Naoki Yoshida, Balance the game please [War DPS TOO HIGH!]

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Originally Posted by Phoenicia

On the other hand, it irks me when I see a ninja trying their hardest to overwrite my slashing debuff with theirs considering how much DPS he's losing for no actual benefit/loss on my side. (I go out of my way to tell the ninja not to use dancing edge as I already am applying the debuff, but they use it anyways, I guess out of habit).

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I'm guilty of this.
I just don't meet many WAR that keeps it up 100% of the time. If I see it fall off a few seconds, I just don't trust them anymore so I hardly get to practice my non-dancing edge rotation.

Assuming they've got it down and then realizing that Storm's Eye isn't actually there has got me really distrustful in randoms.
It doesn't help that Storm's Eye get put with everyone else's debuffs, so it's not as easy to monitor as my own.

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Originally Posted by Allyrion

I'm guilty of this.
I just don't meet many WAR that keeps it up 100% of the time. If I see it fall off a few seconds, I just don't trust them anymore so I hardly get to practice my non-dancing edge rotation.

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Admittedly it's difficult to keep it up all the time as a war. On trash forget it, I'm finding it more difficult to hold hate now, and especially on war I have to spend a lot more time focusing on agro than applying debuffs. It's easier on bosses since there's only one mob, but even then, maintaining storm's eye/path and a hate rotation while dealing with wrath stacks means storm's eye isn't always my top priority. I keep it up pretty well but I can see why wars would have trouble maintaining it.

http://i.imgur.com/HneKGxq.png

DRK going hard!

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Originally Posted by Allyrion

Don't get me wrong, having NIN-WAR is synergy while MNK-DRK clearly doesn't synergize (unless multiple targets). I agree that's not a good thing.
I just mean, it's not weird some comps work better and synergize better than others.

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This is indeed true. The synergy and buff are bonus making a good and balanced party.

What bother me is that somehow a a lot of class synergize with someone of the other or with themselves. Think about MnK and Blunt resistance, Warrior and Nin with Slashing, Dragoon with piercing and Bard Mch with magic class. Even the pld can offer party wide benefits with the new mitigation skill like divine veil and clemency. But DrK can't offer synergy with anybody, moreover the presence of some job result in conflict.

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Originally Posted by Yorumi

Admittedly it's difficult to keep it up all the time as a war. On trash forget it, I'm finding it more difficult to hold hate now, and especially on war I have to spend a lot more time focusing on agro than applying debuffs. It's easier on bosses since there's only one mob, but even then, maintaining storm's eye/path and a hate rotation while dealing with wrath stacks means storm's eye isn't always my top priority. I keep it up pretty well but I can see why wars would have trouble maintaining it.

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Aggro on trash is simple: Steel Cyclone... Done.. You hardly EVER need anything more for trash mobs. You can storm eye the kill target if they're less than 3 monsters in a pull.. If you have more than three, I do not know why ANY of your party is doing anything but AoE attacks anyways.

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Originally Posted by Phoenicia

Aggro on trash is simple: Steel Cyclone... Done.. You hardly EVER need anything more for trash mobs. You can storm eye the kill target if they're less than 3 monsters in a pull.. If you have more than three, I do not know why ANY of your party is doing anything but AoE attacks anyways.

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Generally I don't lose hate, but specially when I'm paired with blms, or good drgs, mnks, and such the hate levels displayed can get, uncomfortable, lets say. Overpower just doesn't seem to get the job done anymore and steel cyclone can't be spammed. It's mostly the contrast, before 50 it was basically overpower, maybe twice and go to sleep. Now if I don't actively focus pretty hard on hate it can get scary. I do like being engages more but it does affect the way I approach a fight.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

You did not answer my question.

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Sure I did, just not in the way you were leading me to.

My point is that OT DPS potential is pretty well balanced, if you account for slashing debuff. Asking for a buff to PLD's or DRK's OT DPS potential is, at this point, ridiculous. Even asking for their own slashing debuff would be too much, in my opinion. That's not to say that those jobs are perfect, but when it comes to OT DPS potential, they're fine.

Let me ask this: where do you think WAR's OT DPS should rank among the three tanks?

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Originally Posted by Mattiux

Here is where the problem lays. The warrior is a self-sufficient class, wich provide to the party a strong 10% debuff to the damage suffered providing by himself for the slashing buff needed.

The Drk on the other hand have problem with a lot of party composition. If you have a DrK in the party instead of a Warrior you are going to face the following issue

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Just because DRK failed to carve a niche for itself (I don't think that it did), doesn't mean it should be made more like WAR. I don't think that you necessarily feel this way, but this thread is about WAR.

Warriors should be high damage. They are Warriors.
Dark Knight's should have less damage then Warriors, they are Warriors.
DPS should have more damage then Warriors, if that isn't the case you need to read some guides and play better.

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Originally Posted by Argyle_Darkheart

Sure I did, just not in the way you were leading me to.

My point is that OT DPS potential is pretty well balanced, if you account for slashing debuff. Asking for a buff to PLD's or DRK's OT DPS potential is, at this point, ridiculous. Even asking for their own slashing debuff would be too much, in my opinion. That's not to say that those jobs are perfect, but when it comes to OT DPS potential, they're fine.

Let me ask this: where do you think WAR's OT DPS should rank among the three tanks?

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I asked what PLD and DRK contribute to WAR, not the entire Armory system. I think it should rank near evenly between the three. Currently DRK can single tank and OT/DPS, but it cannot do either to the extent that WAR and PLD can.

So my question is, why bring a DRK to high end raids when we have two jobs that can excel in exactly what is needed? If DRK contributed something to the party similar to slashing debuff, or not have long cool downs for mitigation, it would be a welcomed job.

DRK is not bad by any means, its just PLD and WAR are better.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

A job can only do good DPS if another job is in the party?

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I guess bard/mch benefiting from drg and smn/blm benefiting from bard aren't things anymore.