I'm calling it the Epidemic. (This is a rant, if you dont wanna hear it, don't click)

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Originally Posted by Crysten

So basically, going into a high level, endgame duty with no hope of winning due to lack of party skill is absolutely fine, "so long as you're having fun ^_____________^"

I dunno about you, but my idea of fun is not being stuck in a duty I can't win. This attitude is exactly why we can't have nice things.

I don't understand, surely the point of a PVE game is to go into a duty with the intention of winning? If you party cannot win a fight and nobody wants to play to the required standard to beat said content, what in the hell are you doing in there? Sightseeing?

Like a man once said about a helicopter made of turds, this shit does not fly.

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oioioi , maybe u forgot that people want to try new stuff and have fun? try to rage harder pls ^^

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Originally Posted by akaneakki

Do you have ANY idea what people do on party finder? They ask for help. My friend was helping and he met a griup who couldnt even do it, yes they even had it on farm apperently in different group. But this one they all gathered in 1 group together and failed.
If this was so easy as you claim it is, how come you don't tell people on your own server to ask for help and ask their friend instead? Then you need to understand this is a MMO, where you want to meet new people and not everyone have friends who raid, much as I respect my friends who RP in the game. You make it sound like hes the bad guy or me. In fact this is the last time I will ever reply to you, because you have done nothing than being offensive towards everyone who disagree with you. Take care.

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bye ! good luck to you !

You know....when you go check a certain website...and put certain people's names there and check the results...

You will just find out that certain people tend to defend their own kind.



In other news:

http://2static2.fjcdn.com/comments/M...d8941b07d9.png

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Originally Posted by Khemorex

oioioi , maybe u forgot that people want to try new stuff and have fun? try to rage harder pls ^^

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GR8 B8 M8 RATE 8/8

A querulant (from the Latin querulus - "complaining") is a person who obsessively feels wronged, particularly about minor causes of action. In particular the term is used for those who repeatedly petition authorities or pursue legal actions based on manifestly unfounded grounds.

The Internet basicly :P

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Originally Posted by Crysten

GR8 B8 M8 RATE 8/8

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Great got nothing better to say i guess? ^^

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Originally Posted by Khemorex

Great got nothing better to say i guess? ^^

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Not too much, because you're either clearly trolling, or have a strange form of masochism.

If your idea of an evening of fun (*^^*) is to spend an evening with strangers in an A9S with terrible players making absolutely zero progress due to a low skill cap/unwillingless to admit shortcomings, then great, good for you.

Most normal people will be making productive use of their time, like doing these fights with newbies who actually give a shit.

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Originally Posted by Khemorex

Great got nothing better to say i guess? ^^

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Originally Posted by Khemorex

yes yes the world is going down omg :P everyone brace urselfs ^^P

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Originally Posted by Khemorex

oioioi , maybe u forgot that people want to try new stuff and have fun? try to rage harder pls ^^

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I'll give it 1 more try. Those guy wanted to farm, so don't speak for farmers. They are there to pick up loot not wipe. Dont make others choke on the things you call fun. You either troll or just have a strange way to have fun as in being wiped in game or not.

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Originally Posted by akaneakki

I'll give it 1 more try. Those guy wanted to farm, so don't speak for farmers. They are there to pick up loot not wipe. Dont make others choke on the things you call fun. You either troll or just have a strange way to have fun as in being wiped in game or not.

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Ignore them and go back to speaking with the adults in the room. They're an obvious troll.

Edit: This is a good time to remind everyone that there is an Ignore function on the forums. You'll never see their posts again. Use it.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

Ignore them and go back to speaking with the adults in the room. They're an obvious troll.

Edit: This is a good time to remind everyone that there is an Ignore function on the forums. You'll never see their posts again. Use it.

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Your edit should be a sticky

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Originally Posted by Kosmos992k

Also, I completely agree that anyone playing with 7 good players will complete content no matter what they do as long as they don't exhaust the patience of the other 7 players...lol. I was just thinking that if the game placed some level of entry requirement on these fights, it would be easier to ensure that anyone entering the actual content might at least have the potential ability to beat it..

