[Loremonger] 1.X Lominsan Story Arc

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Originally Posted by Mjollnir

I wonder how much of the story is different for the different regions, past small nuances of language. It's going to make theorycrafting a royal pain if the different clients relate the game events differently!

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Not much. Just in case, I've been going through different websites and blogs translating everything that came out vague into all four languages. For the most part, they're about the same. There's different turns of phrase and pop culture references, but overall it's the same - though, I have to say, English by far has the most flavor.

There are, as you say, a few occasions where it seems there were slip-ups, though. Also in Treasures of the Main, there's a scene at Oschon's Torch where, in an Echo, Travanchet and Emerick are responsible for the death of a few pullers at the lighthouse where they're having their meeting. When you come back from the Echo, Sisipu refers to the massacre at her home village of Brookhaven as the inspiration for why she's so afraid right now - but as far as I can tell, the attack on Brookhaven and the death of the Oschon's Torch pullers are entirely separate incidents. For instance, it is at Brookhaven that Sisipu sees the Sahagin (beastmen) talk to Emerick, and at Oschon's Torch we hear only of the Serpent Reavers blamed.

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Originally Posted by Mjollnir

Also, how can The Misery crew be under arrest when, at the end of the conversation, Sthalmann goes off to the battle at Seal Rock which The Misery used as a cover to escape with Emeric and the horn? Silly Frenchies.

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Well, it seems like he didn't end up with any useable evidence against anyone - but still, this whole thing eludes me. I'm going to pause my efforts and do the full functional transcripts of Legends Adrift and Never the Twain Shall Meet, instead, and hope I gain some insight.

If, by then, there are no answers, I'll sum it all up and start begging.

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#1 What is the setting of the Shapeless Melody Echo? (Whose ship in what year?)
It’s possible that we moved ships due to Rostnsthal’s memory. Hob’s ship and the Astalicia are the only two that look exactly like this in the game so far – is it one of these, or a third? Is it 1562 as Y'shtola is investigating, as it seems to be when Thancred is investigating Limsa?

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I think you mean When Thancred is investigating Ul'dah

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Originally Posted by HiirNoivl

I think you mean When Thancred is investigating Ul'dah

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Man, of the 50 times I type that correctly, the one time I save it is wrong. Curse you, Murphy! (But thank you, Hiir. There's going to be temporary mistakes and typos galore as I get this nonsense together, so I wholeheartedly encourage people to correct and question to their hearts' content. I'm sure I can pull a quote out if I was right all along :P)

Well there's definitely some inconsistencies. Caravallain doesn't wear an eye patch, nor does Hyllfyr. (regarding the one-eyed captain thing) It's strange that the French version outright names Caravallain though. I think he'd make more sense over Hyllfyr though as the latter seems to be trying to keep a low profile, while it's mentioned in the last Marauder quest that Rostnstahl finds this book that details Caravallain's dealings. I'm sure human smuggling could be among those things.

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Originally Posted by Orophin

Well there's definitely some inconsistencies. Caravallain doesn't wear an eye patch, nor does Hyllfyr. (regarding the one-eyed captain thing)

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At the very least, Hyllfyr's nickname is One-eyed Hyllfyr. He has both eyes, so I assume that he chose the nickname himself so a parallel would be drawn between him and the legendary pirate One-eyed Wylfred.

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Originally Posted by Orophin

It's strange that the French version outright names Caravallain though. I think he'd make more sense over Hyllfyr though as the latter seems to be trying to keep a low profile, while it's mentioned in the last Marauder quest that Rostnstahl finds this book that details Caravallain's dealings. I'm sure human smuggling could be among those things.

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You think that's confusing? In Legends Adrift, Sthalmann comes aboard the Astalicia and demands Carvallian... and then tells him he runs a strict ship. What? That's Hyllfyr's ship!

But then I checked the other languages... English is the only language in which Sthalmann says, "You run a strict ship, Captain" to Carvallian aboard the Astalicia. All three other languages simply say, "It seems the Astalicia requires very specific ettiquette."

There are most definitely some discrepancies between languages - I'm not sure if I'll be able to sort them all out. Once I have all four quests in the OP, if we still can't sort it out, I'll start begging for assistance. By that point, answering the questions should be as easy for someone at SE as just going, #1) Name #2) Yes #3) Plot Mechanism etc. etc.

In the meantime, I encourage any attempts to answer questions. I'll bring in quotes and different translations of anything anyone wants to get the gears grinding.

The unfortunate fact seems to be that during 1.X's early development, there was a crunch to get it done fast and not enough inter-communication synchrony; and it wasn't without a few casualties. The good news is that I'm a stubborn bastard - we'll get there.

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

Man, of the 50 times I type that correctly, the one time I save it is wrong. Curse you, Murphy! (But thank you, Hiir. There's going to be temporary mistakes and typos galore as I get this nonsense together, so I wholeheartedly encourage people to correct and question to their hearts' content. I'm sure I can pull a quote out if I was right all along :P)

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Thank you for giving me something to read. :)

It's a great story, it's a shame that we have to bust our rears to make hide-or-hair of it.

