They don’t have too help based on SE terms, doesn’t matter if he has a mentor status or not. To also point out he was there to help by queuing up. Him being present in the mentor roulette is a form of mentorship help. So knowing what he was getting in to he still queues for the roulette.Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladinleeds
3.2 Disruption. You may not in any way disrupt or interfere with the Game experience of other players, including the disruption of Square Enix's computers and servers.
If the disruption rule applies to all players then the mentor is innocent. SE will have to play judge on this one, but can’t since we’re only getting OP’s side of the story only way the mentor would be in trouble is if they harassed another player and there was text proof. Being a bad player also can be reported.
The mentor has every right to say no when they want to because it would disrupt their game play experience. Doesn’t matter what we think, that’s SE’s rules.
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06-15-2018, 02:27 PMLalafellDown
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06-15-2018, 02:40 PMKeridwynBolded for empahsis by telling a sprout they 'weren't worth his time' the mentor became not worth their hat. He shouldn't be banned from the game but his enrollment in the mentor program shouldn't continue.Quote:
Originally Posted by LalafellDown
Also by putting on the hat and using mentor duty finder he accepted the role of 'mentor' which comes with the mechanic of 'sprouts may ask you questions'. No disruption of play occurred if the sprout choses to do so. It's a risk he took going in that he might be called on to explain something. -
06-15-2018, 02:40 PMPentheaRight so that means literally anyone who uses the Duty Finder tool is a mentor because their mere presence supposedly fills this role. Including sprouts queuing for their first instance.Quote:
Originally Posted by LalafellDown
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06-15-2018, 02:43 PMOdstarva
I think someone likes the crown emblem while not adhering to what it entails...
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06-15-2018, 03:19 PMSotarisYou mean like 90% of the mentors in this game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Odstarva
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06-15-2018, 03:22 PMNephthysVasudanYou just don't get it do you.Quote:
Originally Posted by LalafellDown
And you already contradicted yourself every which way.
Look the bottom line is this -
If the Mentor shows up and says nothing...and just does their thing and leaves. No foul no harm done.
If the Mentor opens their damn mouth and says anything that is not an positive example of the player-base in terms of experience and starts verbally abusing people...they are twice damned more so than any player who verbally abuses others. This is a FACT...not up for debate or discussion or a Argument....don't believe me? Talk to a GM.
There is no "grey area" in terms of disruption....if you disrupt the duty...your in violation of ToS. Period.
If the Mentor didn't want to help - they should have kept their damn mouth shut. Period.
Can't be faulted if you don't say anything now can you.
Beyond that...the rest is just a waste of time debating over.
And no..being a bad player cannot be reported...please bother to read before you say such things.
You can be a horrible player..and still not be disrupting the dungeon in SE's eyes. We see it every bloody day.
Bad Player is incredably "Subjective" in itself..good luck reporting "bad players" if that's how you think it works.
Again - Mentors should be ready to help if they choose to put the badge on and show up in mentor roulete. But that is not how it works.
So all we can do is report them when they start talking trash and being a "Bad example" in terms of refusal to assist.
A Mentor saying "A waste of time" is a report-able offense in my eyes.
SE doesn't think helping others is a "Waste of time"
If he thought it was a waste of time..he should have exited without saying one bloody word.
Can't take the heat as a mentor? Get out of the kitchen...don't bother coming back.
The badge is egocentric anymore these days...and its depressing enough.
Are Mentors required to teach? No...but they should be.
Are Mentors held to a higher standard? YES.
So if they start talking...bad mouthing...being negative? They be in trouble.
Are they expected to know everything? NO.
This is why a Mentor should say "Hey uh..new to this...sorry in advance"
Can't be blamed for anything at that point. Can they still be bad? Yep.
But if they are polite....and just do their thing..like every other player...again...not a bad thing in SE's eyes.
The main crux here is behavior and attitude towards players.
The rest is wishful thinking in terms of what a Mentor SHOULD be. But this isn't a thing that's enforced.
Until such time it is...all we can do is make sure SE is aware of the foul mouthed/bad attitude crown wearing ego tripping morons who like to show up for the "bonus" and leave without lifting a finger.
There are great mentors mind you...I know quite a few.
But they are outgunned...and out manned by egocentric crown badges.
If they want to get their bonus - they best keep quiet...and just carry on. Because I will take great pleasure in spotlighting bad mentors who bad mouth.