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I'm so sorry for not replying to you, didn't mean to ignore you. However I agree, it would be cool if a dummy could. But like I said a9s doesn't even do any mechanic that forces massive moving or a lot of aoe going on. I would love an idea of dummy doing mechanics towards you and you take no damage because you have no healer or tank doing it for you there. Maybe a quest that you HAVE to do, where a npc tells you where hit next on the boss/add. If you don't do it correctly you are stuck there for good basicaly xD. But yes we do however need a more strict thing in the game and ''enforce'' players who want to raid or do extremes do better. I will say it again, nobody wants or expect people to play 100% godlike all the time, we expect you know what you are doing without telling people off when it's completely your own fault (not saying you btw, I'm just saying in general!). A parser would help but it would only do so so much, so adding a dummy, questline you have to do etc, would also help the playerbase. I believe that is also needed not only a parser, because a parser would only show how you or other players. Yes you can compare yourself to them too, but having a parser doesnt always mean people would use it. People can stay bad with or without one. So I would love to have both in game :). And I'm a ps4 player so yeah.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

Ignore them and go back to speaking with the adults in the room. They're an obvious troll.

Edit: This is a good time to remind everyone that there is an Ignore function on the forums. You'll never see their posts again. Use it.

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Yes sir!

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

Ignore them and go back to speaking with the adults in the room. They're an obvious troll.

Edit: This is a good time to remind everyone that there is an Ignore function on the forums. You'll never see their posts again. Use it.

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good Idea thank you!

also its funny that u talk about adults , when i see nothing more then rage and rants on this forums lately ^^

And its usually always the same people :P

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Originally Posted by akaneakki

I'll give it 1 more try. Those guy wanted to farm, so don't speak for farmers. They are there to pick up loot not wipe. Dont make others choke on the things you call fun. You either troll or just have a strange way to have fun as in being wiped in game or not.

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i really dont mind if people give constructive criticism , but the whole thing is really really out of bound already , theres some nice posts in this thread ^^, but u cant really blame SE for it , theres just to many different mentalities in here

IF theres wasnt other people in this game , you would not play it now , because it would have died off , like any other mmo in the market.

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Originally Posted by SenorPatty

Your edit should be a sticky

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yes its very adult behaviour to ignore anything u dont like :)

Shut it down, mods.

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Originally Posted by Khemorex

oioioi , maybe u forgot that people want to try new stuff and have fun? try to rage harder pls ^^

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I agree, there's nothing wrong with trying something new. For example if I step into any Savage Alex other than A1s (and possibly A2s, I can't remember if I ever tried it, I know I beat A1s though) I'll be trying something new. But if you wipe on the same mechanic all night long in the exact same way (let's say a night of playing is 3 hours), and it's not brought up (if someone knows the mechanic already), or working together to try and figure out the mechanics (assuming you don't wanna use a guide), then what's the point? Surely if you're trying something new you're wanting to try and also get your head round what you can?

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Originally Posted by Paladinleeds

I agree, there's nothing wrong with trying something new. For example if I step into any Savage Alex other than A1s (and possibly A2s, I can't remember if I ever tried it, I know I beat A1s though) I'll be trying something new. But if you wipe on the same mechanic all night long in the exact same way (let's say a night of playing is 3 hours), and it's not brought up (if someone knows the mechanic already), or working together to try and figure out the mechanics (assuming you don't wanna use a guide), then what's the point? Surely if you're trying something new you're wanting to try and also get your head round what you can?

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Rome wasnt built in one day ^^

I think everyone wants to improve in some way , some are slower some are faster . Some are more confident others not so much.
But my point is that people always tend to rage to quickly and being to harsh with words.

