For all those complaining about stale dungeons: from a beta player perspective

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Originally Posted by brinn12

1 - Most of my dungeon runs via Duty Finder have always been the opposite of speedruns. I fail to understand where the notion of "the community wants speedruns" comes from, when some players are still bringing Endwalker gear into Expert roulettes. And if Square Enix catered to speedrunners, they wouldn't allow that to happen, or would start designing dungeons with real DPS checks.

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Could be a DC thing but on Aether when I was on a much more potato PC I would get delayed a bit as the tank and the dps were already off ahead of me trying to pull things. You see that sprint button get hit immediately as soon as the gate drops and people will hover by the exit of a boss to start sprinting out after them. The Aether community definitely wants their daily dungeon roulettes to take as little time as possible and have for years.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

Could be a DC thing but on Aether when I was on a much more potato PC I would get delayed a bit as the tank and the dps were already off ahead of me trying to pull things. You see that sprint button get hit immediately as soon as the gate drops and people will hover by the exit of a boss to start sprinting out after them. The Aether community definitely wants their daily dungeon roulettes to take as little time as possible and have for years.

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I don't consider this speedrunning at all. These people have done hundreds of dungeons, possibly thousands. It's only natural that they walk soon after a pack dies, or sprint. There's nothing else to do other than to walk forward.

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Originally Posted by brinn12

I don't consider this speedrunning at all. These people have done hundreds of dungeons, possibly thousands. It's only natural that they walk soon after a pack dies, or sprint. There's nothing else to do other than to walk forward.

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there is yes! walk in the wall!! ok but seriously I do agree sadly

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Originally Posted by Basteala

God this. So much this. But that would require effort. And money. Money that needs to go to the next blockchain dontcha know.

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Let us return to the good old days where a sprout would pull into Oblivion and make the healers sweat bullets. Now that's how we feel alive again!
Running Stone Vigil as a fledgling healer back in the day had my heart pumping when baby tanks without any magic mit would pull the dragons, the sprites and somehow make sure they'd always me out of my line of sight. I sure learned quickly LOL

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Originally Posted by Xelanar

I don't really mind linear dungeons.
I do mind how uninteresting trash is (always has been). No mechanics, nothing to look out for, because whatever few mechanics do exist, barely hurt at all.

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Same. While I'd appreciate the aesthetic variance of having a less linear dungeon (maybe even, hell, some backtracking [away from a boulder or the like after baiting the enemy to set it off so that you can use it to break through a gate below or whatnot], some path randomization, etc.), the larger dungeon problem for me is just that (A) all trash feels basically the same unthreatening mush and (B) bosses end up feeling too same-y, largely because they almost always amp the frequency of mechanics instead of the damage, making each have a dully slow/barren start instead of just a comparatively forgiving one.

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Originally Posted by Basteala

I understand why dungeon's don't have exploration anymore.

But what's with their obsession with artificial walls? Let us have boss to boss pulls like the old days you cowards!

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The walls literally exist because back in the old days when dungeons didn't have walls and you could pull all the way to the boss room there were tanks that would LITERALLY pull EVERYTHING regardless of their healer ability and would over pull the room. Healers cried because they couldn't keep up, Tanks cried because they would die. Walls started appearing to STOP this behavior.

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Originally Posted by KitiaraIornsight

The walls literally exist because back in the old days when dungeons didn't have walls and you could pull all the way to the boss room there were tanks that would LITERALLY pull EVERYTHING regardless of their healer ability and would over pull the room. Healers cried because they couldn't keep up, Tanks cried because they would die. Walls started appearing to STOP this behavior.

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There's a rather deep challenge here because on one hand, it creates a situation where there's no opportunity for skill expression in the playerbase. On the other, you create a situation where some people (especially those who may be 'vacationing in a role' to fill needed gaps in the tank/healer population) are unable to match the skill of others because they're simply not as experienced in playing that role. There shouldn't be a 'punishment' of being perceived as bad if you are trying to stop people from having 30m queue times.

The solution is what we've been missing for a very long time, which is scalable dungeon content, but people have been screaming for that for years (some instantiation of a 'Mythic+' equivalent) and we're still met with cricket sounds.

Something has to give here, and hopefully sooner rather than later, to just overall 'revitalize' dungeon content in this game. And it really comes with a fundamental need for gear to have scaling item levels. In the meantime, the best I think we can hope for is simply some variety in layout. There's no reason we could not have a dungeon with branching paths, optional bosses, variable bosses, etc. We're finally going to see them try this out in the next 24m, so hopefully that is well received.

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Originally Posted by brinn12

I don't consider this speedrunning at all. These people have done hundreds of dungeons, possibly thousands. It's only natural that they walk soon after a pack dies, or sprint. There's nothing else to do other than to walk forward.

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Taking as little time as possible in a dungeon is what the community views as speedrunning. That includes skipping mobs where possible. Not sure what else your personal definition might be.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

Taking as little time as possible in a dungeon is what the community views as speedrunning. That includes skipping mobs where possible. Not sure what else your personal definition might be.

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Pushing the forward keybind in a dungeon and completing it in "as little time as possible" are different concepts. One comes naturally when you do hundreds of dungeons, and the other requires decent gear and job knowledge. The actual dungeon speedruns are much faster than you think, and definitely not replicated by the Duty Finder.

Nah there is no reason to do dungeons asides from roulette. they are one shots nothing more nothing less. Its not like there are special spawns, special tasks that take place, no hunts, no adventures quests to be had in dungeons. They did away with that. its a very straight linear mmo meaning you have no reason to go back because there is no content for higher levels that takes place in satasha, tik tok dungeon, ishgard when you're level 70,80,90,100. its just roulette. Variants are one thing and they last for a month or two then die off because they simply do not update loot table.