i'm sick and tired of the excuse for not having unique or varied jobs

At this point I don't even want them to implement, say, PUP as I know it'll be a massive disappointment.

I completely agree with the OP.

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Originally Posted by Jaquan

No it's not however you do misunderstand how Meta works or chose to misrepresent it. Low to mid end players don't actively read the data - they just see the absolutes. Let's hypothetically assume that Summoner isn't considered a Meta Job due to lesser power compared to Black Mage and Red Mage as far as speed is concerned. It would be ni surprise that most PF would simply soft ban Summoner regardless of how good the person playing it is on the basis of "Not risking it" even if the actual difference would be miniscule. When imbalance and Meta start taking root you'll basically soft lock half of the jobs from content.

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low to mid tier players literally don't care about meta unless there's a competitive reason to. so unless you're going for speed kills, or things on the website that shall not be named. you'd literally not care about stats as long as the job is fun.

also for the love of god not every PF is gonna softban SMN for dealing 5% less DPS than a BLM. it doesn't happen now and only happened recently cause of the MASSIVE gap in DPS between PLD and DRK/GNB. hell it even had a small gap between it and WAR who was also quite low. when you have that massive amount of a DPS disparity without the high end players being able to match even middle end players of other jobs in the role. thats not the jobs fault or the players fault. it's balancing issues stop blaming the players and the job itself because it was balanced poorly. literally just some damage number changes and PLD is back to being in good standing DPS wise. wow amazing that huh?

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Originally Posted by Saraide

It happened in this tier a little bit with paladin early on.

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which only lasted like 2 weeks and PLDs were still getting clears so once again this whole point is moot. also it wasn't the players or jobs fault, it was the fact it was balanced extremely poorly. nobody would've looked at that paladin DPS and gone ok ship it compared to every other tank. so much so that even high end PLD players would still risk being lower than middle tier DRK/GNB players thats not a good gap in DPS. regardless of how simple or complex kits are

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Originally Posted by pikalovr

low to mid tier players literally don't care about meta unless there's a competitive reason to. so unless you're going for speed kills, or things on the website that shall not be named. you'd literally not care about stats as long as the job is fun.

also for the love of god not every PF is gonna softban SMN for dealing 5% less DPS than a BLM. it doesn't happen now and only happened recently cause of the MASSIVE gap in DPS between PLD and DRK/GNB. hell it even had a small gap between it and WAR who was also quite low. when you have that massive amount of a DPS disparity without the high end players being able to match even middle end players of other jobs in the role. thats not the jobs fault or the players fault. it's balancing issues stop blaming the players and the job itself because it was balanced poorly. literally just some damage number changes and PLD is back to being in good standing DPS wise. wow amazing that huh?



which only lasted like 2 weeks and PLDs were still getting clears so once again this whole point is moot. also it wasn't the players or jobs fault, it was the fact it was balanced extremely poorly. nobody would've looked at that paladin DPS and gone ok ship it compared to every other tank. so much so that even high end PLD players would still risk being lower than middle tier DRK/GNB players thats not a good gap in DPS. regardless of how simple or complex kits are

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Congrats, you have correctly analyzed the current situation. This will likely not hold up when job balance is given up for uniqueness.

Go back to WoW if you hate FF14 jobs so much. Unique and varied jobs will only lead to imbalance between jobs. It's the compromise that they have struck and for most players it's working very well. All jobs are viable. And if it takes just a bit of homogenization then I'm all for it. Besides, the jobs all play very differently from each other right now. The only commonality is the shared role actions.

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Originally Posted by Saraide

Congrats, you have correctly analyzed the current situation. This will likely not hold up when job balance is given up for uniqueness.

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oh no we can't have unique jobs and balance oh god oh shi oh duck. it's not like we already have RPGs that do exactly that. but no never thats heresy and impossible

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Originally Posted by pikalovr

low to mid tier players literally don't care about meta unless there's a competitive reason to. so unless you're going for speed kills, or things on the website that shall not be named. you'd literally not care about stats as long as the job is fun.

also for the love of god not every PF is gonna softban SMN for dealing 5% less DPS than a BLM. it doesn't happen now and only happened recently cause of the MASSIVE gap in DPS between PLD and DRK/GNB. hell it even had a small gap between it and WAR who was also quite low. when you have that massive amount of a DPS disparity without the high end players being able to match even middle end players of other jobs in the role. thats not the jobs fault or the players fault. it's balancing issues stop blaming the players and the job itself because it was balanced poorly. literally just some damage number changes and PLD is back to being in good standing DPS wise. wow amazing that huh?

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We must have gotten wildly different MMO experiences because I've seen the exact opposite. Higher end players were less restrictive of Meta as they could read it better and had better grasp at the situation. It's usually low and mid level players that deviate from it less. Ultimately min maxing is part of gamers nature and takes precedence over even freedom to expression.

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Originally Posted by pikalovr

oh no we can't have unique jobs and balance oh god oh shi oh duck. it's not like we already have RPGs that do exactly that. but no never thats heresy and impossible

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I think we can have unique jobs, we just shouldnt give up job balance to achieve that. Is that way harder than neglecting one for the other? Yea sure, but this is not some small indie dev we are talking about. Excellence should be expected from this game.

i keep all my jobs capped and geared up just so i go with any jobs they need for a party,or even a crafting party at fc house.

If we are this worried about balance then why stick to the mmo triangle of tank>healer>dps?

*scratches chin curiously*

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Originally Posted by Kranel_San

Even though I actually dislike homogenizing the jobs. I realize there is no escaping either it or favoritism. One is sacrificed for the other.
We either have unique jobs but with favourism
Or
Have homogenized jobs but content is accessed for everyone.

Speaking of balancing. I have been thinking for a while about the potential of AI in balancing jobs. What if companies developed AI enough for it to be utilized in balancing. Might it be the beginning of finally having nearly perfectly balanced jobs while maintaining a unique design?

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I say this but forgot to add.
If SE wants to give us an excuse as to why not, then please follow that excuse no matter how ridiculous it is!
You can't take away job identity and complexity because it causes favourism and encourages people to go for metas but give us a shit of a job balance in PvP. That's not how it works!

This message is especially for you, YoshiP.