What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

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Originally Posted by Rulakir

I like how I'm the only one who's just outright canceled Scions so far. I didn't think I'd end up being the one harshest on them!

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Only because I didn't do one. :p Just thought there's no point. Even thinking of characters who are closer to the protagonists' side, I'd have sooner gone with the likes of Ardbert or Hien. The only Scions I like much are Estinien and Thancred, and even then, it's mostly lukewarm, and Thancred felt very boring and at times out of character in EW, for example with how passive he is about the fate of the shards in Venat's escape pod plan. He's mainly just eye candy and my tank trust option. Y'shtola became more interesting in SHB due to seemingly wanting to carry the torch for keeping memory of the ancients alive, and then came EW. So I'd end up with two 3.5* and a bunch of cancelled ones. :D

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

I feel like the best case scenario would be for an arrangement to be made for them and the other people of Ilsabard to co-exist in Corvos and other provinces that are amenable to the idea.

There doesn't seem to be any indication that that wasn't the case originally, as the G tribe was stated to have lived there since the time of the Allagans, but it's only at some later point that aggressors from neighboring regions chased out the Garleans. For all we know there might be only one specific group that was responsible for that, but the Garleans ended up pursuing disproportionate retribution and decided to make enemies of the entire continent; even those who had no hand in their exile.

Those years of bad blood aren't just going to wash away quickly, though, and I can easily see a new conflict brewing as a result of the remaining Garlean legions desiring to reclaim Corvos after the Final Days largely eliminated their presence in the region. I will welcome such a thing if it's not a simple matter of right vs. wrong and radical parties on both sides of things serve as obstacles to peace.

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Agree with all this.

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Originally Posted by Kolsykol

I imagine after a near universe ending event people would probably be a bit more open to just moving on, especially with Garlemald being destroyed and the Garleans learning the truth.
You're not wrong that there would be a bunch of crap with people incapable of moving on but I don't think it'd be something you wouldn't be able to keep under control.

I mean irl we have a lot of countries with VERY bloody histories that today are very good friends including multiple world wars on top of it all.
People all things considered moved on very quickly from WW2 which I'd say was worse than what the Garleans were up to ( even if the Garlemald was really bad, but they afaik didn't have gas chambers etc... ).
Not to mention that Garlemald had a crap ton of Eorzeans doing a lot of really bad stuff under their umbrella.
I think people would just kinda be done tbh, we've seen it many times irl too at some point things just get so bad that people have enough and just decide to stop.

Garleans I don't think are in any position to do anything either and learning the truth of their Empire I think would be internally conflicting enough to stop any large scale uprising.

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The Omega questline and final role quest did note that some of the Garleans were just sick of it all and simply wanted to focus on survival, but at the same time there were some who remained stubbornly patriotic in the face of everything and were reluctant to accept aid or cooperate with the non-Garleans.

Apply the latter attitude to one or more of the remaining legions holed up Ilsabard's provinces and things are liable to not go swimmingly.

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

Thank you @thaliaksname from twitter for this wonderful template image. This seemed like a fun idea so I'm posting it here:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FV7tKY7W...jpg&name=large

Will post my filled out version later on, was wondering what others would do with it in the meantime :)

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Because I'm lazy, and also the lines aren't big enough for writing on them:

Estinien and Urianger, both five stars. They're the only two in this group willing to do what actually needs to be done even when your other anime trope companions cry about not hurting anyone or not wanting to see things from the bad guys' point of view. Urianger temporarily assisting Ardbert and Company without telling anyone is the only reason the first even survived. They both strike me as actual people, actual characters, capable of making tough choices and getting the job done. WoL feels the same way. The only two he can really trust to do the heavy lifting. Appreciates Estinien's brutal practicality and Urianger's wisdom.

G'raha Tia, three stars. He kind of also makes big sacrifices to do what needs to be done but he was a one note side character thrust into great importance out of nowhere and all the comedic relief nonsense with him is getting annoying. I like him more when he was just the mysterious Crystal Exarch. The moment his indentity was revealed he just became another quirky, playful anime cat boy. WoL doesn't hate him, but doesn't strictly like him either. He's kind of just another background Scion that's been made important because his friends are in management.

Ryne, dunno how many stars, three or four maybe: I've known you for a couple of months, during which your character completely changed. You then just kupo'd off to who knows where and never really get brought up again, same as Gaia, ANOTHER ASCIAN JUST FLOATING AROUND OUT THERE. WoL likes her because she did what she had to do and then stepped away to lead her own life. Something he wishes he could do. Mad respect to the kid and her ascian BFF for that. Said ascian BFF also helps remind the WoL that they ascians are people too, not just mask wearing villains.

Thancred, two stars: Clearly just the pretty poster boy of the scions. What does he even do anymore because convoluted sneaking missions literally anyone else could pull off better and more safely? Can't get over Minfilia and it's been causing problems for a long time. WoL liked Thancred back when he was outgoing and friendly. Now he just complains too much and tries too hard to relive his glory days. Usually has my back as a tank but distant other than that.

Krile is... krile, one star. I have no strong feelings for or against krile. Then again I also never did Eureka because I hated it so much, so maybe I'm missing something? Krile tries and isn't presumptuous or haughty, so WoL likes her a bit more than I do.

Tataru. She was going to be five stars because she knows her place and her strengths and leaned into them amazingly well. But when it came to light that she's actually been doing jack all and Ameliance (sp) has actually been helping to keep the scions afloat? Sorry, absolutely no respect for someone who hides that and takes credit for all of the hard work. WoL feels the same.