Someone mentioned that the "Twelve" maybe physical manifestations or even may actually BE the people from the Circle of Knowing. I think it's safe to say that at least they're Archons and are closely related. I think Y'shtola's efforts to get the key may have been connected to the release of the primals and the prohibition of their summoning. If it's true that they are closely related to the Twelve then they would have an interest in seeing that the Mother Crystal's aether wasn't consumed by other entities, seeing as summoning "the Twelve" to prevent Dalamud would have consumed as much.

Since they are essentially the "good Primals" (See Thancred's speech on "living on a prayer" about the similarities between the Twelve and the The Primals) and they have "Archons", I think it would be reasonable to speculate that the "Bad Primals" (Ifrit, et al.) would have Archon's (The Paragons) too. That the Primals were locked away and sealed by the Circle of Knowing probably might be an interesting theory too, but I don't really know much about that.

Hydalyn's awakening of the echo would be an appropriate response to a watershed moment that involves her very life. Awakening the Echo may have been an act of self preservation because it basically helped prevent the Circle of Knowing as well as the Ascian's (or their pawns) from fighting directly since you manage to screw over both their plans (Gridania is still a bit shadowy) in all three cities.

As a result, the calling of Dalamud by the Darnus may be an Ascian plot to get rid of The Player specifically and they almost succeed were it not for Louisoux's contingency plan. If Y'shtola time warped to 5 years later in her quest to oppose the Ascian's again, it's likely that she'll be looking specifically for you...

And it's also likely that the Ascian's will be looking for you too.

I'm looking forward to the special cutscene that all the players brought forward will receive.

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

At the very least, Hyllfyr's nickname is One-eyed Hyllfyr. He has both eyes, so I assume that he chose the nickname himself so a parallel would be drawn between him and the legendary pirate One-eyed Wylfred.

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Aside from the laboured point that obviously Hyllfyr is Sthalmann at this point (ok, I'll let it go), I'm tending toward the other possibility that, although Hyllfyr has two good eyes, one of them has the power to bring about Ifrit's Hellfire move. That would explain why in Captain's Orders, the camera zooms in on his one eye and everyone cowers in fear; though he then relaxes and walks off without nuking the ship. And that's how he got his name. No, it's fine, don't thank me.

(I'm still subscribing to my piracy conspiracy until we get an explanation of why Sthalmann is in the opening LL cutscene)

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Originally Posted by Anonymoose

You think that's confusing? In Legends Adrift, Sthalmann comes aboard the Astalicia and demands Carvallian... and then tells him he runs a strict ship. What? That's Hyllfyr's ship!

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I took that to mean he was talking about The Misery, it was just that they happened to be on the Astalicia as that's the place everyone goes to hang out.

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Originally Posted by Ankou

Regarding you theory on this. I have been thinking, just how the Primals you meet always tell you not to summon the others.

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I've always felt that the Primals telling you not to summon other Primals was the same as why the Circle of Knowing tells you not to summon them. It eats aether, which is apparently somewhat of a finite resource though some can be returned to the planet, which is why Hydalyn isn't totally wasted in ARR.

Primals want to have all that power to themselves so they can stay in the world. The Circle of Knowing appears to care about the planet too but they also would not like to see more primals summoned.

Regarding the Ascian, Travenchet, he doesn't appear to be entirely of this world either, considering that light appears to pass right through him instead of creating a shadow behind. Perhaps Primals and Ascians have a shared story and origin.

It's just that in the Limsa storyline, it's the only time where we really get to see them so it's hard to say anything about them.

The Echo-giver on the other hand, snatches you out of your ordinary life, appears to deliberately put you in places to prevent the Twain from ever Meeting. I don't think Y'shtola was looking to find the shadowless associate to share pleasantries.

I'm sure a war between those two probably would have been some bad news.

Lastly,

Because I feel that the Ascians and the Primals are related, and that the breaking of the seal to release the primals corresponds to the opening of some sort of Hell's Gate that looks nothing like a shower, I tend to agree that Travanchet is related to the starshower, that he came in through it/rode in on it. I don't think he's the only one that did either.

We'll be seeing a lot of new content related to the Ascians. I look forward to diving into a dungeon full of them. The sword of light (Grand Companies brought up with the help of the Circle of Knowing) and the sword of might (Imperials brought up with the help of Hmmm... ????) fighting over who does what with the Primals sounds like we'll have a lot of fun.

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Originally Posted by HiirNoivl

Lastly,

Because I feel that the Ascians and the Primals are related, and that the breaking of the seal to release the primals corresponds to the opening of some sort of Hell's Gate that looks nothing like a shower, I tend to agree that Travanchet is related to the starshower, that he came in through it/rode in on it. I don't think he's the only one that did either.

We'll be seeing a lot of new content related to the Ascians. I look forward to diving into a dungeon full of them. The sword of light (Grand Companies brought up with the help of the Circle of Knowing) and the sword of might (Imperials brought up with the help of Hmmm... ????) fighting over who does what with the Primals sounds like we'll have a lot of fun.

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Yes... This.

Emperor Solus and his mighty armada of magitek technology didn't just develop that power overnight (literally) without some "divine" help... (darn it, there was a very long thread about this last Fall).

At one point, we speculated that he may have been connected to Odin somehow...or could even BE Odin in disguise (especially since in mythology the real Odin had a wolf and raven always at his side...and the Generals that Emperor Solus sent to Eorzea are the Wolf and the Raven... strange innit?).

And yes, I agree that The Ascians will be interesting to watch... I've been too curious about Travanchet not to watch how his unfolds