60fps cap for 2.0?

I don't even know where to begin.

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Originally Posted by Valmonte

He's quite right if there are no artificial limits your GPU would literally Fry itself by overload, there will always be a cap.

Current generations Cards Can reproduce upto 400+ frames a Second without reaching Maximum GPU Limit @ around 500 Frames the Cards GPU will be under 100% load, no GPU can last more than a few minutes under a 100% load they will always burn themselves out usually by way of V.Current Leakage or solder balls melting. also keep in mind that 400+ frames a second can only be achieved by Artificial means with no over head (texture's,AA,AF, TESS, etc etc).

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The artificial limits you're talking about to prevent overheating is something the drivers and GPU firmware takes care of. Looking at just framerate when it comes to a graphics card's power output is just plain wrong. It is a combination of graphical detail, resolution, framerate and a bunch of other things. The total amount of processing a card needs to do is what determines how much heat it generates. If I lower my graphics settings so that i'm able to do 120fps, that makes fuck-all of a difference for the graphics card as far as heat generation is concerned.

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Originally Posted by TheRac25

wrong, for instance quake 3 was frame capped by default, consistent frame rate is far more important than 60+ framerate in professional play

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Quake 3 arena was frame capped because a consistent framerate is desirable for the players, and because at the time the game was released, most computers could not give a consistent 120fps framerate at good graphical settings.

There is no limit in the Q3A graphics engine when it comes to how many frames the game can render per second. I actually downloaded the game just now and did a timedemo with 864 FPS average, and I was CPU limited, not GPU limited. With an i7, I probably would have broken 1000 fps. There is no automatism in high framerate and graphics card overheating. Just because I could, I also tested crysis and got to around 300 fps there, without getting a higher load on my GPU than FF14 gives me at 50fps. Just drop the entire framerate-overheat argument and admit you were wrong.

There is absolutely no hardware-related reason why FF14 can't run at 120fps, or even more.

I ran a looping timedemo on UT'99 at 600fps+ for hours, my card generate less heat than XIV at 60 FPS.

Thank you.

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Originally Posted by Laraul

A few months ago everytime I would start FFXIV, after a few minutes my system would spontaneously power completely down. Turns out some wood dust was preventing the GPU fan from spinning up. At idle the temperature was 95C. A fail safe* exists to prevent irreversible damage to the hardware components.

How did I fix it? I gave the fan a light tap to get it spinning. It's been working fine since. And this was SEVERAL DAYS with the GPU running at 95C. So I don't believe FFXIV is capable of "frying" your graphics card, nor is any other game.

And somewhat related, just because your GPU gets a little warm does not mean the game is poorly optimized. There is no correlation between how optimized a game engine is and how hot your GPU gets.

* "Fail safe" is a term I coined up, it may not necessarily be the technical term used officially

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Yup, correct.... it's something that has been around since at least the days of the 7800GTX, and I know cause I remember my 7800GTX shutting down as it got too hot. (I still probably have the card somewhere in my computer component box. lol)

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Originally Posted by Molly_Millions

and do you realize how many people complained about optimization during the beta, right? Yet other complaining about how they could fry an egg on their video card? limiting frame-rates is part of optimization.

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Yeah thats because the engine is diabolical, lets see any game I play on my Alienware laptop doesn't heat up so much, yet when I play XIV I honestly can't play on my laptop because it has burnt my legs in the past LOL.

I was just saying I do remember the game being smoother in general to me, I would like it to be uncapped or at least 100fps for 2.0, 60 I can cope with, but dropouts to 45 fps is no joy for me, just feels lack luster and generally meh with regards to movement and navigating the gui.

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Originally Posted by Dragon

At the end of the day, there's no reason to enforce an FPS cap. PERIOD!

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Maybe not, but you'd have to be rich or stupid not to put an fps cap on any game you're playing. Your computer has a limit as to how much fps it can keep up with consistently. Any drops in fps will be very noticeable, even at 120+. Smoothness is a function of consistency, not necessarily how high the fps count is. If you don't put a cap, your gameplay will suffer terribly due to the constant spikes in fps. Ideally you want a level your computer can run with without dropping significantly. Any higher and it will actually appear worse.

Of course if you're running a supercomputer you don't need a cap for any game out right now. But enforcing a cap prevents fps noobs from experiencing crappy gameplay due to bad game settings. Most ppl assume more fps = good, when it's only good if your computer can stay up there consistently. And given that the vast majority of computer owners are ignorant about their hardware, an fps cap keeps ppl from being dissatisfied with your product. It's all about the benjamins.


EDIT: This isn't even talking about how much optimization a game would have to go through in order to account for lack of an fps cap. I imagine getting any game to run 120+fps without any significant drops would be quite costly in terms of hardware, equipment, and man hours. Especially with an MMO, which has to account for mass amounts of people congested into relatively small maps. I don't think any company is going to drop that kind of coin without charging you more for the game. And i'd rather not pay for that, considering I can't even use it.

