Wow, Wuk Lamat is really single-handedly ruining the DT story...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CamuiKushi

Then the crisis with her brother happened, I was ready to get pumped up and have a final showdown with the resilient son after it had been built up from the beginning of the expansion. The WOL, one of my favourite scions and the fun new character were lining up for a hero pose. I had my finger hovering over the screenshot key in anticipation, and...
-snip-
It honestly felt like the biggest **** you from the devs.

---

You can tell the devs don't play all the jobs, or they'd have realized Dark Knights manage to duck under that intentional blocking going on there and found a way to stop you from doing it.
https://i.imgur.com/nfrCZwC.png

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by EusisLandale

You can tell the devs don't play all the jobs, or they'd have realized Dark Knights manage to duck under that intentional blocking going on there and found a way to stop you from doing it.
-snip-

---

I have a tradition of playing through each expansion as my starting job. Now I suddenly regret this decision lol

It just really makes me sad, ya know? I wanted to love Dawntrail, not feel bitter about it all.

Good god...

Just won the lvl 95 solo duty by doing absolutely nothing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGtY1aPrOMQ

This is worse than participation trophies...this is pathetic....now to see if a duty support with Mary Sue can be won by doing absolutely nothing. Regardless of the results I'll just do dungeons with real people to get thru faster.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CamuiKushi

I'ma be real, despite a few hiccups along the way I was having a blast with the majority of Dawntrail. I switched my brain into "Saturday morning cartoon" mode and enjoyed it for the shallow experience it was.

I enjoyed the majority of the succession competition (even the Pelupelu trading sequence gave me a laugh each time the pointless UI for it popped up) and I had a great time hanging out in the wild west with Erenville and teaching a gang how things are done in Eorzea. I was even happy to hang out with Wuk Lamat again beyond the dome and find out the mysteries of Heritage Found and Solution 9 despite how obvious some of the twists were.

Then the crisis with her brother happened, I was ready to get pumped up and have a final showdown with the resilient son after it had been built up from the beginning of the expansion. The WOL, one of my favourite scions and the fun new character were lining up for a hero pose. I had my finger hovering over the screenshot key in anticipation, and...

It honestly felt like the biggest **** you from the devs.
I was really trying to be charitable and give the devs the benefit of the doubt, that there'd be SOME kind of payoff with Wuk Lamat. But there really wasn't. In the end it felt like they didn't even want to be making an FF14 expansion.

---

I thought it was pretty obvious the WoL was a thorn in the writers side the entire time.
Throughout the story I got the impression they actually didn‘t want to write a ff14 story but a standalone one with Wuk Lamat as the central character.
In an mmorpg you can’t get rid of the player character though so they did it like this.

Really spiteful especially with the trailers and all else.

This one with the axe also isn’t on the writers alone but on the team that does cutscenes.
They knew exactly what they were doing there.
Everyone there did.

I’m just glad the Japanese seem more bothered by the entire “sidelining the WoL” thing than the western players.
At least I can have hope they actually listen.

If this continues though I’m out. Fuck this game then.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Voidmage

I thought it was pretty obvious the WoL was a thorn in the writers side the entire time.
Throughout the story I got the impression they actually didn‘t want to write a ff14 story but a standalone one with Wuk Lamat as the central character.
In an mmorpg you can’t get rid of the player character though so they did it like this.

Really spiteful especially with the trailers and all else.

This one with the axe also isn’t on the writers alone but on the team that does cutscenes.
They knew exactly what they were doing there.
Everyone there did.

I’m just glad the Japanese seem more bothered by the entire “sidelining the WoL” thing than the western players.
At least I can have hope they actually listen.

If this continues though I’m out. Fuck this game then.

---

There's quotes where Hiroi said something along the lines of "Writing for a game is a lot different than writing for theater."