Im probably guilty of being to harsh to quickly to sometimes :P

(tho i wouldnt spend myself 3h in a PF group wich wipes in the exact same way ^^ . i mean its naturall to speak up , but most of the comments are just not really helpfull and plain and simple just a choleric comment, and its what is winding me up lately on the forums ^^,

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Originally Posted by Talraen

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Maybe I'm just a fool, but if a skill like Heavy Thrust says "increased potency from the flank", then I'll try to attack from the flank, even if it's PotD. You know, to memorize it.
DPS certainly have it easier to learn their jobs in PotD. Jobs like Summoner cannot be mastered in PotD, but even so, reading tooltips helps you understanding basic functions. Like playing DoTs on one enemy, using Bane to spread them, etc.
Heck, some straightfoward jobs like Dragoon are so easy to learn that you can figure out their rotations in PotD. Keep in mind that learning does not mean mastering.

As for tanks, even PotD can put you in situations in which you need to use defensive cooldowns - especially if your potions are on cooldown and you got no healer in your party.
Healers, however... they should at least be able to realize that doing DPS is the better alternative to jumping around when there is no need to heal.

I mean, it's not like I am expecting wonders, you know? Or is figuring these things out already beyond the average MMO player?

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Originally Posted by Kosmos992k

OK, here's a dumb question, the whole "Sky, Sea, Stone" thing was implemented to help players pre-test their ability for these fights to ensure they could do the level of DPS expected of their job, right?

OK then, why not make the completion of the relevant SSS within the time limit a requirement to enter each trial or raid that has a test in SSS? After all, we don't want to be feeding high level adventurers into a meat grinder they cannot survive, do we?

Obviously they need to ensure that the difficulty and time limit actually provide a challenge such that if you complete in time you are playing to 75%(?) or more of your potential damage output. That would force players entering Savage raids and EX trials to actually know how to play at that level - at least in SSS. If they fail during actual combat, at least you know they have the potential.

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Like Akaneakki said, A9S is literally a target dummy that procs. Have you done the normal mode perchance? The only different outside of moderate damage spike are two mechanics. One has aoe markers placed on the four DPS, thus necessitating they spread out. The other is having someone (usually ranged) pick up a new add called an Alarum, which they kite over to a safe spot and kill as the puddle it drops you'll be using to avoid Double Scrapline. Beyond those two mechanics, it's an incredibly streamlined fight people shouldn't need more than a few pulls to get the jitters out. Honestly, A9S works better than SSS because there are some mechanics to contend with. If you're seeing enrage with 15% echo, you have no business going into Savage. That isn't an elitist attitude, it's simply a waste of time on the veteran player's part. Could these players learn? Absolutely. But they need to practice in far easier content first.

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Originally Posted by Khemorex

oioioi , maybe u forgot that people want to try new stuff and have fun? try to rage harder pls ^^

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And they are perfectly entitled to "have fun." However, no one else is obligated to put up with it. You're essentially calling out akaneakki friend because he decided his time was more valuable than wiping with people who had no clue how to even play their jobs correctly. I would have bailed too. Why? I'll happily help people through content if there is reasonable exception of a clear. I won't stay in a party where it's hopeless and I'm just throwing away an hour because people want to goof off. They can do that on their own time.

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Originally Posted by SilkaN

I mean, it's not like I am expecting wonders, you know? Or is figuring these things out already beyond the average MMO player?

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I keep saying it, but the average MMO player CAN do these things you said. In fact they do so on a.. well sorta normal basis. I say sorta normal because they do the minimums required of them when they are in random groups. Group with these people as a peer, as a FC member and watch how miraculously they are doing everything right. Maybe not optimally but at least they're doing what you'd expect them to.

I've leveled up a few roles and jobs in the past month and I've seen a player who can't be arsed to not stand in damage telegraphs and spams like one ability, then turn around and swift cast rez someone and then start playing better when there's a possibility of a wipe.

My friends and I call it, "waking up."

I've also seen real newbies. Honest to god first time playing newbies. And they do exactly what you said. They put 2 and 2 together from their tooltips and make it work. They're not great. But they're doing good enough to make the run faster, and holding their own weight.

Its the 'veteran' players that slack. They know that the 'other guys' doing the stuff will be enough. So they do the very bare minimums.

