Content should be challenging to execute... Not challenging to learn

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Content should be challenging to execute... Not challenging to learn

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SE tried it with Step of Faith (easy mechanics, easy to understand, required a bit communication to execute)
Community demanded a nerf after the first 3 days.

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Originally Posted by Outfoxed

Are you trying to tell me trial and error is intuitive?

By definition trial and error is NOT intuitive. Trial and error is throwing things at the wall until something sticks.

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I'm curious what you do when your intuition tells you two things that lead to two mutually exclusive outcomes. Like if it were to tell you that meteors are bad but that golems eating meteors is also bad.

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Originally Posted by Whocareswhatmynameis

I beat all 4 floors of Alex today, and didn't watch 1 video or read any books, websites, ect. Players did this really wierd thing today, they shared information on what the boss does and made strategies to counter them. So you say that it don't take any skill (only research), but the skilled players are beating it much faster. I don't think that's a coincidence.

Here's a wierd concept, the players that ACTUALLY did some of the previous bahamut raid honed their skills and beat Alexander much easier. The people that said screw it, are struggling on Alex right now.

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This guy gets it.

I wish I could get a Bismark ex clear as easy as some people have. My groups either fail the dps checks right out the gate in i165-170, or die to mechanics in phase 2/3. Im only a healer, so maybe there are intricies im not seeing.

I'd just like them to stop leaning so heavily on scripted dance mechanics and 1 person can wipe the raid if he gets a lag spike mechanics. My favorite fight of all time is Akylios in Rift - a great example of a multiphase fight with interesting mechanics that forced everyone to work as a team. FFXIV mechanics consist of dodging 9999 telegraphs and baiting divebombs (or other drop from the sky blah blah stuff) in ridiculously complex ways. The focus is on the individual knowing the dance rather than the team knowing how to work together. I think that's probably what the OP is really getting at here. Anyone who thinks FFXIV boss encounters are the pinnacle of game design has obviously never played any other mmos.

I completely understand what you mean OP. Literally nothing is actually skill based in this game except for maybe pvp, I haven't tried that yet, but as long as it is player vs player it is technically skill based. However the pve in this game is only knowledge based because all enemies will react the same exact way every single time. Once you already know what they are going to do there is no longer any technical skill involved and it's just execution based on memory.

Obviously games not vs other player "can" be really difficult considering games like touhou exist. There must be some middle ground to making an mmorpg pve content more reaction based. This game does a decent job of that with aoes that you need to dodge and stuff, but you already know it's coming and the patterns are never complex.

So I guess my only suggestion would to be make encounters where you can't ever know ahead of time where a good place to stand is or where you ever need to move. That should be generated each time during the fight so that every time it is different somehow to a pretty significant degree.

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Originally Posted by IzzyData

Once you already know what they are going to do there is no longer any technical skill involved and it's just execution based on memory.

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Once you know the startup sequence and what the controls do, piloting an F16 is just execution based on memory.

Or in other words, skill.

"____ takes no skill" is just another way of saying "i can't do this therefore i'll just play it off as if it doesn't take skill anyway".

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Originally Posted by Viridiana

Once you know the startup sequence and what the controls do, piloting an F16 is just execution based on memory.

Or in other words, skill.

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I disagree. I'm pretty confident that no matter how long you spend learning about how to pilot a jet you couldn't do it your first try. You could easily watch and read about anything in FFXIV and execute it flawlessly on your first attempt. The skill part of the game would be learning your class and abilities, but if you already knew that then the boss encounters themselves are nothing after knowing what to do.

Perhaps there is a thin line between the two, but it in my opinion the game is definitely more about knowledge than technical ability.