And yet he cleary can't do either since his theater shut down.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mortex

The ironic part is that mecha otis is effectively the perfect endless. He doesn’t need soul energy too ruction and remember everything from his last life and did life for over 200 years and then somehow they did realise how fukked this is for the entire living memory plot so he dies saving a drone that has sphenes data echo on it. As we later see she can just jump drone bodies like a ascian does. Also don’t we forget they said endless are the most happiest memories of these people only for endless Otis to get memory ptsd for whatever reason.

Like the entire endless plot would have worked when they would never be forgotten by the Alexandrian people and they could have visited them in living memory. With the forgetting part what goal do the endless serve even ??? They are just computer programs same as Sphene and there is no empathy situation happening, it’s just use effectively pulling the plug on a soul vacuum that is used for something the living can’t even rember.

---

I have so little faith that Dawntrail's writers put any thought into what they wrote that I don't think they actually realized Otis' existence fucks the entire premise of Living Memory "needing" to end the way it did. I think they did it just to bait a cheap emotional reaction out of us when he dies, all so they could do it with him again IN Living Memory. Because between Namikka, Krile's parents, and Cahciua, there weren't enough cheap cry moments in there I guess.

But that's why I brought up the Omicron. They reshaped their entire civilization to house actual souls inside robotic shells. Otis was an example of an Endless that worked without the soul sucking issue, but he was one example that while I think it's unlikely, could've been a fluke. But even assuming there's some inherent difference between storing souls vs storing memories(it's all just aether so...lol I doubt it), just give the Omicron some data about the Endless and Alexandria's tech and I'm sure they could work out a solution in a day or so.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rakdar

I have so little faith that Dawntrail's writers put any thought into what they wrote that I don't think they actually realized Otis' existence fucks the entire premise of Living Memory "needing" to end the way it did. I think they did it just to bait a cheap emotional reaction out of us when he dies, all so they could do it with him again IN Living Memory. Because between Namikka, Krile's parents, and Cahciua, there weren't enough cheap cry moments in there I guess.

But that's why I brought up the Omicron. They reshaped their entire civilization to house actual souls inside robotic shells. Otis was an example of an Endless that worked without the soul sucking issue, but he was one example that while I think it's unlikely, could've been a fluke. But even assuming there's some inherent difference between storing souls vs storing memories(it's all just aether so...lol I doubt it), just give the Omicron some data about the Endless and Alexandria's tech and I'm sure they could work out a solution in a day or so.

---

The fact we didn't even consider consulting the Omicrons for Living Memory or asking Alisae to rustle up a porxie help with the paralyzed kid proved to me Hiroi has an actual disdain for what was previously written. I would've grumbled but let it pass if both the Omicrons or Alisae were like "Sorry we can't help because (insert bullshit reason here)." Instead it was completely glossed over and either Hiroi doesn't understand the lore of the game he's been on for around a decade, or he actively is trying to ignore what happened before so he can make this about his Mary Sue furry character. Both situations are bad and prove he needs to be let go.

After now having played the raids we have and letting my sub lapse for the first time since StB. Honestly I can't find the motivation to play. The msq is my main driving force and talking focus that lets me then go and enjoy the rest of the game.

However everytime I tried to boot up the game I got more and more frustrated knowing how bad the msq pissed me off and how going forward its probably going to be insufferable dealing with WuK.

So two days ago my sub ran out and honestly Im ok with not coming back until the story is fixed even If that means loosing my medium house. I will say the raids where fun, however they where not interesting enough to keep me playing until the next patch. Not any of my friends. They have all quit the expansion before even finishing the msq. They just couldn't stand WuK or how bad the writing was.

I have however tried to encourage one of my friends who was trying to enjoy the expansion to not let others bring her down.

Like if you like the Expansion nothing wrong with that. If you love WuK fair enough. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise ya know. Just understand that alot of us have our criticism of the expansion and Wuk specifically.

Namely the voice inflections at times and the voice direction choices. Plus the astronomical amount of power rangers level writing in the game.

