ugh.

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If the healer knows what they're doing (ie. doesn't take risks with unlucky crits), this is actually the most effective way to play a healer. When I'm on WHM and I'm planning to Bene (or even Tetra / Assize), I keep the tank targeted during Holy spam and wait as long as possible to use the heal to get the most out of it and to DPS for as long as possible. But again, this requires for the healer to know the tank will live through, and in the cases you've described they haven't (obviously, since you died).

I also play tank and personally appreciate healers playing effectively instead of constantly holding my hand. I also gladly allow them to make occasional mistakes and let me die while they're practicing effective healing. :)

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Originally Posted by Maeka

As for enrages in Savage Omega... sorry, but that's more players running it at a lower Item-Level than was intended. They're entering the instance whilst undergeared. Plain and simple.

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I think you've misunderstood what you've read about this. The fights aren't balanced for their item level requirement, but for higher item level than what is available for players when the fights are added to the game. So all players are forced to do the fights "undergeared" as you say, unless they wait weeks, perhaps even months before even trying them (unless that's what you're suggesting?). Right now, OS4 at least requires healer DPS from even groups with the top players in the world. If you're playing with "only" good DDs in the best gear available for them right now, you'll still need healer DPS for other floors too (OS3 at least, probably OS2 too). And if your healers aren't doing DPS in Savage, they are making their DDs and tanks work at or close to their optimal maximum performance while the healers themselves aren't working even around half of that level, which is not something many (if any) groups would be willing to accept.

I wish people would stop spreading the extremely misleading idea that healers wouldn't need to DPS in Savage, it's just so very far from truth when you actually look at the party DPS requirements and compare those to what's possible at current item level from tanks and DDs.