Oh and for the record... "queuing up" is not "Helping out" Not by a long shot.
Anyone can push a little button.
Bothering to give a damn and help people clear content...is an entirely different matter.
And yes...people don't like being told their wrong....and yes...those who watch guides should know their stuff..and those who are deep into the game should know their basics..but people are still human beings...they WILL...make mistakes.
Even Mentors.
But its no excuse for refusing to render aid.
The point of a Mentor is to Mentor...not to strut your stuff like a peacock. When SE starts taking a hard line on this...I'll be a much happier Au Ra to be sure. -
06-15-2018, 03:58 PMNanaWiloh
Far as I am concerned the crown is just empty symbol. I have seen good mentors and ones who are completely down in the gutter trash with attidudes to match. I find the best teachers are the players who do not have the crown next too their name. You dont need a status symbol to teach people just the willingess to do it. If you want that pretty crown too indicate that your wiling to teach go for it, just remember there players who are going to use it as an excuse to a be Jerk.
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06-15-2018, 04:26 PMHyoMinParkThe mentor disrupted the OP's gaming experience, too. I hope you realize that. OP did everything right by researching the fight prior, but that can still leave questions and/or confusion over something once you see it in action. The "mentor" saying "you aren't worth me time, I don't want to teach, I only want my mentor mount" is in the wrong. This isn't someone who needs a mentor title as they only want it for the rewards, not to actually assist players and try to be a positive influence in the community. I said it earlier, but SE made a terrible mistake by locking incentives behind mentorship.Quote:
Originally Posted by LalafellDown
The mentor was in direct contradiction of two of the Mentor guidelines you posted: providing gameplay advice/assistance when asked, and being an example of great player etiquette. I don't understand how you fail to see that. But you try to defend your position with "this is only one side of the story". While it is, why start assuming the OP is being dishonest? Especially after they came back in this thread and apologized for any upset they caused.
I know there are crappy sprouts and new players out there, but the OP has given zero reason to consider them one of these awful sprouts. There are also just as many crappy mentors out there as well. I've met them on my main and my beansprout alts. And I understand a lot of good ones have been beat into the ground via verbal abuse, but still. Telling someone they "aren't worth my time" when they ask a question is a very rude thing to do, in my opinion.
Honestly, the best thing SE can do is just remove this system all together. It has done nothing productive for this game if forum threads about it are to be believed. -
06-15-2018, 05:33 PMMeganLynnIt's people with this kind of attitude that is what's wrong with the game. Please, get some help!Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanathya
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06-15-2018, 05:37 PMLalafellDownOP's text: "he refused to tell anything and said that this wasn't worth his time because he only wanted the mount." so Mentor didn't talk, his time was valuable and his goal is clear.Quote:
Originally Posted by HyoMinPark
Mentor was playing the game he doesn't have to provide advice if the following rule applies and it does: "3.2 Disruption. You may not in any way disrupt or interfere with the Game experience of other players, including the disruption of Square Enix's computers and servers." Was OP seeking advice? Doesn't matter. if 3.2 Disruption is the law of the land then it applies to mentors as well. Mentor didn't talk, his time was valuable and his goal is clear. Mentors experience was being attacked is it not? if he didnt want to help.
The point is that rule 3.2 is clearly applies to everyone in every way no matter how we may think otherwise. Doesn't matter what mentor said or OP said as long as they weren't harassing each other with words or cursing at each other in any way, that has a different rule #. Rule 3.2 applies to both. OP wanted help, mentor said no, why because it hinders his game experience, he wants that mount, his time is valuable, doesn't matter if he is a mentor or not rule 3.2. states "other players" that includes our mentor here. Mentor didn't provide any advice so it hindered OP's experience. So whose wrong? neither is wrong because rule 3.2 protects both players experience (whatever experience that may be they're both customers and can play as they will as long as they're following rule 3.2 as well) even if they're opposite experiences. You cant force even a mentor to do something if they don't want to because rule 3.2 protects them in their mentor game experience.
If rule 3.2 didn't exist then the mentor rules would be the #1 rules for the mentors to follow, but as of right now rule 3.2 comes first. Whether he should be a mentor or not, is decided by rule 3.2.
He can be a mentor and not give advice if he chooses not to because it may hinder his experience, especially when another player in involved as OP was.
SE needs to add: "other players except for mentor's experience" to the end of rule 3.2. otherwise it covers mentors experience too