Compared to any of the other expansions and the down to earth writing that was 1.0 to 6.0

Not all of it is WuK. However the fact they try and shove her into almost every single second of this expansion. Is in fact a issue that needs to be addressed going forward.

Its bad writing and honestly its disrespectful to the players intelligence. We are not five. So why are you treating us like we are by repeating the same thing to the point of nauseam.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lolnotacat

The fact we didn't even consider consulting the Omicrons for Living Memory or asking Alisae to rustle up a porxie help with the paralyzed kid proved to me Hiroi has an actual disdain for what was previously written. I would've grumbled but let it pass if both the Omicrons or Alisae were like "Sorry we can't help because (insert bullshit reason here)." Instead it was completely glossed over and either Hiroi doesn't understand the lore of the game he's been on for around a decade, or he actively is trying to ignore what happened before so he can make this about his Mary Sue furry character. Both situations are bad and prove he needs to be let go.

---

In hindsight, a LOT of moments felt forced in the msq, the whole story arc could be summarized in "don't think too much about it." I guess it was our brains who were meant to take a vacation this expansion, not the WoL /shrug

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rakdar

I have so little faith that Dawntrail's writers put any thought into what they wrote that I don't think they actually realized Otis' existence fucks the entire premise of Living Memory "needing" to end the way it did. I think they did it just to bait a cheap emotional reaction out of us when he dies, all so they could do it with him again IN Living Memory. Because between Namikka, Krile's parents, and Cahciua, there weren't enough cheap cry moments in there I guess.

But that's why I brought up the Omicron. They reshaped their entire civilization to house actual souls inside robotic shells. Otis was an example of an Endless that worked without the soul sucking issue, but he was one example that while I think it's unlikely, could've been a fluke. But even assuming there's some inherent difference between storing souls vs storing memories(it's all just aether so...lol I doubt it), just give the Omicron some data about the Endless and Alexandria's tech and I'm sure they could work out a solution in a day or so.

---

The problem is they tried too make the start of a new adventure while we have already a lot of lore that has to be taken into consideration when you right a follow up story. The problem is that sets us (the main character) up as a complete and utter idiot, like we are a azem the traveler a forger of bonds and friendships but for the sake of the story we don’t remember these when it’s plot needs it.

Like the new story writing team forgot a massive chunk of already existing lore. While also trying to be clever and get tear jerker moments out of us. But in the end we know how bad they fluffed it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lolnotacat

The fact we didn't even consider consulting the Omicrons for Living Memory or asking Alisae to rustle up a porxie help with the paralyzed kid proved to me Hiroi has an actual disdain for what was previously written. I would've grumbled but let it pass if both the Omicrons or Alisae were like "Sorry we can't help because (insert bullshit reason here)." Instead it was completely glossed over and either Hiroi doesn't understand the lore of the game he's been on for around a decade, or he actively is trying to ignore what happened before so he can make this about his Mary Sue furry character. Both situations are bad and prove he needs to be let go.

---

I'll give him the benefit of the doubt that it's more incompetence on his part than malicious intent since I'm not familiar with him or his work in general but yeah, the end result is the same kind of low quality that disrespects both what came before it and the player's intelligence.

That's the kind of shit Steve Danuser did to WoW as narrative lead, and I'd definitely put Danuser on the side of malicious intent. I won't go as far as saying Dawntrail is as bad as Shadowlands, but it's certainly made me realize that Dragonflight could've been a lot worse, because it was also supposed to be a sort of "reset" expansion with lower stakes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rakdar

I'll give him the benefit of the doubt that it's more incompetence on his part than malicious intent....

---

I would too if he were a guest writer, but even then it wouldn't really be acceptable, it would just shift the blame entirely to the lore lead (Kate) instead of partially. The thing is, Hiroi has been around for almost a decade and has been knee deep in a lot of sidequests. There's no good excuse as to why the story should be ignored from someone in his position.

https://i.imgur.com/0VU7vSN.png

https://i.imgur.com/X3IzsEQ.png

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Endy_Sinkai

Like if you like the Expansion nothing wrong with that. If you love WuK fair enough. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise ya know. Just understand that alot of us have our criticism of the expansion and Wuk specifically.

