Should the Heavensward Leveling dungeons and trials have item level requirements?

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Originally Posted by Misutoraru

at the very last patch we have to do a dungeon as MSQ required
which the dungeon have 230 il requirement

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Might I suggest just doing PVP? You only need a 140-150 ilevel piece in each slot and can get a decent ilevel 235 set that is more than enough to get you through any of the 4/8 man content currently required for the MSQ and doesn't take that long to get. Just running shatter for a few hours and you'll have more than enough marks. I say shatter because of the huge group size, one person being a little undergeared doesn't make too big of a difference.

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Originally Posted by Naunet

If they put any ilvl requirements on leveling dungeons, they need to practically hand out the gear needed to meet those requirements. At no point should you be leveling and find yourself up against a wall of "I need to grind for better gear" - save that for when you're at endgame.

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they do hand out the gear. for example, All the quests leading up to dusk vigil rain down level 51 HQ gear and there are vendors that sell proper level gear for rather cheap prices in the various outposts along the way and the levequests hand out level appropriate gear too and poetics gear is dirt cheap too
Not having people in sub-50 gear for HW dungeons that just get one shot by everything and don't contribute any damage isn't that much to ask for

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Originally Posted by Misutoraru

This is one of the issue we have in game as 3.X patch
at the very last patch we have to do a dungeon as MSQ required
which the dungeon have 230 il requirement
if a player do MSQ only, he/she can only grind Tomestone of Lore to gear a full set of 230
but the player will not reach il230 by it, since no weapon and missing 1 ring
thus, the player have to grind scripture to exchange some 260 gear
not to mention how limit weapon will be

I am not against setting iL for leveling and MSQ dungeon, but the dev have to make sure they have provide enough way to obtain equipment during the MSQ or NPC selling them

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I'm a "new player" with 249 I LvL at just ended 3.2 MSQ with no real farming.

YES. If i had a dollar for every time I went into Dusk vigil to find a player at ilvl 50 when you can vendor buy 115 who knew and didn't care then i would have....6 dollars.

Now on topic, I want to say that I agree with adding a min. ilevel for the various dungeons in HW. Force people to actively invest in their gear and make them realize that they actually need to gear up, it's a good thing to know once you reach level 60 that you'll need to gear up at some point if you want to keep going. Now, with that being said, I don't think that the ilevel is generally a problem until you reach two specific points in the dungeon content.

The first point is when you reach Nidhogg, when one dps that is geared gets hit by Sable Price, the undergeared dps is almost never able to actually break them out of it and as a result they die and makes the rest of the fight that much harder, not only that, but it can also make you struggle on the add phase, and with burning him down after he does Massacre and starts to spam his aoe damage attacks at you.

The second point where it really becomes a problem is during the Vault when you reach the second boss and third boss, both of whom can potentially overwhelm a healer if they aren't killed quickly enough by the party as they can be very taxing on your mp with just how much damage they can do. There have been times where due to those bad dps I have been legitimately unable to clear those dungeons even when I would go Cleric as a healer or try to DPS stance as a tank. When you reach those two points it really starts to show. Vigil and Sohm Al on the other hand? Having low dps won't necessarily mean your group will lose, it just means those dungeons will drag on which, while boring, are still able to be beaten.

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Originally Posted by Khalithar

I don't think that the ilevel is generally a problem until you reach two specific points in the dungeon content.

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Hrm I wouldn't leave Sohm Al out of the list.

I've been in groups multiple times where we had trouble on second boss and last boss.

Players queuing for Sohm Al wearing like i70-i90 gear you get either one shotted by unavoidable damage or you almost die every 5 seconds. Pretty hard on the healer. Been lucky I've never seen an undergeared tank because it likely would end the same as what I describe about Dusk Vigil below this.

Also have had issues in Dusk Vigil before so its wrong to leave that one out too.

Four times have gotten tanks wearing really low item level gear and wearing an i42 weapon one time <.< suffice it to say he couldn't hold hate and was getting rekt so bad the healer ends up dead from healing him and we had to vote kick...in the end we waited 10 mins for a rep tank and never got one so we all had to requeue.

As for the other instances of it almost the same thing happened just minor differences like one guy opting to leave on his own because he didn't realize he needed stronger gear for it. All in all quite a bit of wasted time that the game itself shouldn't let happen.

So really, unlike what you say here, ilevel is a problem before The Aery too.

I know people will not like it, but if we're looking at the other topics, especially the duty finder thread and pay close attention to our own experiences, we will find that in most cases it isn't the gear. Now I am aware that some people run under geared or "cheat" gear into dungeons, and I am not saying that's ok or should be tolerated, however maybe we should implement a actual skill requirement. I've seen people in full BiS and yet they can't play their job. You can't argue well that are the people that level'd via potd, because sadly to say, it isn't. Some of these people I know were playing the game and job before potd was even a thing. If we would add both ilvl and skill requirement to all of the 4.0 content that's accessible via DF/RF, we maybe would be better off, if not than my opinion is that neither of the content need any requirements and is going to continue to be a waste of every bodies time/money.

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Originally Posted by LunaFaye

I know people will not like it, but if we're looking at the other topics, especially the duty finder thread and pay close attention to our own experiences, we will find that in most cases it isn't the gear. Now I am aware that some people run under geared or "cheat" gear into dungeons, and I am not saying that's ok or should be tolerated, however maybe we should implement a actual skill requirement. I've seen people in full BiS and yet they can't play their job. You can't argue well that are the people that level'd via potd, because sadly to say, it isn't. Some of these people I know were playing the game and job before potd was even a thing. If we would add both ilvl and skill requirement to all of the 4.0 content that's accessible via DF/RF, we maybe would be better off, if not than my opinion is that neither of the content need any requirements and is going to continue to be a waste of every bodies time/money.

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You're correct about skill being more important than gear. I will not deny that. But others brought up the fact that there are unavoidable attacks that hit real hard even at the highest synced item level, especially the ones from pretty much every boss of the Vault (Ser Adelphel's limit break sword attack on a non-tank, and Ser Charibert's chains and room-wide aoe come to mind.)

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Originally Posted by Driavna

I'm a "new player" with 249 I LvL at just ended 3.2 MSQ with no real farming.

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you obviously not seeing the point
it is not about new player or experience player
it is more about MSQ require something that not given out during MSQ

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Originally Posted by Misutoraru

you obviously not seeing the point
it is not about new player or experience player
it is more about MSQ require something that not given out during MSQ

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You are also missing our point..

There are 1.5 years between a fresh level 60 (3.0) and the current MSQ (3.5)..

It is absolutely expected that the MSQ for 3.5 be relevant to the patch in terms of required iLvl and difficulty.
If the iLvl requirement was lower, then the difficulty would have to be a joke.
If you got handed gear just by doing the MSQ - there would be no reason to farm during these 3-6 months.

We farmed for 3-6 months in raids and trials between each patch for these MSQs. It shouldn't be expected that you can just jump straight from 3.0 to 3.5 with little to no farming for gear.
In fact, the iLvl requirement for MSQs is MUCH lower than the other content for these patches.
For example, the iLvl requirement for these dungeons are 230 - however the gear available to players when this came out was 270.
If you're struggling to make the iLvl just by zerging the MSQ, you really are too far ahead in the story for your gear, and you need to go farm gear to continue.

At the tail end of every major patch there is "catch up" content that is created, for this very reason. Farm that catch up content, proceed with the MSQ, repeat..