Please scale the difficulty of Royal Menagerie

You can carry pretty hard on this trial now that people have pretty good gear, it doesn't need to be changed. It was originally pretty tough when everyone's dps was really low in comparison but as long as your healers don't both die at the same time you should be able to get a win

RM difficulty is just fine, no nerf pl0x. Shinryu is one of my favorite fights in the game. It's the final boss, you can't go full derp mode and kill the final boss. But it doesn't require high skill levels nowadays either.

And please stop insinuating that casuals are bad. Playing casually tells nothing about the players skill level. Bad players can't clear the fight. Bad players can't finish the story. But they can't do that in single player games either.

I wouldn't say it's on par with EX trials. Unfortunately, I think the biggest problem new players have is the community. I've gotten this a fair amount in trial roulette since SB and quite often there is a wipe and then a vote abandon after just the one wipe. Then if it doesn't go through, some might drop out. I try to help new people if they take me up when I offer tips, but the others in the group are too impatient. And if someone has gotten to 70 without knowing some of those older mechanics, it's not always on them, because that same impatience is present in those lower level trials as well.

I would have to agree with you, OP. I think the difficulty spike goes up too much on this fight in comparison to the rest of MSQ. I've campaigned since it dropped that it needed adjustments. People who are trained by EX trials and raids, like myself, to have these sort of snap reflexes don't have as much trouble. But those who aren't used to that environment I have seen struggle. And the unhelpful rush rush rush attitude of the community is not helping.

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Originally Posted by missybee

I somehow missed OP saying that...

At the risk of sounding like somewhat of a braggy-boots, I one-shot both Susano and Lakshmi. This translates into very little time spent trying to get clears on those extreme primals.

OMG TOTAL NO-LIFER, REEE.

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Comments like that irk me. Even if you do play the game for hours upon hours. What business is it of anyone else's how you spend your free time? It only becomes an issue if you're disregarding real life obligations.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

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See, I haven't really had this issue if I see it come up in roulette. Most groups are there to win, and usually do within a few attempts. I recall only 1 time where it straight up fell apart. It was after wipe 2 or 3 I think, and people just weren't getting it. At all. People started leaving, so I decided to join them to avoid the debuff. No words were really said aside from "gotta watch for this/that". Impatience? Yeah, definitely. But a lot of people have been around long enough to see when something's not gonna work out. If there's obvious progress being made, people usually stick around. If not, then they're gone. And sometimes it just doesn't work out, plain and simple. But as I said, I've only see this happen 1 time in RM. Same thing can happen in any content of the game, however. These issues aren't exclusive to one instance.

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Originally Posted by Bourne_Endeavor

Snipperino

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Oh, samesies.

I would agree that, generally speaking, MMOs are more of a time investment than your standard single-player jaunt, but that doesn't mean that your life has to revolve around said MMO.

As always, I can only speak to my own experiences, but if I am raiding three nights a week and capping tomestones, that's a grand total of about 10 or 11 hours...and that's only because we're still in prog. Definitely plenty of time to focus on other aspects of my life.

And heck, if people don't want to focus on other aspects of their lives, that's up to them. If people want to make XIV a career or a huge part of their life, assuming they have the means to do so, what's the issue?

To say that you have to be a 'no-lifer' to beat extremes though is beyond silly. I think the extreme I personally struggled most with was Sephirot...and by "struggled most" I mean it was about two hours of learning and seeing mechanics before we cleared it. MAH LIFE, HALP.

The difficulty is just right. If you have a group of people who aren't on the ball then of course you're going to fail- it's the FINAL BOSS and he's very eager to have a no-holds-barred showdown featuring his demi-god powers and the WoL's pluck (and choice in friends). I've been more groups than have made it than not. Many of them were a struggle to clear with but it was a very satisfying thing to reach the end after wiping. The group needs to be willing to learn and willing to try again- a prerequisite for any kind of video game out there. If Shinryu's too tough for some people then they need to practice, plain and simple. That's how you get better and overcome challenges in games.

A large part of it is the healer burden of the fight is higher than other similar trials. Usually there's moderate down-time for healers to regen mana, do safe resses, and DPS a bit. Shinryu has us constantly on our toes watching for the next mechanic and saving people who screwed up. People who coasted through up until now got a rude awakening for sure. If both healers aren't ready to hit the ground running then it will be a bad time for everyone.

I, for one, am pleased that SE thinks players can handle rapid-fire mechanics in regular duties though. It's so much better than them assuming we're getting matched with the worst players out of the Tales from DF thread.

Thread doesn't matter, YoshiP was already on-record in an interview almost a month ago that they are okay with how it is, and having a final battle with some mechanic difficulty is expected. You'd think some people would remember simple things like breaking the chains from The Vault, but they get to level 70 and still can't do the mechanic.

As for 4.0 extreme primals which are kind of snoozer, Shinryu Extreme in 4.1 is supposed to return to something closer to Thordan Extreme was.

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Originally Posted by Legewiel

I already cleared it on the week it were released, but i agree on nerfing it too! we have a lot of casuals and they should be allowed to see the rest of story too. They're part of the paying customers and the game needs all of them to keep playing.
If not nerf at least add that echo thing in there, so if you want to clear without nerf do a one shot, if you have trouble clearing it you go stacking echo until you're able to do the clear.
For the people that is like "omg they'll ruin my fun", don't worry the ex version is coming soon on 4.1 so you'll be able to show how awesome you are.

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Being a casual player need not mean bad player by default. Casual used to mean someone that cannot devote the time to learn a complex fight. Shinryu is a far cry from a complicated fight. All echo does is increase healing, HP and damage dealt. In otherwords, it won't stop those that just flat out fail the few mechanics that can kill you. Dying to a mechanic forces you to learn it, rather than just barely squeeze by. Keep just barely passing and you'll have other people being forced to compensate for your screw-ups. Bad players are players who just want a clear without learning anything.

Personally, I'd say Royal Menagerie is fine. What people tend to mess up are the "rapid fire" mechanics (there are far worse offenders to these types of fights than Royal) and the fact that it's "random" which mechanics Shinryu will do. The only reason I could lend any kind of validation to those saying it's as hard as an extreme trial is because most, if not all, of the primals have no randomness in them- those are generally only found in savage raids. Unlike savage, however, there is a decent time between each mechanic in Shinryu. Unlike Lakshmi where DPS might get a mechanic and then not worry about anything for a minute or two before they need to pay attention again.

If anything, I'd say Royal Menagerie is on par with Hallowed Diablos found in Dun Scaith. Only done with 8 people instead of 24.

This reminds me of a tale I once heard as a kid about two gnomes. They both had to do work moving bags, and every time they were done they had to move a bigger bag. They both used magic to make it easier though. One gnome made himself stronger each time to lift the increasingly heavy bags. While the other just kept making the bags small.

Then the second gnome reached the royal menagerie and decided to complain about it on the forums.