---

Fair comment.

I do find Dawntrail to be paradoxical, personally.
On one hand, I did enjoy it for the most part and don't feel it was as catastrophically bad as some have expressed.
On the other hand lots of good points, some of which are irrefutable (overuse of Wuk Lamat for example), have been made regarding the flaws in the story.

All I can really say at this point is that I sincerely hope that the 7.x story direction puts our character back in the spotlight.

surprisingly there's no "Please, don't be too mean to the staffs too much" from YoshiP this time around

On one hand i want to believe this is just when “too much freedom in writing was given” is the reason behind it and i hope they learn from it

But on the other hand there is so many screw up with the plot, continuation and character progression its so jarring

When is the next live btw?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by WeakestZenosEnjoyer

"Oh no, the city is threatened by powerful airships! Tech kitty is on the case, what can he whip up with his Sharlayan allies, a cannon perhaps like the one G'raha built for the train? Maybe he'll reverse engineer their technology from the last invasion?"

Actually he allies Radz-at-Han... ???? Good to see you again Vrtra but why are you in this story?!

---

Because they needed a "banger" moment and a cheap solution to the airstrike issue.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bellybell

surprisingly there's no "Please, don't be too mean to the staffs too much" from YoshiP this time around

---

No, there hasn't. But for that to happen, they would have to acknowledge that there is criticism going on at all and that hasn't happened either yet.
So I think we have to wait for the next live letter and hope they will talk about it in person, or they'll most likely just act like everything is okay and never talk about it.
Both is possible at this point. :/

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CamuiKushi

https://i.ibb.co/jWtZpqC/test.jpg

---

I really want people to send Yoshi-P & team as many screens like this as possible - with a question why they bothered using WoL on all their promotional material, when they clearly had such a wonderful specimen taking WoL place for the whole damn MSQ...

My friend joke that there is reason estinien is not in any company and only appear here and there

If estinien in our party from the start, the whole mess will never happen in the first place

- wuk lamat kidnapped? Estinien will jump head on to bakool jaja on rescue cutscene
- zooral ja kill gulool jaja? He probably request duel to zooral in that instant

His super straight attitude and no fun allowed when it come to battle ironically can fix all this mess lol

The writer knew this hence why he got demoted so much in this expac

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Endy_Sinkai

So two days ago my sub ran out and honestly Im ok with not coming back until the story is fixed even If that means loosing my medium house. I will say the raids where fun, however they where not interesting enough to keep me playing until the next patch. Not any of my friends. They have all quit the expansion before even finishing the msq. They just couldn't stand WuK or how bad the writing was.

---

I'm right there with you. For the first time since I started playing I've cancelled the auto-renew on my sub. Still have over 100 days left so I'll see how the patch content pans out. But the more I think about it the more 7.0 makes me feel like this isn't a game I want to play anymore.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Regis_Paran

Because they needed a "banger" moment and a cheap solution to the airstrike issue.

---

The moment fell SO incredibly flat for me. I was already mildly perturbed by the use of Meteion's theme of despair being used for oh-so-dramatic moments. But when "with hearts aligned" started for Vritra coming to help I suddenly realised that the devs just look at all the past music as stock music to be paraded out without a second thought.

"Ah yes, Vritra was from Endwalker, what is a hype song from Endwalker?" with no thought to the context of that song. It really shows a lack of attention to detail, which is startling coming from CSU3.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Endy_Sinkai

So two days ago my sub ran out and honestly Im ok with not coming back until the story is fixed even If that means loosing my medium house. I will say the raids where fun, however they where not interesting enough to keep me playing until the next patch. Not any of my friends. They have all quit the expansion before even finishing the msq. They just couldn't stand WuK or how bad the writing was.

