Any hopes to EVER get 8+ man content?

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Originally Posted by Mychael

I rarely had an alliance of useless people...

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The "alliance of useless people" I was referring to is... lets say you had 26 people show up for dynamis. 18 people get in the main alliance, generally your core members. You form up your main alliance to peak effectiveness, but that leaves 8 people to form the remaining "alliance". The remainders were generally people that didn't have a lot of jobs leveled, or were just in general not very necessary. The external alliance often didn't have many of the luxuries that the main alliance did; you'd rarely see bard/cor, sometimes not even a decent healer, and you would always miss out on whatever important things were said in party chat. As I was often the token thief ("we don't care what you do, just tag Treasure Hunter on everything"), I know firsthand that being in that external alliance was boring as hell.

That said, yes, two party content where they both go their own ways and do their own things while assisting each other sounds great! I realize that my complaints about large-group content are often things that could have been corrected possibly by better leadership, but I just don't want to see another Dynamis rehash where have your group can be half-asleep and still do their job.

tl;dr : I'm all for larger group content, just make it active. Fun is not doing nothing but switching targets and mindlessly mowing down monsters.

I like that Idea but at the same time, it can be difficult to manage a good 8 man team for thing like moogle. I really hope what ever they come out with is tough though. Hopefully crystal towers is similar to CoP in the time it takes to unlock as well as difficulty.

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Originally Posted by Coglin

So what? Group content has the same effect on people that prefere larger then group content.
Personally I would like to see all end game stuff require 10+ players.

I really have to ask, if your for larger raids, why is your only post here, one that does nothing but argues against it. Makes absolutely no sense.

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My only post here is this because it is the only place where I thought I could contribute anything. I find larger groups nice because it allows for some more intricate design of encounters and lets me do things that feel more epic in nature. Both of these points have already been made in the forum pretty well.

I find when discussing these issues it is helpful to look at these questions from both sides to make sure we have a clear idea of both the pros and cons. The so what is that i think the pro large group content side of arguments tends to ignore the other sides valid concerns. I think the pros outweigh the cons because it allows for a massive feeling that can't really be gotten in many other game types. However I find the assumption that it in no way harms group players because "they aren't forced to do it" to be wrong. It seems you'd agree considering your statement here is that it is true but that current design does the same thing to people that want large group content. It is quite possible that I read into your statement an assumption that I've seen on MMO boards before, but you were not making yourself.

I just don't want to see the endgame in this turn into wow style raids. I'd like it to be more like XI with a wide variety of content with comparable gear. Personally I had more fun with assault and nyzul than I ever did with dynamis... But the dynamis story line was one of my favorites.

Well Nyzul was fun yet mechanisms were pretty simple and it was only about rinse and repeat. Nyzul isn't a raid either. I don't call a <30 minutes mission with 6 players a Raid. Hell 30 minutes was only if your party was really bad or if you were really unlucky. Most of Nyzul runs were ~20minutes.

Same goes for Assault, lot of them were doable with 3 players (Red versus Blue spam anyone?) and could be cleared really fast. These are mini-mission made for casuals. Easy and fast. I'm not saying it's a bad thing, I'm just saying that this is completely different from large scale raid as other MMO have.

We need both kind of content. Fast and accessible content + large scale content that require a dedicated group of players.

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Originally Posted by IStolzI

I just don't want to see the endgame in this turn into wow style raids.

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Okay, make it like EQOA style raids.

There are tons of games that have had great and/or successfull endgame content before anyone ever heard of WoW.

64 man Dynamis GO

No reason there can't be single party/light party, and multi party content. Both can coexist

Yea it is different and different people prefer different things. The problem is when one type starts to give substantially better gear than other types. IF the game can find a balance like XI, fine. That's what I loved about XI.

But if it's going to continue the trend that every new kind of content trumps all previous content, I'd rather the content stay 8 man or maybe 16 man groups. Yes hopefully the days of being required to tell friends "I can't go out tonight, I have a raid and I'll get points taken if I don't show" on a saturday are over.

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Originally Posted by Coglin

So what?

No one is forcing you to do raid content.

We need some raids. Its not really a raid if a party can manage it, then its, by definition, group content.

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This is true, I was just stating my preference, like everyone else in the thread. I fully expect them to do large scale content, it's just not my cup of tea. I did the early 40 and 24-person raids in WoW and LotRO (I don't remember what size it was for LotRO...20 maybe? The Rift and the Watcher, whatever size those were) and didn't like them much at all, whereas I always had fun with the smaller party content.