Its kinda funny because some in this thread are suggesting SSS as a requirement. But it won't fix the issue. They'll do their best in SSS, pass it, and then slack when they do the content. Why not? Everyone else is givine 110% so it allows them to leech. When you allow a random AI determine your group for you, you get leeches. There's no accountability. That falls to us players to manage.

That's why vote kick is a thing. Don't even have to make a fuss over it. If you see someone leeching. Vote kick them. Don't say anything, just vote it. If the party came to the same conclusion you did, they're gone. If not. Well no one's gonna know who did it. Not even the person slacking. So no harm no foul. And if anyone in the group does know it was you and asks, just tell them you thought they were AFK.

I can see a reason for finding people leveling their characters without taking the care you could consider normal.

We are near an expansion and the goal for many players is reaching level 60 as soon as possible. You gain levels and exp much quicker than before. And you will have new abilities at top level. The gear you get becomes useless very quick since you level so quickly. This is not an excuse to not read the tooltips and a guide, just an explanation of our situation.

In ARR when I leveled the 1-50 dungeons were harder, you gained exp at a slower rate and you would have to run many times the same dungeons. You would be gearing up, doing your class and job quests, etc. There were very very frequent wipes in dungeons from Brayflox Longstop onwards, lots of people were leveling their first class and that was a very central part of the game. 50 was the level cap and learning to play your class at level 50 was the goal.

With Heavensward all the content level 50 and under was made quite easier and quick to do so that people reach Heavensward as soon as possible. The important thing was learning to play your class at level 60, there will be new abilities that change how you play the class and it is not so important to master the level 50 play since you'll have to learn a new one.

With Stormblood near, leveling up quickly is even easier, because the goal is reaching level 60 before the expansion, and gearing up your level 60 job. It is normal you find people that are leveling up and don't have for example at level 55 the gear most players had when Heavensward started and most people were still leveling at that level.

This is not an excuse for not reading the tooltips and not making an effort while playing with other players since it's not your time only you use, but other people's times. But an explanation of why now you meet much more undergeared people who have not learned to play their class in the leveling dungeons as you did before.

I've always found one of the biggest shortcomings of this game is while leveling a class/job you are just given new skills. Nowhere within these quests are you actually taught how to use said skills properly. I personally think it would be great if you got the new skill at the beginning of the quest and then the instance for that quest they make you use the skill so that you actually know how and why you are using it in the first place.

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Originally Posted by SilkaN

Maybe I'm just a fool, but if a skill like Heavy Thrust says "increased potency from the flank", then I'll try to attack from the flank, even if it's PotD. You know, to memorize it.
DPS certainly have it easier to learn their jobs in PotD. Jobs like Summoner cannot be mastered in PotD, but even so, reading tooltips helps you understanding basic functions. Like playing DoTs on one enemy, using Bane to spread them, etc.
Heck, some straightfoward jobs like Dragoon are so easy to learn that you can figure out their rotations in PotD. Keep in mind that learning does not mean mastering.

As for tanks, even PotD can put you in situations in which you need to use defensive cooldowns - especially if your potions are on cooldown and you got no healer in your party.
Healers, however... they should at least be able to realize that doing DPS is the better alternative to jumping around when there is no need to heal.

I mean, it's not like I am expecting wonders, you know? Or is figuring these things out already beyond the average MMO player?

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Smn can't do a proper rotation. .. dot dot dot oh it's dead.. potd is why I'm seeing more and more summoners spamming ruin 1 in aoe packs... that's all they get that's worth using on mobs that die fast. Same reason why drgs aren't using geirskogle. You can't keep botd up if you use the move. I've seen quite a few drgs in expert using botd and keeping it up but not using jumps or gskl.
Any lower potency move is garbage in potd.

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Originally Posted by caponesavage

I've always found one of the biggest shortcomings of this game is while leveling a class/job you are just given new skills. Nowhere within these quests are you actually taught how to use said skills properly. I personally think it would be great if you got the new skill at the beginning of the quest and then the instance for that quest they make you use the skill so that you actually know how and why you are using it in the first place.

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The closest thing we get to a skill description is Darkside lol, "Use it too much and you will succumb to it."