---

The dissapointment of DT made sub wow for a month lol

Iam thinking to sub FF11 when my wow sub run out

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rakdar

It's even dumber than that, because there's that cutscene between her and Zoraal Ja(where *only the two of them are present* so she's not trying to deceive us) and she pleads with him to find some way to make peace with us, that with our knowledge we could explore new possibilities to preserve her people. Then as soon as he's out of the picture she forgets about that possibility entirely and goes all in with the "steal their souls" plan. I'm sure if she'd bothered to ask to work with us it would've taken little more than a quick trip to Ultima Thule to consult the Omicron to at least have a really good starting point. We could've helped with the Levin sickness thing for her still-living subjects too, we've dealt with aetheric imbalances like that on multiple occasions by this point and NOBODY brought it up.

And that doesn't even get into how dumb it is for her to be *actively projecting* some of her people's memories in Living Memory while there's a power shortage. Just keep them in the terminals until you can find a solution, Sphene. Save power.

---

We are hinted multiple times with "they know so much more than I do" and then it never go anywhere. Sphene just reverts back to whatever she's doing. This expansion has so many dropped plot threads that I think who mentioned poor playtesting is probably on to something. There're just so many hooks that go nowhere? :rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BakoolJaJa

Completely out of place too btw. A bunch of people just got murdered, there's a war on our hands, the main engineer is sending off his wife with us, unsure she'll come back. We're building a suicide bomber train to storm a hostile base. We might not survive the train ride there, we might not survive the explosion part, we might not get into the base or get past the bubble, etc. Our failure might lead to this whole nation getting destroyed, and later to more of the world getting destroyed.

Cue the ridiculous happy Disney music.

---

They seem to be trying to ape the elevator scene in Shadowbringer, completely disregarding the different scenario. Cargo cult of Shadowbringers, literally.

This thread started moving fast again. I feel behind...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by WeakestZenosEnjoyer

"Oh no, the city is threatened by powerful airships! Tech kitty is on the case, what can he whip up with his Sharlayan allies, a cannon perhaps like the one G'raha built for the train? Maybe he'll reverse engineer their technology from the last invasion?"

Actually he allies Radz-at-Han... ???? Good to see you again Vrtra but why are you in this story?!

---

For more than a decade (our time), the New World has been this far away, mysterious, nearly unknown place that could only be reached by a weeks-long journey across a treacherous, mostly uncharted sea. Imagine my surprise when Koana is able to send an envoy to Radz-at-Han (an island on the wrong side of Eorzea from Tural), negotiate and sign a trade/mutual defense pact, and get Vrtra to show up with all his homies that we've never known to be on the island in the nick of time, all in the span of, what, a couple of days?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CamuiKushi

...(even the Pelupelu trading sequence gave me a laugh each time the pointless UI for it popped up)...

---

I'll bet a dollar to a donut that that UI element was part of a trading minigame that got scrapped at the eleventh hour.

they need to stop necrobumping this dead topic.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by CamuiKushi

The moment fell SO incredibly flat for me.

---

Oh sure. I should have added and it wasn't a banger for me. I found it cheap and barely beleivable, that in a matters of literal days, Alphi was able to not only broker the treaty with Radz-at Han, but also Vrtra managed to somehow fly to Meracydia (where else all those other dragons were from?) and back to Tural. I get that linkpearls exists, that Vrtra owes Scions and that dragons can fly pretty fast. But come on...

I did see my share of playes being very happy about this scene though.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by george357

they need to stop necrobumping this dead topic.

---

Nope. Too many players still need the support group after the trauma that was MSQ and Wuk Lamat in particular.