Every other person on the list, zero stars: I hate all of you, especially the twins. Y'shtola is an arrogant, abrasive kupo to the point of frustration and her multiple fake deaths have made me stop caring. The twins keep screwing things up over and over and over again and getting people killed or hurt because of their hubris and naivete. Minfilia is a self-absorbed, air headed fool that refuses to use link pearls because she's too much of a socialite to understand I have more important things to do than walk across an entire continent to exchange two sentences with her in person. Her inability to defend herself also means she had no place ever leading the scions. WoL feels the same as I stated, with a very strong and particular dislike for both Alphinaud and Minfilia. Y'shtola? WoL is sick and tired of her attitude. It gets old after a while. Alisaie is someone he'd want around walking through a dark alley at night but the kids really do need to be sent home and back to school. Why are these literal children fighting and being given any amount of grand company wide authority?

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Originally Posted by jameseoakes

Honestly at this point I really don't see how they can do a 'happy ending' for the Garleans there civilian population seems to have been functionally exterminated by Fandaniel so I'm not sure what they'll be salvaging out of Garlemald

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I'm already waiting for Garlemald Restoration in the next xpac. Crafters/gatherers gonna need another shortcut to get them selves shot through ShB/EW content faster. Plus, Ishgard was generally pretty well-regarded content.

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Originally Posted by Millybonk

• The mighty Zodiark, which has been build up as this mighty(evil) entity over several expansions, turns out to be nothing but filler trash for the first Endwalker trial
• The true cause of the Final Days is a pet-project from an ancient which goes mad after observing countless dead world and possibly causing the death of several world by projecting negative emotions unto them, and is thus dead-set on bringing despair to every world, upon which said ancient goes mad and is now letting her run her course to test humanity if they can withstand/fight despair
• Venat, who hasn't had her memory wiped + still remembers you from being in Elpis, quite apparently doesn't lift a finger to learn about Dynamis herself or to mobilize the other ancients to end Meteion then and there, and instead chooses to turn herself into Hydaelyn, sunder the world and the inhabitants, thereby forcing them to live with and face despair and gambling that their resilience against despair might be enough to face Meteion one day

Really?
This is the best SQ could do in terms of story after ShB?

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Can i point you, my friend, in the direction of every final fantasy game ever made.

Main baddy -> not the real endboss.
Real endboss -> introduced right at the end of the game.

You are welcome.

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Originally Posted by DixieBellOCE

Can i point you, my friend, in the direction of every final fantasy game ever made.

Main baddy -> not the real endboss.
Real endboss -> introduced right at the end of the game.

You are welcome.

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Except for FFII, FFV, FFVI, FFVII, FFVIII, FFX, FFXII, and FFXV. Even in games aside from these the confrontation against the built-up antagonists were not throwaway battles like in the case of Anima and to some degree Zodiark given the way in which his fight plays out.

Answer me this, because I'm growing more unsure and disappointed by the moment. That trial battle with "Zodiark" which wasn't even Zodiark but Fandaniel basically possessing him while he was still sundered and unfinished. Is that really it? Was that the only engagement with Zodiark we get? A fight that isn't even really Zodiark? It was the most underwhelming reveal of this ancient all powerful primal god I have ever seen in any story medium ever. Was that REALLY it? The end of the Zodiark arc? The main villain is really just some last minute Mass Effect 3 tier "Starchild" BS?

Furthermore, was Zodiark seriously only being contained by some shield that can apparently be taken down by anyone with enough aether to throw at it? By some technological weapon even the Garleans could have devised? Hell, at this point I think THAT would have been a better story. The Garleans discover this ancient primal god contained on the moon and in an attempt to destroy it, accidentally set Zodiark free thus beginning the final days or something like that.

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Originally Posted by Jagick

Answer me this, because I'm growing more unsure and disappointed by the moment. That trial battle with "Zodiark" which wasn't even Zodiark but Fandaniel basically possessing him while he was still sundered and unfinished. Is that really it? Was that the only engagement with Zodiark we get? A fight that isn't even really Zodiark? It was the most underwhelming reveal of this ancient all powerful primal god I have ever seen in any story medium ever. Was that REALLY it? The end of the Zodiark arc? The main villain is really just some last minute Mass Effect 3 tier "Starchild" BS?

Furthermore, was Zodiark seriously only being contained by some shield that can apparently be taken down by anyone with enough aether to throw at it? By some technological weapon even the Garleans could have devised? Hell, at this point I think THAT would have been a better story. The Garleans discover this ancient primal god contained on the moon and in an attempt to destroy it, accidentally set Zodiark free thus beginning the final days or something like that.

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Yes. Also you have indeed come up with a better way to handle Zodiark and the start of the final days than the MSQ.

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

Except for FFII, FFV, FFVI, FFVII, FFVIII, FFX, FFXII, and FFXV. Even in games aside from these the confrontation against the built-up antagonists were not throwaway battles like in the case of Anima and to some degree Zodiark given the way in which his fight plays out.

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Does Anima really even count as a "built-up" antagonist? The Scions are only told about him a few MSQs before the battle, and he's never considered anything but a tool for keeping the towers online.

Unless, of course, you're considering Varis part of "Anima's" buildup?

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Originally Posted by CrownySuccubus

Does Anima really even count as a "built-up" antagonist? The Scions are only told about him a few MSQs before the battle, and he's never considered anything but a tool for keeping the towers online.

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Anima is Varis. He has been part of the story since the ARR post patches.