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Originally Posted by Lux_Rayna

Maybe not, but you'd have to be rich or stupid not to put an fps cap on any game you're playing. Your computer has a limit as to how much fps it can keep up with consistently. Any drops in fps will be very noticeable, even at 120+. Smoothness is a function of consistency, not necessarily how high the fps count is. If you don't put a cap, your gameplay will suffer terribly due to the constant spikes in fps. Ideally you want a level your computer can run with without dropping significantly. Any higher and it will actually appear worse.

Of course if you're running a supercomputer you don't need a cap for any game out right now. But enforcing a cap prevents fps noobs from experiencing crappy gameplay due to bad game settings. Most ppl assume more fps = good, when it's only good if your computer can stay up there consistently. And given that the vast majority of computer owners are ignorant about their hardware, an fps cap keeps ppl from being dissatisfied with your product. It's all about the benjamins.


EDIT: This isn't even talking about how much optimization a game would have to go through in order to account for lack of an fps cap. I imagine getting any game to run 120+fps without any significant drops would be quite costly in terms of hardware, equipment, and man hours. Especially with an MMO, which has to account for mass amounts of people congested into relatively small maps. I don't think any company is going to drop that kind of coin without charging you more for the game. And i'd rather not pay for that, considering I can't even use it.

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If a person's computer cannot run a game in 1080p past 60FPS, an enforced FPS cap is still useless. There is nothing in game code that can force a video card to run a game at an FPS higher than what it can run to begin with and the lack of an FPS cap isn't going to cause a game to run more than what the video card can handle. It simply does not happen, period.

Now, if people want an option to turn on an FPS cap, that's different. But don't you dare try to sit there and tell me that I should not be allowed to run it above xyzFPS just because someone else can't. That's absolutely stupid, and not to mention that because of fail-safe software & hardware design, it's actually impossible for the average user to burn their video card (it takes someone that knows how to bypass certain coding).

FYI, I do use a 60FPS cap on all games I play on my PC when and where there is a choice to. Even when emulating old games, unless I want to play in turbo-mode, I use no more than 60FPS.

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Originally Posted by Dragon

If a person's computer cannot run a game in 1080p past 60FPS, an enforced FPS cap is still useless. There is nothing in game code that can force a video card to run a game at an FPS higher than what it can run to begin with and the lack of an FPS cap isn't going to cause a game to run more than what the video card can handle. It simply does not happen, period.

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I'm not talking about "handle", i'm talking about consistency. Handling 60 fps is a lot different than running a smooth 60 fps. For example, you can probably run higher than 60 fps, but you optionally choose to cap it at 60...because you know you can run it silky smooth at that cap. The average person would have no idea. An FPS cap just prevents the average person from becoming dissatisfied with gameplay due to poor settings. I'm not saying it *should* be enforced, i'm just taking a stab in the dark as to why they enforce it.

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Now, if people want an option to turn on an FPS cap, that's different. But don't you dare try to sit there and tell me that I should not be allowed to run it above xyzFPS just because someone else can't. That's absolutely stupid, and not to mention that because of fail-safe software & hardware design, it's actually impossible for the average user to burn their video card (it takes someone that knows how to bypass certain coding).

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Well you should be allowed to, I wasn't trying to say you shouldn't. Just some theorymoning about why companies cap them at all. They should just link fps settings to auto-detect, maybe less people would choose poor caps that way.

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FYI, I do use a 60FPS cap on all games I play on my PC when and where there is a choice to. Even when emulating old games, unless I want to play in turbo-mode, I use no more than 60FPS.

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I do too actually, though i've never tried with a higher cap. I'm 99% certain I couldn't run a smooth 120 though so i wont even bother.

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Originally Posted by Lux_Rayna

I'm not talking about "handle", i'm talking about consistency. Handling 60 fps is a lot different than running a smooth 60 fps. For example, you can probably run higher than 60 fps, but you optionally choose to cap it at 60...because you know you can run it silky smooth at that cap. The average person would have no idea. An FPS cap just prevents the average person from becoming dissatisfied with gameplay due to poor settings. I'm not saying it *should* be enforced, i'm just taking a stab in the dark as to why they enforce it.

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Well if that's why they want to enforce it, they should still give the ability to turn it off. I really don't mind the default settings themselves not being to my liking, just the inability to change them, and SE has done good so far on that end I'll admit.

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They should just link fps settings to auto-detect, maybe less people would choose poor caps that way.

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And/or use auto-detect to give info on which settings are going to work at what FPS rating .

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I do too actually, though i've never tried with a higher cap. I'm 99% certain I couldn't run a smooth 120 though so i wont even bother.

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Nah, I probably could get it run smoothly at 120FPS, but that'd be such a huge graphical downgrade, probably worse than ever getting FFXI to run at 999FPS.

Heya guys!

While the details have not yet been decided, we are planning to make it possible to select from 30fps, 60fps and uncapped settings. ^_^