If this bothers you, you're not forced to read and comment.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Regis_Paran

Oh sure. I should have added and it wasn't a banger for me. I found it cheap and barely beleivable, that in a matters of literal days, Alphi was able to not only broker the treaty with Radz-at Han, but also Vrtra managed to somehow fly to Meracydia (where else all those other dragons were from?) and back to Tural. I get that linkpearls exists, that Vrtra owes Scions and that dragons can fly pretty fast. But come on...

I did see my share of playes being very happy about this scene though.

---

It's a great scene when viewed in isolation and disregarding everything else. I love it to be honest. Dragons, so cool and all. It just makes zero sense when you remember all the context and reeks of desperation in hoping to get the players interested.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kennar

This thread started moving fast again. I feel behind...


For more than a decade (our time), the New World has been this far away, mysterious, nearly unknown place that could only be reached by a weeks-long journey across a treacherous, mostly uncharted sea. Imagine my surprise when Koana is able to send an envoy to Radz-at-Han (an island on the wrong side of Eorzea from Tural), negotiate and sign a trade/mutual defense pact, and get Vrtra to show up with all his homies that we've never known to be on the island in the nick of time, all in the span of, what, a couple of days?

I'll bet a dollar to a donut that that UI element was part of a trading minigame that got scrapped at the eleventh hour.

---

To be honest, this isn't completely unreasonable.

- If Koana sent someone who is able to travel the Aetheryte network there is barely any travel time at all.
- We know Dragons can fly pretty fast - and high. In fact Midgarsormr flew through space to get to the Source, so fair to assume Vrtra could've flown across from a very high altitude.
- Vrtra owed us one after all that business in the 13th

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raven2014

It's not a vibe, it's literally it under no uncertain term. She installed a new king after killing the previous king and queen, and tell people the child king is under her "protection".

That's straight up the protectorate playbook. France did this to a lot of countries in the 15th-18th century, and mine was one of them.

---

TBH I have a lot less issue with the "installing their ruler" in itself. I mean Alexandria wants to genocide the Source, it's good we put them under supervision. Sorry not sorry.

But why does Wuk Lamat get to decide who we should install just by herself? And she chose a kid that she just adopted which basically means she gets to rule by proxy? At the very least consult with Koana first?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ArcturusWhisper

But why does Wuk Lamat gets to decide who we should install just by herself? And she chose a kid that she just adopted which basically means she gets to rule by proxy? At the very least consult with Koana first?

---

The writers don't care about Koana, as far as they are concerned he exists solely to prop up Wuk Lamat's character
If they cared about him they would have had him, the guy who wants to bring mass technological innovations to Tural, be the one to accompany us to Alexandria where he can see for himself the people of Tural living under said highly advanced technology while seeing how such technology can be misused. On top of that the story seems to show that Koana knows Zoraal Ja better and has known him for longer than Wuk, therefore it would've made more sense for him to be the one to confront him. It's a baffling decision really, not only would it have greatly benefitted Koana's character but it would've been better for Wuk Lamat's character too for her to stay behind at Tuilloyal because then she can stand with the people of Tural while showing them she understands them by fighting and working among them, but of course that would require Wuk Lamat not being the center of literally every single quest in the MSQ and we can't be having that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Carin-Eri

To be honest, this isn't completely unreasonable.

- If Koana sent someone who is able to travel the Aetheryte network there is barely any travel time at all.
- We know Dragons can fly pretty fast - and high. In fact Midgarsormr flew through space to get to the Source, so fair to assume Vrtra could've flown across from a very high altitude.
- Vrtra owed us one after all that business in the 13th

---

For me the real problem was that someone as wise as Vrtra would just sign a military alliance with nation he so far had no contact with and also does not know who the rulers are. That is not something a wise/good leader would ever do.
Thavnair was hit by far the hardest the Final Days and suffered a lot. After all that he would just willy-nilly sign a military alliance that could plunge his people into a brutal war and bring even more suffering?
Vrtra coming over to help out because he owes the WoL and the Scions would have been more than enough.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nephilimmg

For me the real problem was that someone as wise as Vrtra would just sign a military alliance with nation he so far had no contact with and also does not know who the rulers are. That is not something a wise/good leader would ever do.
Thavnair was hit by far the hardest the Final Days and suffered a lot. After all that he would just willy-nilly sign a military alliance that could plunge his people into a brutal war and bring even more suffering?
Vrtra coming over to help out because he owes the WoL and the Scions would have been more than enough.

---

Well, I guess there is also the (admittedly somewhat less convincing*) issue of Zoraal Ja turning his attention to Eorzea if he had been successful in Tural.

*from what we saw of the attack on Tuliyollal I think it's pretty safe to say that his forces would've fared rather badly Vs Eorzea!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shibi

That one struck me too. For a computer program it's not very good at managing its resources. 'nice' is a fairly basic server command/methodology to deprioritise less important tasks. Even Windows has it under task manager.

If one is short on memory/speed... most kids know to shut other programs before running the important stuff.

Braindead tech knowledge from bad writers.

---

For that matter...DON'T STORE CRUCIAL DATA IN RAM!!!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by george357

they need to stop necrobumping this dead topic.

---

The "Necro" prohibition is archaic and needs to go.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Carin-Eri

Well, I guess there is also the (admittedly somewhat less convincing*) issue of Zoraal Ja turning his attention to Eorzea if he had been successful in Tural.

*from what we saw of the attack on Tuliyollal I think it's pretty safe to say that his forces would've fared rather badly Vs Eorzea!

---

Has there ever been an explanation on why electrope works outside of the lightning dome? It is fueled by lightning right? Even if they can store it to some degree it still should not be possible for them to go on a long winded campaign.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nephilimmg

For me the real problem was that someone as wise as Vrtra would just sign a military alliance with nation he so far had no contact with and also does not know who the rulers are. That is not something a wise/good leader would ever do.
Thavnair was hit by far the hardest the Final Days and suffered a lot. After all that he would just willy-nilly sign a military alliance that could plunge his people into a brutal war and bring even more suffering?
Vrtra coming over to help out because he owes the WoL and the Scions would have been more than enough.

---

This, so much.

The whole premise and set up is an absolute farce. It shows that Tural really isn't capable of protecting itself and its leaders are fairly incompetent when the threat is easily defeated once the deus ex machina show up.

To me it also screams that Vrtra shouldn't be in charge either because of how (apparently) quickly he signed on to the agreement.

Dawntrail is just "rule of cool" and "play sad song to cause an artificial emotional reaction" the expansion.

I stand by, Vrtra shouldn't have been involved at all, but it is what it is.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Regis_Paran

Oh sure. I should have added and it wasn't a banger for me. I found it cheap and barely beleivable, that in a matters of literal days, Alphi was able to not only broker the treaty with Radz-at Han, but also Vrtra managed to somehow fly to Meracydia (where else all those other dragons were from?) and back to Tural. I get that linkpearls exists, that Vrtra owes Scions and that dragons can fly pretty fast. But come on...

I did see my share of playes being very happy about this scene though.

---

The average modern AAA Square-Enix game fan doesn't need much more than cool things happening for sake of looking cool to love their games. So when XIV does it too they think it's the best MSQ ever.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BabySneed

The writers don't care about Koana, as far as they are concerned he exists solely to prop up Wuk Lamat's character
If they cared about him they would have had him, the guy who wants to bring mass technological innovations to Tural, be the one to accompany us to Alexandria where he can see for himself the people of Tural living under said highly advanced technology while seeing how such technology can be misused. On top of that the story seems to show that Koana knows Zoraal Ja better and has known him for longer than Wuk, therefore it would've made more sense for him to be the one to confront him. It's a baffling decision really, not only would it have greatly benefitted Koana's character but it would've been better for Wuk Lamat's character too for her to stay behind at Tuilloyal because then she can stand with the people of Tural while showing them she understands them by fighting and working among them, but of course that would require Wuk Lamat not being the center of literally every single quest in the MSQ and we can't be having that.

---

I have seen many people proposed that we should have Koana accompanying us in the second arc and I think I agree. It would get Wuk Lamat away from us for a while and so more room to flesh out other characters. Both Koana and Zoraal Ja are characters with potential, but they squandered it with literally not actually giving them any substance. We are told their character traits and then that's more or less it. Showing how Koana and Zoraal Ja interact with each other growing up would have been good at making it more REAL. Now everything is just so superficial and sudden and...urghhhh.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ReynTime

The average modern AAA Square-Enix game fan doesn't need much more than cool things happening for sake of looking cool to love their games. So when XIV does it too they think it's the best MSQ ever.

---

I have to defend them here though.

It's completely fine to like the scene. People have different tastes and the scene itself is really not bad (the reason and execution maybe).

People can be allowed to like it and like DT without being called names or being shamed for that. It's when one tries to spin arguments and / or actually makes things up to defend their stance when it get's problematic.
If we lash out on anyone who likes something in this expansion then that turns to just pure hate and bitternes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nephilimmg

Has there ever been an explanation on why electrope works outside of the lightning dome? It is fueled by lightning right? Even if they can store it to some degree it still should not be possible for them to go on a long winded campaign.

---

I don't actually think that needs an explanation.
Nothing suggests Electrope can't store energy for a larger amount of time.
As someone with a degree in electrical engineering I say that is possible. Not with our technology (storing pure electricity is a pain) but the world of ff14 works on aether anyway.
If anything they probably have it far easier with the whole energy thing then we do.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ArcturusWhisper

...But why does Wuk Lamat get to decide who we should install just by herself? And she chose a kid that she just adopted which basically means she gets to rule by proxy? At the very least consult with Koana first?

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BabySneed

The writers don't care about Koana, as far as they are concerned he exists solely to prop up Wuk Lamat's character
If they cared about him they would have had him, the guy who wants to bring mass technological innovations to Tural, be the one to accompany us to Alexandria where he can see for himself the people of Tural living under said highly advanced technology while seeing how such technology can be misused...-...It's a baffling decision really, not only would it have greatly benefitted Koana's character but it would've been better for Wuk Lamat's character too for her to stay behind at Tuilloyal because then she can stand with the people of Tural while showing them she understands them by fighting and working among them, but of course that would require Wuk Lamat not being the center of literally every single quest in the MSQ and we can't be having that.

---

As Sneed said, the writers most likely do not care about Koana at all. Just like every other character in Dawntrail, they exist purely to push Wuk Lamat's story and character as the MC and then get side-lined after their purpose is done.

Koana changed the most during the rite, going from someone who pretty much didn't give a damn about his nation's culture and only about Sharlayan innovation, to someone who gradually understands it's importance and why it's not a hindrance. Meanwhile Wuk barely changed at all and solved pretty much everything in her path with peace and happiness and friendship, both during and after the rite. She was always pushed as "The Perfect Ruler" ultimately and Koana just existed to enforce that by giving up right at the finish line to declare she was the only one fit to rule.

Koana SHOULD'VE been the one to go with us in the 2nd half. He could've went to Shaaloani to see that the Dustwatch he set up has corruption issues, see the issues that his train may have inadvertently caused to some of the locals and the local wildlife as a result, and maybe gotten some more backstory on him the nomadic family that just left him. He could've seen with his own eyes just how far advanced Alexandria is and then try to wrangle with the cultural implications of their soul system. Even in Living Memory he could've seen both just how far technology can go, and also the horrors of what it would take to maintain such a thing, resulting in S9 and the final 2 zones essentially asking himself "How far is too far with technology, and is it ultimately worth it?" and learning where to go from there.

Unfortunately, Koana is not named Wuk Lamat, so he becomes another Yes-Man and then gets thrown to the side because Wuk needs another dozen hours of talking about peace and happiness and friendship.